What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles

   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles #1  

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My first "What a Week" post concerned troubles with our Branson (see This Link). At the same time that was going on, we were trying to buy the PT-425 that Moss Road spent too much of our money on. In the process we had to deal with miscommunications, missing long distance service, missing checks, snipers, closed motels, monumental traffic jams, bad weather, and really embarassing failures to think--and in the end we managed to set it on fire.

When I first contacted Power Trac, I was surprised to learn that the PT-425 was out of stock and the next production run would be a total of 12 units. Not exactly a high volume operation it seemed. Not only that, but only five were left for sale. The others already had deposits on them.

Unwilling to risk not being able to get a unit from the next run, we decided on a sight unseen purchase. We arranged with Scott of Power Trac to take delivery at the factory on Friday the 27th. We would drive up Thursday night, and Power Trac would put us up at the local motel. Scott warned me to be sure to arrive before 10 PM or call if we were going to be late.

Scott faxed us a contract. I signed it and tried to fax it back. That's when I found out that we had no outgoing long distance. We had changed our phone system to ISDN and received new numbers. Somehow our long distance carrier had failed to switch our service even though we had notified them. We never noticed since we use cell phones for long distance almost exclusively. If not for the new fax machine, we would probably still not know.

So mumbling apologies to Scott for saying we would fax it right away, we put the signed contract and a deposit check in the mail on the 18th.

The next Tuesday I called Power Trac to make sure they had our check in hand. Not yet they said. I called again on Wednesday, and again on Thursday morning, but still no check. I was getting increasingly concerned that someone else would get "our" PT-425 as they expected the entire run to be subscribed to right away. Still, Scott continued to talk as if the lack of a deposit had no bearing on our order.

Finally on Thurdsay afternoon, shortly before we were due to leave for Tazewell, I discovered the check had been cashed. I called Scott again. That's when I found out he thought I had been calling about a check for the balance, not the deposit. It was all a mixup, and everything was set. I was relieved to say the least. It only lasted a couple of minutes though.

The Mistress of the Mower arrived from work. As we were about to jump in the truck, she remarked on the 6x10 cargo trailer I had hooked to the rear. "It won't fit," she said.

Of course it would fit. I patiently explained how the PT was only 45 inches wide and 90 inches long, and how it would fit in a 10 foot long trailer without a problem.

"It's too high," she said.

Nonsense. Power Tracs are low things; height couldn't possibly be a problem.

"What about the canopy thing?" she said. ROPS wasn't part of her vocabulary yet.

I told her it wasn't all that high and wouldn't be a problem.

"It looks high," she said.

I was beginning to get a little niggling feeling in the back of my neck. I measured the rear doors' vertical clearance at 65 inches. Let's see, M.R. says he stands schnozz high to his ROPS. If I remember right, he said we was 6'2" or so. Uh oh, Tazewell, we have a problem.

So I called Scott yet again. He was probably cringing every time he found me on the other end of the line. We jointly decide that the ROPS would be removed for the trip back. With that issue resolved, we finally got started for Tazewell--and ran smack into snarled traffic even before we got to Knoxville. After crawling along for several miles, we broke free of that traffic jam only to run into another one as we got to the edge of Knoxville. We managed to detour around that one on the back roads.

As we wended our way around Knoxville's backsides, the Mistress of the Mower tells me of radio reports of a sniper shooting at people on I-40 in the Cocke County area the night before. One driver had been killed and a passenger in another vehicle seriously injured. This was not good. We had to pass right through that area, not only on the way up, but also on the way back, and that was likely to be at night when the shootings had taken place. A lousy weather report that predicted a storm moving through the entire Appalachian chain didn't help either.

We pressed on toward Tazewell with a stop for a tasty dinner in Lebanon, VA. We arrived at the motel in Tazewell at 8:45 PM, well ahead of Scott's 10:00 witching hour.

The motel was closed. 9:00 AM to 8:00 PM said the sign. Well, we had been waiting for the next hammer to drop. After hesitating, and not knowing for sure just who we were going to get, I called the 'In Case of Emergency' number in the window. Actually, I tried to get the Mistress of the Mower to call, but that didn't quite work out. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

The number turned out to be the home of the owners, one of whom came out and gave us a room. We turned in, glad the day was over.

We arrived at the Power Trac facility Friday morning under threatening skies. We were anxious to complete the purchase and load up for the return trip. On the way in, we noticed a new building. We found out that it is indeed a new Power Trac facility. Among other things, it will house the front office, sales staff, and will include a complete showroom.

After introductions, we toured the plant and met our PT-425. I drove it around the floor a little bit, but declined Scott's repeated offers to go out to the test area and play with all the PT toys. It wasn't that I didn't want to, but the idea of loading up in the rain didn't appeal to me one bit--not to mention the Cocke County sniper that for all we knew was still out there. I wanted to be past that area well before dark.

As it turned out, the training that we took from Terry Estep as part of the two percent discount deal didn't take as long as we expected. The Power Trac folks helped us load up. We put the PT-425 in the trailer. The light materials bucket, forks, and custom attachment plate went underneath the lift arms. The ROPS went in on its side, L shaped at the rear of the trailer.

We loaded the 48" mower sideways into the back of my Tacoma. It just fit. We said good bye to the Power Trac folks and departed much earlier than we anticipated. Our new goal became getting past Knoxville before the traffic jams started.

We made it almost all the way through the city before I-40 ground to a halt. Fortunately, we were able to get off of the interstate immediately and use back roads to get around all the snarled traffic. Later we heard an airborne traffic reporter saying that Knoxville traffic that afternoon was the worst he had ever seen, with virtually all routes at a standstill, and that included the back roads we had used an hour earlier.

A little while later, the news reported the Cocke County sniper had been caught about the time we passed back through the area. It was 13 and 15 year old stepbrothers, and they had fired at an estimated 25 vehicles. Under Tennessee law they can't be held beyond the age of 19. I predict that will change. Too tired to do much that evening, we left everything loaded up until the next morning.

Unloading the trailer Saturday morning was pretty uneventful, and we managed to bolt the ROPS on without difficulty. We had expected it to be a problem due to weight, but it is a lot lighter than it looks.

Getting the mower out of the truck proved more troublesome. The truck has a canopy which is essentially a permanent addition. I tried using the forks, but the only pallet we had handy didn't fit them.

Finally, the Mistress of the Mower suggested just pulling it out to the tailgate, turning it from its sideways position, and simply picking it up with the PT-425's Quick Attach. Why didn't I think of that? /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

We gassed her up and drove around for awhile, trying to get used to the machine. It is quite different than anything either of us is used to. Once we felt confident enough, we hooked up the mower and practiced on the lawn area. There is no way we are going to mow anywhere near our Xmas trees until we are at least competent with the machine. Grass will grow back, Xmas trees won't.

During one of my turns, a rattling sound was bothering me, so I pulled onto the concrete and started examining the Quick Attach area. When I turned back and looked at the rest of the machine, I was stunned to see smoke rolling out of the engine hood. Our new PT-425 was on fire.

I yanked open the hood and discovered the entire back end of the machine was packed with dry grass. Some of the grass on the muffler was on fire. I brushed it away and hollered for water. Fortunately, there was no damage, and the water was not needed.

The dry grass was mulched clippings left over from the last mowing with our lawn tractor. Apparently the PT's mower had sucked them up out of the front lawn. We spent another couple of hours mowing and did not have the problem again, so we don't think it is going to be a continuing issue.

But we'll watch out, just in case.

SnowRidge
 
   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles
  • Thread Starter
#2  
Checking the quality of the cut after mowing.

SnowRidge
 

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   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles
  • Thread Starter
#3  
Re: What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 First Impressions

They say that the only thing that will survive a nuclear war is the cockroach. 'They' are wrong. There will be Power Tracs too.

H*ll-for-stout is the best description I can think of. Thick steel plate seems to be the favorite material of the PT-425's designer. Even the engine hood is a heavy steel weldment.

PTs are clearly hand built. This is no automated production line product, and as such, individual machines can have their own problems, as opposed to mass produced items which tend to share problems.

While I assume jigs are used when the assemblies are welded, the first problem we encountered is probably unique to our machine. One of the tubes that houses the PTO hoses was welded slightly out of position. This causes the attachment's hydraulic hose fitting to interfere with a cross bar on the lift arm. Due to this, it is difficult to connect and disconnect the hose. Scott even had a problem when he was showing us how to do it at the factory.

It will probably be easy to take care of. The hose fittings are locked into the tubes with top mounted set screws. These tend to point the fittings downwards. The tubes are much larger than the hoses, so it should be no problem to insert a shim under the problem fitting in order to raise its 'point of aim.' That should eliminate the interference.

The steering via hydraulic articulation is different than anything either of us is used to. The steering is very slow. It requires a lot of cranking on the steering wheel to make a turn. It is also very easy to overshoot your turn and then in turn overcorrect. A lot of weaving is the result, and practice is definitely required. It quickly became apparent why people put spinner knobs on these machines.

I take it on faith that the Power Trac designers have tried other steering ratios and found the present setup to be the best compromise.

The steering wheel itself is another matter. It is small in diameter and small in section. It is made of hard unforgiving plastic. The best overall term I can use to describe it is 'unacceptable.' A more accurate term would require language not suitable for TBN.

Both of us drive the PT the same way. We put both feet on the treadle. This means the only way we can brace ourselves for the dips and bumps is to hang onto the wheel. Neither one of us has big hands, but both of us were quickly complaining about the wheel. It is actually painful to hang onto after awhile.

The steering wheel is also unusual in my experience in the way it mounts. It is held onto the steering shaft by a roll pin instead of a nut in the center of the hub. This may make it difficult to replace, which is my early intention.

One last point about the steering. The steering shaft is slightly loose in the nylon bushing that protrudes through the top of the console. There is noticeable play. In fact, while it may only be my imagination, it seems like the play increased slightly in the 3.6 hours we ran the machine. This area requires more investigation.

The engine is a Kohler Command Pro 25. It starts up easily, but seems to run lean. It tends to backfire when it is shut down. I suspect this is due to meeting emission requirements, especially those of the California Air Resources Board (CARB) which the engine meets, whether you live in California or not.

The operator's console is neatly laid out and nicely marked. The steering wheel is slightly to the left, presumably to accommodate the joystick.

The parking brake works by locking two of the wheels. It is more like the park position of an automatic transmission than a brake. The wheels can either turn or not. There is no in between. It works fine, but the handle is stiff to operate. It may just be too tight on our example.

The hydraulics work fine. The joystick is good sized and is very crisp. Float locks nicely. PTO engagement is by a weather protected toggle switch. It also provides the only starter interlock. Surprisingly, there is no treadle interlock.

Two work lights are mounted on the outside corners of the console. They are controlled by another weather protected toggle switch. They will not work with the ignition off, thereby protecting the owners from themselves. Personally, I would rather have the ability to flatten my own battery, thank you. There may be some day when I need those lights and the ignition off.

We cut the entire lawn area in about three hours, which is somewhat faster than we could do it with our old lawn tractor. We expect to be much faster with practice. The mower gives a nice cut, and we are quite pleased with it. The hydraulic motor is tiny compared to our expectations. There is one belt which the little motor uses to drive the three blades.

The mower is fairly quite except for an occasional clanking. This is either coming from the Quick Attach plate or the mower articulation setup. It does not detract from the mower's performance, but does take some getting used to. We will experiment with the lift arm's tilt setting to see if we can find a quiet position.

Cleaning the mower deck after use is a joy. See the attachment.

The Quick Attach system works like a charm. When I first started looking at Power Tracs, I thought the hydraulic attachment locking system was an extravagance and unneeded froufrou on a work machine. After all, it would only take a few seconds to dismount and throw a manual locking lever. Plus, you have to dismount for PTO powered attachments anyway.

But later I learned that the Quick Attach hydraulics also provide an auxiliary hydraulic function for those implements that need them--sort of a set of front remotes. It's a good idea.

The seat is comfortable and seems to have a good adjustment range. The seat belt, however, is absurdly long. It might work out though. The seat belt on our Branson is absurdly short. I sense a switch coming up.

All in all, we are pleased with our purchase. We think it will do exactly what we want it to do. There are some rough edges that need attention, but they are not totally unexpected.

And most important of all, the Mistress of the Mower really likes it. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Please keep in mind these are first impressions and may well change. We'll keep everyone posted. After all, Moss Road will want to know how well he spent our money.

SnowRidge
 

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   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles #4  
Re: What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 First Impressions

Hey Snowridge -

Truly a fun and excellent, detailed post - I about fell over laughing a couple of times! Great detail, and a real sense of what your experiences were in picking up the PT and then using it for the first time. I appreciate it, and am looking forward to my own delivery, which is scheduled right before the holiday - yes, MossRoad spent way too much of everyone's money. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Great pictures - we need more!

Thanks for the free entertainment. And keep us up-to-date with all your new adventures!

-Rob /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles #5  
<font color="blue"> As it turned out, the training that we took from Terry Estep as part of the two percent discount deal didn't take as long as we expected. </font>

For those of us who are not able to take the training, would you be so kind as to tell us what is taught in this course? Any special secrets or caveats? Are there important things that I should really know about my machine? I'd really encourage you to do a write-up, I'm sure others would LOVE to hear what Terry teaches.

Sincerely,

Rob
 
   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles #6  
Re: What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 First Impressions

Snowridge,

Great to hear about your new PT425. You will like the PT more every day. Tell us about those new hydraulic wheel motors. (manuf info etc). They are suppose to be higher torque units. Enjoy!.

Duane
 
   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles
  • Thread Starter
#7  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( For those of us who are not able to take the training, would you be so kind as to tell us what is taught in this course? Any special secrets or caveats? Are there important things that I should really know about my machine? I'd really encourage you to do a write-up, I'm sure others would LOVE to hear what Terry teaches. )</font>

I'll give it a shot later. It will take a bit of time to try and write it up properly.

SnowRidge
 
   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles
  • Thread Starter
#8  
Re: What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 First Impressions

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Tell us about those new hydraulic wheel motors. (manuf info etc). They are suppose to be higher torque units. )</font>

There is no visible manufacturer info. It may be there if I pull a wheel or motor, but that's not something I'm ready to do at this time.

There's an interesting aside, though. There has been a fair bit of speculation on TBN on how much speed was traded for the higher torque. I put the question to several people at Power Trac, both before and during our visit. To a person, they all seemed puzzled by the question. Either Scott or Terry, I forget exactly who, said he thought the top speed might be a little higher now. I guess the new motors must be a higher efficiency design.

Not having any point of reference, we can't tell anything by operating ours. I guess we'll just have to arrange for a drag race. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

SnowRidge
 
   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles #9  
Re: What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 First Impressions

Loved your story so far. I called last Monday to put in a deposit for an August delivery and Christy told me she would put my name first on the list for the July run but she said she didn't need any money yet for that shipment. She also mentioned that there could be some slight changes for the better that would be reflected in the price in that run but think that is probably a pretty standard disclaimer on their part. Anxious to hear more stories and experinces so keep the stories coming. I still have my concerns for power in the dirt moving dept. so if you get a chance to use the bucket, tell us what you think and diddos for the new hydralic wheel motors.
Good luck
Rick
 
   / What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 Foibles #10  
Re: What A Week Pt. II -- PT-425 First Impressions

Snowridge:
You're having altogether too much fun.
But, if you're like most of us with PTs, you'll find yourself grinning each time you find how well the little beggar works. Even more each time you're asked: "What is that thing, anyway?"
 

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