MF30 power beyond return line help?

[Leylands]

Massey Ferguson MF30, no backhoe (has loader, PTO and 3 point). I’m looking to tap into my loaders power beyond port, to run 2 or possibly 3 rear remotes, using the power beyond port which the manual identifies as for backhoe hydraulics. However I am unclear on where my return line from new rear remote spool valve is to be plumbed back into the tank? The manual shows a check valve required on the return to tank line from backhoe, no problem, and it shows the return line not being tee into the loader return line to tank, so where does this return line from backhoe supposed to tie back into the loaders hydraulic tank?

I noticed a port on top of loader frame/tank on passenger side, below floor board, where frame extends back to the rear axle, (behind the tire), might this be for backhoe return line to tank? not sure if that is actually the tank or just a structural member of frame

 

[WranglerX]

I should think...Normally the return line after the added valve would be same location as it is now, you simply connect (in series) new valve "P" port (power) to existing valve PB port (power beyond) and new valve BP port to existing tank location ...Be sure return port has proper "plug" in to allow power beyond port to function properly...
Just because it is designated in manual as for "backhoe" does not mean it can not be for anything else (like maybe log splitter).... Hydraulic are hydraulics no matter what name is on valve... In reality any open loop system is one big series loop with any number of valves in loop between pump and tank...

 

[Leylands]

I completely agree and understand what you are saying, hydraulics/valves can be used to control many different cylinders. I plan to run a hydraulic top link on 3 point, and have one or two spare remotes for a snowblower chute rotation, and possibly also a chute deflector in future. I plan to make this power beyond circuit with quick couplers so it can be quickly unplugged from the rear valves and plugged into each other to complete the circuit in event of leaks/issues so loader, making tractor and loader still usable without rear remotes, this option also allows for direct connection of log splitter without need for detent valve or having to bungee strap a valve open in the cab to get fluid to my log splitter.
I just wish I knew where/how backhoe return was tied back to tank from factory as this might be my simplest way rather than to tee back in at loader port. Its a tight spot and not easily accessible with cab on tractor

 

[ericm979]

The PB port of your new valve would connect to the PB line leaving the loader valve. The new valve is inserted in line, not tee'd in. You can tee the tank port of the new valve into the tank line going from the loader to the tank.

 

[WranglerX]

The PB port of your new valve would connect to the PB line leaving the loader valve. The new valve is inserted in line, not tee'd in. You can tee the tank port of the new valve into the tank line going from the loader to the tank.

Umm .. In a series system "PB" (out) port of preceding valve goes to "P" (in) port of next valve body.... Last valve "PB" port goes to tank if not a "tank" line (T) on valve....

Dale

 

[Leylands]

Thanks for the comments and support everyone, great feedback on my hydraulics. I don’t think I was clear on what I need help with.
Can anyone confirm “where the factory backhoe units return to tank hydraulic hose connects to on an MF30 loader/reservoir?” I think it gets plumbed to the rear axle support as per attached but would like to confirm

And secondly, Unfortunately my tractor has a cab on it, so I can not see the identification plate on the back side of my Parker Hannifin loader Valve. In order for my local dealer or hydraulic shop to get me the plug, and power beyond adapter for the PB hose connection, Does anyone have an MF30 and could post a picture of the plate? Or advise to the information contained on their name plate? perhaps others have done this change and know the part numbers I need?

 

[ericm979]

Umm .. In a series system "PB" (out) port of preceding valve goes to "P" (in) port of next valve body.... Last valve "PB" port goes to tank if not a "tank" line (T) on valve....

Dale

That's what I said, though in a possibly confusing way. The PB out of the loader goes to the new valve (into the P port as you noted). The new valve's PB goes into the line that was connected to the loader's PB port. You're just inserting the new valve into the chain.

For the OP, there should be seven ports on the loader valve. Four go to the loader. One is P (input) from the pump. The other two are PB and Tank. PB will go back to where the BH gets plugged in. Tank will go to the transmission somewhere.

 

[Leylands]

View attachment 688636View attachment 688636

 

[LD1]

I cannot answer the specific question regarding IF that is where the backhoe returned to tank or not.

But it does not matter where you TEE or return to tank at....as long as it IS the tank. Whatever is the easiest place to return it where the hoses dont get in the way of anything else.

On modern tractors with loaders.....typically the loader valve already has the power beyond plug....as the power beyond out of the loader is what feeds the 3-point hitch. Not sure on the older industrial loader/backhoe tractors. Sometimes they had separate pumps....1 for loader and 1 for backhoe.

How is your 3PH powered?

 

[Leylands]

I cannot answer the specific question regarding IF that is where the backhoe returned to tank or not.

But it does not matter where you TEE or return to tank at....as long as it IS the tank. Whatever is the easiest place to return it where the hoses dont get in the way of anything else.

On modern tractors with loaders.....typically the loader valve already has the power beyond plug....as the power beyond out of the loader is what feeds the 3-point hitch. Not sure on the older industrial loader/backhoe tractors. Sometimes they had separate pumps....1 for loader and 1 for backhoe.

How is your 3PH powered?

My old MF30 tractor has 3 independent hydraulic systems. 1 is for power steering, it’s own pump which runs off the fan belt, and controls one cylinder for steering assist. 2. The transmission/rear end internal hydraulic pump located under the seat. This is 6gpm, and powers my 3 point hitch, and had options for use with other valves with the right adapters/selecter lever. And the 3rd system is the loader/backhoe system, which has another pump running off front of the crank shaft, and the loader frame is the reservoir. This system was used for power beyond if option with backhoe was selected when ordered. I dont backhoe so my power beyond on loader control valve is plugged/configured for loader only with no power beyond at the moment. I will use this power beyond for my rear remotes once configured correctly.

after some more digging I spoke with a dealer who was able to advise of the part numbers and even helped me locate the parts I need. The diagram I sketched above is correct, the rear support on loader frame is part of the tank and has a 1” PT plug on top which gets removed for the return to tank hose, when using a second valve in chain. This requires a check valve due to location at bottom of tank. the Parker Hannifin loader valve has a 1/2”PT allen head plug, part number 70917970 (crossed referenced in MF system as PN 356035x1). And gets installed below plug # 73 on exploded valve diagram, per the manuals instructions when using power beyond. Lastly, the power beyond “adapter”, is part number 366851x91, which allows for the hose connection into the bottom power beyond port once the plug is removed, (plug #79 on exploded diagram). Agco/MF have discontinued the adapter, however based on photo from dealer, it appears like it might simply be an adapter for different pipe thread/size of the hose end, allowing for the hose to thread into the loader valve.

although this is an old tractor, I hope this information helps others in the future. Thanks everyone on TBN for your assistance