TODAY'S GUN TIME

   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,781  
AAAARRRRGGGGHHHHH!!!!! I had my new POF Revolution AR-308 let me down tonight for the first time. It's been flawless up until now. It failed to extract right in the heat of battle when I was calling coyotes. Try as I might, I could not get the round extracted so I could give a finishing shot to a coyote I popped. Maybe one of you AR guru's can tell me what to look at. But first, let me share all of tonights excitement.

The rancher has been getting hit hard with coyotes killing their angora goats. So, I have a few days free after my cataract surgery and headed down to thin the pigs and coyotes at the 2700 acre lease in the TX hill country. I popped 3 pigs yesterday and a coon last night with the same rifle.

Today, I scouted a couple of good "stands" for hunting coyotes tonight. I started at the first stand at 7:30pm, 30 minutes after solid dark. I'm using my AR-308 with my thermal scope and I sit under/against a couple of shrubs growing up at the base of a pond dam (stock tank for you fellow Texans) and had my game call set up about 60 yards away (Foxpro Shockwave with a woodpecker decoy). Things started slow, no sooner had I settled in, then the herd of cattle decided it was drink time. It took them about 45 minutes to get their fill, they left and I got to work.

I started my FoxCast sequence, but no action. I hadn't heard any coyotes yipping yet, so figured it was still early. I gave a good pause, then started again. Part way through the call sequence, in swoops an owl and yanks the decoy off the caller and gives it a good thrashing on the ground before he/she realizes it isn't edible. It leaves the decoy in shreds and flies to the top of a nearby dead tree. I can see it with the thermal and I'm convinced it's settled in to watch this idiot for the night.

I hit another sequence and I hear some coyotes yip and howl. But they're in the "bull pasture" that's on the back side of the tank dam I'm sitting against. Just to be sure, I keep scanning at the opposite end of the tank dam, just in case the coyotes decide to come all that distance and come around the far end of the dam. About the 4-5 time scanning the end of the dam, I catch the slightest glimpse of something through the thermal. It turns out it's a coyote walking along the top of the dam and walking right towards me. I get the rifle up, safety off and wait to get a clear shot through the mesquite growing on the dam. It walks into a clearing and I pop it. It yelps/howls/ cries and falls down the backside of the earthen dam. I spring from my cover, scramble up through the prickly pear/turkey pear growing on the dam and get to the top of the dam. It's pitch black, so I can only see with the thermal binoculars or scope. I see the coyote 20' below me trying to clamber to it's feet. I've hit the rear abdomen/hip as it was quartering towards me, with the first shot. He's still yelping, so I raise the gun to finish it and....

The first shot failed to extract, so I drop the mag, grab the charging handle and rack it hard. It still fails to grab and extract the spent case, so I rack it again, slamming it into battery as hard as I can, smack the forward assist, still fails to grab the case. I try again and again. I pull the rear tackdown pin, pop it open, but I can't get my knife on the case lip. Slamming the AR hard on the buttstock to see if the case might pop loose isn't an option with a $4K thermal scope mounted, so my options spent.

By this time, the crippled coyote has clawed his way further away through the prickly and turkey pear, beyond the distance I'm willing to go to bash him with a tree limb in the pitch dark. I'll go out at first light and see if he died or is laid up nearby.

Anyway, what's up with the AR not grabbing that case rim? I would have thought slamming it into battery would have allowed the extractor to get over the rim, so I could have got the case out.
Was this a reload? What does the rim look like? Is the extractor in good condition? Extractor spring present and not broken? Do you shoot much suppressed? If yes, when was the last time you cleaned the chamber?

I really like the APEG stock because it includes a rod to get you out of such situations. AR's as a general rule run out of options very quickly when you get something stuck in the chamber.
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,782  
It sounds like either the rim of the cartridge case is done, or your extractor is done.
Get a cleaning rod and pop the the cartridge case out of the camber from the muzzle end, if you havent done so already.

Take a good look at your extractor, and the extractor spring. Make sure there is not junk or buildup in the extractor groove or lodged in the spring area if nothing seems broken.
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,783  
Was this a reload? What does the rim look like? Is the extractor in good condition? Extractor spring present and not broken? Do you shoot much suppressed? If yes, when was the last time you cleaned the chamber?

I really like the APEG stock because it includes a rod to get you out of such situations. AR's as a general rule run out of options very quickly when you get something stuck in the chamber.
New factory Norma ammo. The case looks fine. I'm pulling the BCG apart right now. I actually have an identical upper to compare the BCG etc. The bolt is a bit tighter to slide /rotate in the bolt carrier of the one that jammed. Even when it's perfectly clean. Maybe that's part of the issue. The extractors look the same and the ejectors feel the same.

The second one has significantly more rounds, but I don't see any glaring issues with either, other than dirty, but not excessively so. Yes, I shoot suppressed, probably just a cleaning issue, but both uppers don't have more than about 100 rds through them. Anyway, I cleaned both really well with what I have on hand and we'll try again for yotes tonight.

Carrying a rod would be nice, but not practical with my setup. I might devise a small tool to help pull a stuck case out, that I can store in the grip. It just needs to be something thin and stiff enough to hook the case rim.

The ironic thing is that every time I step away from my tried and proved Tikka T3x 6.5CM that I used to use as my dedicated thermal night gun, I find myself second guessing my choices. Thankfully I've never parted with it and it's still in my safe.

Like my daughter says (my night hunting partner), "It's not like we're going to get a ton of shots at things when stalking at night, so we're better off with the surgical precision and no BS of the Tikka." With 5 round box mags and the continuous receiver top with a pic rail for mounting the thermal, it really is a slick night rig. Boy is it accurate too!
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,784  
For easy-to-carry, use about a 6-8 inch or so brass rod of slightly under bore diameter. Dropping it into the muzzle will often knock out a case. Shake the rifle vertically to tap-tap-tap it out if needed.

For 30 cal+ , I've seen surplus segmented cleaning rods with about 6 inch sections. Also easy to carry.

Bruce
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,785  
Your daughter is spot on! I'd be using the Tikka too. :giggle:

But, I'd take your AR out today, before trusting it during the hunt, and pop a few rounds. See how it cycles (or doesn't cycle).
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,786  
Here's what my google-fu turned up for a stuck case, if you don't have a rod handy. A paint can opener! Brilliant!!
Stuck case tool.jpg
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,787  
New factory Norma ammo. The case looks fine. I'm pulling the BCG apart right now. I actually have an identical upper to compare the BCG etc. The bolt is a bit tighter to slide /rotate in the bolt carrier of the one that jammed. Even when it's perfectly clean. Maybe that's part of the issue. The extractors look the same and the ejectors feel the same.

The second one has significantly more rounds, but I don't see any glaring issues with either, other than dirty, but not excessively so. Yes, I shoot suppressed, probably just a cleaning issue, but both uppers don't have more than about 100 rds through them. Anyway, I cleaned both really well with what I have on hand and we'll try again for yotes tonight.

Carrying a rod would be nice, but not practical with my setup. I might devise a small tool to help pull a stuck case out, that I can store in the grip. It just needs to be something thin and stiff enough to hook the case rim.

The ironic thing is that every time I step away from my tried and proved Tikka T3x 6.5CM that I used to use as my dedicated thermal night gun, I find myself second guessing my choices. Thankfully I've never parted with it and it's still in my safe.

Like my daughter says (my night hunting partner), "It's not like we're going to get a ton of shots at things when stalking at night, so we're better off with the surgical precision and no BS of the Tikka." With 5 round box mags and the continuous receiver top with a pic rail for mounting the thermal, it really is a slick night rig. Boy is it accurate too!
Yeah, suppressed in a gasser you can build a lot of carbon in the chamber, I’d give it some Hopps or whatever flavor you choose and see if that helps. Case gauge might be interesting.

Your daughter sounds like a smart cookie, good job dad.

The APEG has an integral rod. Not sure what stock your using but if it’s collapsible the APEG might be worth looking at. No affiliation with LT.
696D2874-6B35-46B0-9163-9007711C2C30.jpeg
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,788  
Here's what my google-fu turned up for a stuck case, if you don't have a rod handy. A paint can opener! Brilliant!!
View attachment 784036
I would not stick that in a POF or any AR I spent more than a few hundred bucks for. Maybe I’m to snobby, but I like the battle warn look not the abused one.
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,789  
I would not stick that in a POF or any AR I spent more than a few hundred bucks for. Maybe I’m to snobby, but I like the battle warn look not the abused one.
You're just using it to grab the case rim. You could wrap the shaft with electrical tape and just leave the very end bare, so it's non-marring. It's not like you use it every shot, in fact you hope you never use it. But it's simple to pack in my stalking vest and would have saved me from the "game over" scenario I had last night.
 
   / TODAY'S GUN TIME #11,790  
My AR was jamming rounds before I did a little barrel ramp work. The left side wasn't working right. Where it was cut into the chamber area was too small and jammed the round so hard it bent the casings. I was having a hard time getting those out. It took me a while to figure out what was going on until I noticed the scratch on the round. You might be able to see the scratches on the right two rounds if you enlarge the picture. It jammed every other shot.

Bullet-3 Extra.jpg
 
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