Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders

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   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #351  
Let's see if we can get this back on subject.
How often in these mass shootings have the following thing(s) happened:

1 - The shooter has had or has mental issues that other people were aware of, yet did nothing about it
2 - The shooter bought the weapons and lied when filling out the Form 4473
3 - The shooter bought the weapons legally because he'd never been adjudicated as being mentally incompetent
4 - The shooter obtained the weapons illegally, either stealing them or getting them through a straw buyer
5 - If the shooter lived after the shooting, it was determined that they were mentally incompetent to stand trial

I would not be against requiring all firearm sales (public and private) to be run through a Federal Firearms Licensed dealer but reasonable fees should be established to keep some dealers from gouging the public For my personal and financial well being, every firearm I sell is done this way and the buyer pays the fee.
This would also have to be accompanied with a way for mental institutions and professionals to have a database that would be linked to the FBI NICS so that the sale would/could be stopped during the telephone check. For all of the Libs that start screaming about personal freedoms over reporting this, the government already has a huge amount of your personal data, ask me how I know.
I'm not sure of other states, but here in Kentucky, if you've got a Concealed Carry Deadly Weapons (CCDW) license, the state police run you through the national databases twice a year to see if you've done something somewhere else or something that you didn't report and if they find something, then you loose your permit. (I know that concealed permits don't cover firearms that are bought over the counter)
Existing laws on violent and firearms related crimes would also need to be enforced to the letter of the law. No more plea deals, if a gun is used in the commission of a crime, you get time tacked on, serve it all, no probation or parole. If you're found to be mentally incompetent, then you're sent off to a mental facility and once they say your cured, do your time.
This won't stop the killings, stupidity ain't got no basement, there will always be somebody wanting to stoop a little lower and somebody that just doesn't care. Will this fill up the prisons? I doubt it, because while these mass shooting become world news almost instantly now, you have to admit that it's not a frequent thing (and I agree that even one is too many)
Right now everybody's running on their emotions and that's not what you need when you want to pass reasonable, actionable laws.
One of the stupidest comments I've ever heard was from Representative John Yarmouth who said that he was going to legislate for more gun control laws and admitted that "while they probably won't do any good, we've got to do something."

I know I've gone on and on on this thread, but just for everyone's information, I don't even own any of those "evil black rapid firing assault rifles with the high capacity clips". I do own a few firearms and me personally, I'm just fine with a ten round magazine limit, but that's me. I also like Kubota tractors and other people don't, that's just my choice. But the AWB didn't work last time and if it's reinstated, it won't work this time, so why repeat something we know won't work? And even if we did get rid of all the "high capacity" magazines, working on my county public school math, 3 ten rounders work out to the same as 1 twenty round magazine and magazines can be swapped out in a matter of seconds with a little practice.

Just my 2 cents worth, though with inflation, it's really my nickels worth.
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #352  
I expect most of the weapons would come from the US Military in various ways, actually...other nations may support a revolution in various ways...but not because they support the revolutionaries...but because they want to destabilize the existing government.

Your racist remarks ("white guys only"...) are pretty despicable and I'm surprised a liberal like yourself would bring up race.

The only countries that would support your revolution are those who would want to take the USA down. Little hard to imagine how they could do it anyways as almost every major port is either in a blue state or a heavily urbanized blue part of a red state.

Check our slash pine's thinly veiled comments about "recent" immigrants (read brown people) being the political problem for the right wing as the basis of my sarcastic white guys comment. Funny you failed to see his remarks as racist but picked right up on the sarcasm in mine. (Warning, more sarcasm)
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #353  
Quote Originally Posted by dgoyette View Post
When I earn just a livable wage and pay 19% federal tax and people making millions are paying 12% something is WRONG!


Flat tax?
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #354  
Let's see if we can get this back on subject.
How often in these mass shootings have the following thing(s) happened:

1 - The shooter has had or has mental issues that other people were aware of, yet did nothing about it
2 - The shooter bought the weapons and lied when filling out the Form 4473
3 - The shooter bought the weapons legally because he'd never been adjudicated as being mentally incompetent
4 - The shooter obtained the weapons illegally, either stealing them or getting them through a straw buyer
5 - If the shooter lived after the shooting, it was determined that they were mentally incompetent to stand trial

I would not be against requiring all firearm sales (public and private) to be run through a Federal Firearms Licensed dealer but reasonable fees should be established to keep some dealers from gouging the public For my personal and financial well being, every firearm I sell is done this way and the buyer pays the fee.
This would also have to be accompanied with a way for mental institutions and professionals to have a database that would be linked to the FBI NICS so that the sale would/could be stopped during the telephone check. For all of the Libs that start screaming about personal freedoms over reporting this, the government already has a huge amount of your personal data, ask me how I know.
I'm not sure of other states, but here in Kentucky, if you've got a Concealed Carry Deadly Weapons (CCDW) license, the state police run you through the national databases twice a year to see if you've done something somewhere else or something that you didn't report and if they find something, then you loose your permit. (I know that concealed permits don't cover firearms that are bought over the counter)
Existing laws on violent and firearms related crimes would also need to be enforced to the letter of the law. No more plea deals, if a gun is used in the commission of a crime, you get time tacked on, serve it all, no probation or parole. If you're found to be mentally incompetent, then you're sent off to a mental facility and once they say your cured, do your time.
This won't stop the killings, stupidity ain't got no basement, there will always be somebody wanting to stoop a little lower and somebody that just doesn't care. Will this fill up the prisons? I doubt it, because while these mass shooting become world news almost instantly now, you have to admit that it's not a frequent thing (and I agree that even one is too many)
Right now everybody's running on their emotions and that's not what you need when you want to pass reasonable, actionable laws.
One of the stupidest comments I've ever heard was from Representative John Yarmouth who said that he was going to legislate for more gun control laws and admitted that "while they probably won't do any good, we've got to do something."

I know I've gone on and on on this thread, but just for everyone's information, I don't even own any of those "evil black rapid firing assault rifles with the high capacity clips". I do own a few firearms and me personally, I'm just fine with a ten round magazine limit, but that's me. I also like Kubota tractors and other people don't, that's just my choice. But the AWB didn't work last time and if it's reinstated, it won't work this time, so why repeat something we know won't work? And even if we did get rid of all the "high capacity" magazines, working on my county public school math, 3 ten rounders work out to the same as 1 twenty round magazine and magazines can be swapped out in a matter of seconds with a little practice.

Just my 2 cents worth, though with inflation, it's really my nickels worth.

I'd call your proposal a good start. I suspect the NRA would not like it as they have fought all sorts of attempts to make this type of data sharing on gun owners illegal.
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #355  
Quote Originally Posted by dgoyette View Post
When I earn just a livable wage and pay 19% federal tax and people making millions are paying 12% something is WRONG!

Flat tax?

Fine with me so long as it is progressive and includes capital gains and inheritance.
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #356  
Quote Originally Posted by dgoyette View Post
When I earn just a livable wage and pay 19% federal tax and people making millions are paying 12% something is WRONG!



Flat tax?

We can only dream. To get rid of a tax code the average american cannot possible understand or keep up with the changes should be priority. It takes dedicated Tax Accountants just to make sense of it all.
The reason why we won't see this is congress has too much self interest in using the tax code to manipulate and control.

My favorite:

Abolish income tax and have all tax collected on sales. The average american would save thousands. Why you ask?

1. EVERYONE would pay their fair share. Drug dealers, prostitutes, under the table workers, no screwy deductions meant for the wealthy...
2. Most merchants already have a system in place for collecting and reporting sales tax. The methods and technology are already here.
3. Everyone pays a proportionate amount based on how lavishly they live. If I can only afford a $1,500 hooptie of a car I pay a proportionate amount and the guy Buying his 2nd Mercedes or Yacht pays more.
4. If the economy does well, the government revenue does well. It gives a direct incentive for the government to ensure the people are doing well.
5. The rate would be fairly low compared to the income tax rates, because everyone is paying their share instead of the middle class hard worker being the main source of IRS revenue.

Probably other benefits I am not thinking of...but I can't think of too many disadvantages. Grocery store food, of course, remains tax free to minimize the impact on the elderly on fixed incomes.
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #357  
That's what was so funny, so many Republicans are so out of touch with the fact that things have already changed. ***** should not have been able to win this election with the shape the country is in. I do think he got some slack from voters because he inherited the mess, but still with the economy still so poor the Republican Party should have easily won the office.

Time to wake up and start being more reasonable. The Republican party is destroying itself. If we go over the fiscal cliff the Majority of Americans, (including me) will blame our own Party. Boehner gave the Republican party yet another black eye by proposing a tax reform bill that not even his own party would support. That is pretty petty and shows unwillingness to work with others. In two years the house is up. Wake up. If Republicans don't get more tolerant and more willing to work with others (and actually doing it not just saying it) it will be a Democratic president, house, and senate. Then you will see bills and legislation fly through. And not legislation you will like I suspect.

I am thinking of becoming an independent because the Republican party is getting more and more out of touch.

I think you're on to something here dgoyette.

I've read 36 pages of this tripe, and it has made it painfully clear to me why this country is in such a state. The more I read from the Democrips and Rebloodlicans here, the more I start to think that Ole Jesse Ventura might be on to something as well.

Jesse Ventura: Politicians Are like Criminal Gang Members - YouTube
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #358  
george washington.jpg
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #359  
No doubt on the out of control spending. We need cuts and lots of them. They must be thoughtful ensure our elderly and legitimately disabled are not impacted. Smaller government socially also should mean smaller government militarily. Not less advanced just smaller and keep our troops out of countries we don't belong in. How much has the misguided Iraq war cost? The estimate is 4 Trillion which we will be paying decades for.

If our president was a dictator as you suggest we would not be having this conversation, and the plan B, well not even the Republican Party supported that plan proposed by Boehner. It was not a genuine offer, he knew (and everyone knew) that it would fail.

And yes that is some magical trick for the president to fight so hard to keep taxes low for People under $200K. This crazy magician who is looking out for the middle class with his voodo, and letting us keep more of our earnings during tough times. Well you get my sarcasm :). I say it that way because I genuinely believe in this aspect. You do realize we have a tiered tax code and everyone including the rich get the benefits of the lower tax rate he is proposing right? It's just that when you make so much money the tax breaks on the low end of earnings that mean so much to you and I, aren't even material to them.

When I earn just a livable wage and pay 19% federal tax and people making millions are paying 12% something is WRONG!


debt.jpg
I realize this is oversimplifing, but we could tax everyone in the country 100% and we would still be in debt.
I like the idea of abolishing income tax and raising sales tax, but I think it would encourage more cash deals and "under the table" sales.
 
   / Outrage after NY paper publishes names of gun permit holders #360  
You could start by slashing that gigantic defense budget... no need for such a big military with all that firepower in the hands of citizens

The US defense budget is less than the various entitlement programs. US defense spending is 24% of the budget but include 3% for Veteran programs and another 1% for foreign service expenses for US embassies, economic and military assistance. To put it another way 20% of the US budget goes directly to defense. In comparison, Social Security, Medicare and other retirement programs are 36% of the budget. Social programs, Medicaid, food stamps, temporary assistance, etc is 25%. Defense, Social Security and Social programs are the three biggest costs of the US budget. Interest payments on the debt are 6% but this is going to grow greatly when interest rates go up.

These percentages are based on the 2010 budget. The IRS used to publish a nice pie chart showing US spending in the tax instructions but I could not find the same chart for 2011 or 2012. Other information on the web for 2011 and 2012 is close to the 2010 numbers.

Later,
Dan
 
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