Power beyond modification for ease of use

   #1  

homesteader13

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North West Montana Northern Rockies
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Massey Ferguson 1755M. John Deere 420-c
Has anybody tried setting up their power beyond with diverter valves, probably ball valves, so you don't have to plug and unplug your backhoe and plug the loop back in every time you want to switch between the loader/driving and backhoe? It's a project I am going to tackle, probably over the winter between snowblowing. Just thought I would see if anybody had already done it and save me some engineering time.

My particular aplication is on a Massey 1755D, but im sure most other brands and models are going to be bery similar.
 
   #2  

lennyzx11

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Not the answer but here’s some related (kinda) information.

I used a 4 spool valve from surplus center when I set up my rear remotes. I changed one of the spools to a detented one that the handle stays in place up or down with off in center like normal.
It has the power beyond plug inserted in the appropriate port.

I plug my backhoe (bush hog 850 now, woods 750 before) into that remote and move that lever one way and that powers the backhoe.

One minor inconvenience is that as long as that lever is on, nothing else hydraulic on the tractor works (loader, 3 point, HST, etc.) I believe that is because the remote feeding the backhoe is return back to tank and the backhoe valve has no power beyond. I just reach over and move it off to the normal centered position for normal tractor use and turn it “on” when using the backhoe.

I don’t have to insert a bypass hose in any of the remotes at any time.

I “think” I set mine up as the flow goes from pump>remote valve>loader valve>3 point.
Not really planned but just convenient for plumbing.

I also have a diverter valve on the curl circuit that operates my grapple with the joystick just like curling the bucket when the button is depressed.

Kubota L3301 with HST.
All works as expected.
 
   #3  

ptsg

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2017 Branson F36Rn (3515R)
Has anybody tried setting up their power beyond with diverter valves, probably ball valves, so you don't have to plug and unplug your backhoe and plug the loop back in every time you want to switch between the loader/driving and backhoe? It's a project I am going to tackle, probably over the winter between snowblowing. Just thought I would see if anybody had already done it and save me some engineering time.

My particular aplication is on a Massey 1755D, but im sure most other brands and models are going to be bery similar.

Unless I'm missing something, you don't need to unhook the backhoe to use the loader, unless you're actually taking the backhoe off the tractor. Something is not plumbed quite right.
 
   #4  

DL Meisen

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Unless I'm missing something, you don't need to unhook the backhoe to use the loader, unless you're actually taking the backhoe off the tractor. Something is not plumbed quite right.

Agree with above post...

Back hoe valves should be open center and hoe should not need to be disconnected and looped at any time .... Sort of sounds like someone has got the plumbing a bit wrong.... OR maybe wrong type valve for hoe...

Only time looping hose or bypass valve need to be in place is if you want to remove hoe off the tractor...

Dale
 
  
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#5  
OP
H

homesteader13

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North West Montana Northern Rockies
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Massey Ferguson 1755M. John Deere 420-c
Unless I'm missing something, you don't need to unhook the backhoe to use the loader, unless you're actually taking the backhoe off the tractor. Something is not plumbed quite right.
"Agree with above post...

Back hoe valves should be open center and hoe should not need to be disconnected and looped at any time .... Sort of sounds like someone has got the plumbing a bit wrong.... OR maybe wrong type valve for hoe...

Only time looping hose or bypass valve need to be in place is if you want to remove hoe off the tractor..."



This is how Massey sets up their power beyond, my 1742 was identical to my 1755. I included some pictures for clarification.
So the backhoe lines plug into the pressure and return ports. If you want to drive the tractor or use the loader you have to discontect the hoe lines and plug the PBY line back into the pressure port making a return loop essentially. When Massey installed the backhoe and power beyond, they placed two warning labels on the tractor specifying that if it wasn't put into loop while operating tractor that catastrophic failure would occure, one on the rear window above the ports and another on the windshield above the dash.
Talked to the service manager about it and it has to do with the was the power beyond plumbs into the trans.

What I was wanting to do to save time (and constant mess from hydraulic fluid from conecting and disconnecting) is put in a series of valves that will accomplish the same task as connecting and disconnecting the lines.
View attachment 669239View attachment 669240
 
  
  • Thread Starter
#6  
OP
H

homesteader13

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Second pic 20200910_124258.jpg
 
   #7  

ptsg

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I think there was some misinformation or confusion along the way.

With the backhoe attached, and lines connected to the backhoe, you can still drive the tractor and use the loader just fine.

Once you take the backhoe off the tractor, is when you have to close the circuit again by connecting the PB hose to the P port at the back of the tractor. So the fluid will then feed the 3 pt valve, remotes and back to the tank (transmission).

The only thing in common between the hydrostatic transmission and the loader/3pt/remotes/backoe hydraulics, is the fluid. They share the same fluid which is stored in the transmission (acting as a tank). Other than that, it's two completely separated systems.

Edit: only one pic loaded up.
 
   #8  

Rock Crawler

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Has anybody tried setting up their power beyond with diverter valves, probably ball valves, so you don't have to plug and unplug your backhoe and plug the loop back in every time you want to switch between the loader/driving and backhoe? It's a project I am going to tackle, probably over the winter between snowblowing. Just thought I would see if anybody had already done it and save me some engineering time.

My particular aplication is on a Massey 1755D, but im sure most other brands and models are going to be bery similar.

I'm still missing something here? When I drop the backhoe, I disconnect the couple feet long power beyond hose, I pull forward and situate the hoe for storage, kill tractor, stroke the loader lever around to dump pressure ad spend about 3.5 seconds looping the PB hose down to the power feed fitting right beside it.

Going to backhoe I back near it, kill tractor, stroke valve, spend 3.5 seconds pulling the PB off of the power feed fitting and jam into backhoe, spend 3.5 seconds running backhoe return line to tractor power feed. Start tractor and adjust/connect.

So you want to spend time and money to eliminate the simple 3.5 second quick connect use?

It just does not seem like something that merits that must interest....? Am I missing something?

The hose connection is the easiest part of the backhoe on/off. What I dislike is that the 3-point arms have to be removed while on my old BX25D you simply folded them up against the seat back and installed the backhoe. On the bigger B2650/B3350 they made it more time consuming and greasy to deal with.
 
   #9  

DL Meisen

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I'm still missing something here? When I drop the backhoe, I disconnect the couple feet long power beyond hose, I pull forward and situate the hoe for storage, kill tractor, stroke the loader lever around to dump pressure ad spend about 3.5 seconds looping the PB hose down to the power feed fitting right beside it.

Going to backhoe I back near it, kill tractor, stroke valve, spend 3.5 seconds pulling the PB off of the power feed fitting and jam into backhoe, spend 3.5 seconds running backhoe return line to tractor power feed. Start tractor and adjust/connect.

So you want to spend time and money to eliminate the simple 3.5 second quick connect use?

It just does not seem like something that merits that must interest....? Am I missing something?

The hose connection is the easiest part of the backhoe on/off. What I dislike is that the 3-point arms have to be removed while on my old BX25D you simply folded them up against the seat back and installed the backhoe. On the bigger B2650/B3350 they made it more time consuming and greasy to deal with.

I get the impression the OP has a problem with hose connections from "PB" port of FEL to "P" port of the BH valve and the "PB" port of BH to "P" port of 3PH. and is trying to just "loop out" (bypass) the BH valve with bypass valve .... Looping out BH seems to be only way he can get his 3PH to work....

Two scenarios come to mind, BH has closed center valve which makes it wrong type valve configuration or the "P" port and "PB" ports are reversed in the way BH valve is plumbed IF THAT IS EVEN POSSIBLE...

Dale
 
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#10  
OP
H

homesteader13

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North West Montana Northern Rockies
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Massey Ferguson 1755M. John Deere 420-c
I think maybe didn't accurately clarify what I was trying to do, and why. I'll add some further info.

The bypass I'm envisioning (hydraulic rated ball valve or something similar) is for when the backhoe is still connected to the tractor.
What I want to do is essentially be able to dig with the backhoe, jump in the cab, drive the tractor and use the loader to move dirt and get back on the backhoe and dig some more holes. That's the scenario in a pretty package so to speak.

The problem is this....
The Agco tech, service manager and the afixed warning labels are telling me that when you are using the power beyond, whether for a hoe, log splitter, ect that you have to disconnect the attachment and loop it back before you can use the loader or drive the tractor (except for creeping forward IE digging a ditch.
That is a huge pain in the **s when you are doing a job that requires using the hoe and loader back and forth.

Because of this i was thinking making a circuit with tees and valves to switch back and forth without having to turn off, relieve pressure, disconnect, reconnect over and over in a day.

Had I known this was how it operated before I bought the tractor, and hoe and frame and power beyond, I would have stuck with the tractor as an ag tractor and purchased a used actual backhoe for the same money.

OR..... is there something that I am missing or have been completely missinformed on?
Any Massey owners or techs that might be able to chime in on this to?

I have searched online, but have not found an answer to what I was told either way.
 
 
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