XR4150H Engine Failure

[TimberFarm]

I hope this works out. I don't think I would ever trust a dealer to rebuild an engine this day and age. Even 40 years ago, everybody always knew to take an engine to specific machine shops where they had the reputation for doing things right and nowhere else.
Today's mechanics are just parts changers. They have no troubleshooting skills. Even if the dealer was putting in a complete crate motor, they would mess something up.
Keep after them until it is "right".

 

[TexasRust]

Contacted the dealer this morning and described what I'm hearing to the management level. After listening to the engine for themselves, they agree that one cylinder isn't firing. Their ordering another injector to replace the "free" one they pulled from a warranty engine.
This is pretty frustrating. Why can't people do their jobs without having their arms twisted.

 

[JohnT3383]

There is a 90 day warranty on either the short block or a complete engine. If they would have given a couple of years of warranty on the full engine, it might have been worth the extra money.

TR,
Sorry to hear about all your troubles (the entire forum makes me worry every time I look at my low-hour XG3140, but so far so good for me.
I'm posting because your issues remind me of non-LS maintenance issues I've had going back to the early '90s with more than one brand of vehicle, but an '87 F150 and a '98 Windstar particularly.
My view as a result has become that techs these days aren't trained to think past the codes, and if the codes are inadequate or misleading, the diagnosis will likely lead to blind parts replacement that the Navy calls easter-egging: irrelevant in a :cost-no-object, taxpayer pays the bills, DoD hides the waste world,' but painful to those of us who pay as we go.
Good luck!

 

[GS650GL]

There are injector tests that the dealer can do with the laptop computer service tool if they have it. All the larger dealers have it, some small dealers do not. There is also an air purge procedure that can be done with the service tool to force air from the fuel rail. The engine can run fine at higher rpm's, but have a rough idle or surging at idle, and the air purge will sometimes fix it. If they didn't do the purge after having the fuel system apart to replace the injectors, they should do it. It was a common problem on the XR4100 series for the engine wire harness to rub through against a bracket where it goes over the top of the radiator. It is the harness that goes from the ECU to the injectors and sensors. Wires rubbed there will cause fault codes and rough running. They would have had to move that harness to take the engine out. Just my opinion, but I would think a shop could resurface the crankshaft and put in new bearings and connecting rod cheaper than putting in a short block, but I'm old school (diesel mechanic for 40 years) so labor rates these days maybe don't make that cost effective.

 

[TexasRust]

Ya, when I taught electronics trouble shooting for a system, I told the customers that they should replace a board unless they could show me the specific pin on the specific chip that was not toggling when the proper inputs were satisfied.
The dealer told me about all the computer and injector diagnostic tools they have. Obviously, their not putting these tools to much use.
As for new verses rebuild, the cost of labor a parts makes it pretty much the same price in the end. At this point, the more the dealer has to put together, the more I worry. I'm sure a good mechanic could have done it for about he same price.
I'm currently asking my neighbors for recommendations for competent diesel mechanics in the central Texas area. I got complacent after yearly 20 years fixing everything on my old Kubota L245DT. The XR4150H is more difficult for me to work on even with an electronic version of the shop manual. Hopefully, I'll eventually get the tractor back and find a competent mechanic.

 

[TexasRust]

The tractor’s finally back. Runs smooth and has plenty of torque again. Two and a half months for the rebuild and another month and a half to get all the injectors replaced. I appreciate that they were trying to save me some money, but I would not replace a single injector. When one’s bad, the others are probably not far behind. The service manager admitted that their injector tester isn’t working, so the “free” injector couldn’t be tested before installation. They’re relying on the volume of diesel return from the installed injectors as an indicator of good or bad.

The dash reset when starting the tractor is still there intermittently. So I have to apologize to all of you guys out there that have this dash reset. The failing bearing had NOTHING to do with the dash resetting.

While installing an oil pressure gauge, I noticed that the oil pressure switch is stuck open. Makes me wonder how long the “oil light” hasn’t worked. Normally it would be on before the engine was started, but I really only look for it after the engine is running. It’s something to think about if you don’t have a gauge. At cold idle, I’m seeing 70-80psi. Once the tractor has warmed up, I’m seeing 40-45psi. I’m planning to also replace the switch, but I feel a lot better seeing the actual pressure. This particular switch is supposed to open at about 7psi. Not a lot of protection, but better than nothing. I can’t help wondering if the tractor lost oil pressure and I didn’t know. A new oil pump was not part of the short block, but I had new one put in anyway. So I’ll never know for sure.

In hind sight:

Many mechanics seem to function only as well as the diagnostic computer and error codes. Having them try to give me back the tractor when it was clearly missing a cylinder is deeply disturbing. The fact that it happened twice seems criminal. So, I need to find a diesel mechanic that I can trust. It probably won’t be a dealer. After thinking about all problems I’ve experienced with both automotive and tractor dealers, I’m going to have to find someone that is independent.

Probably should have gone with a full engine. After adding the oil pump and three new injectors, the difference is only about $2000-3000. The rebuild, with short block, was originally quoted at $7000. Going with the full engine was $11000 and I would have had the tractor back March 15. The lower quote does not always mean less money in the end. I know that the mechanics out there will be saying it should have been a complete rebuild. Replacing everything in cylinder #3 and turning the crank would have been cheaper, but I’m not really in a position to do it myself and I don’t think the dealership would have been up to the task.

I need a better ritual for checking things before and after starting the tractor. When did that pressure switch fail? Did I miss the failure? I started out as a weekend warrior with these tractors. I worked the property one weekend a month. The 1978 Kubota L245DT has been bullet proof. There is only one light on the Kubota, so it’s pretty obvious when that light doesn’t work. That’s the way to make a tractor. When I added the LS XR4150H in 2016, I got a computer driven tractor that I used 100 hours per year. There are a lot of lights on the dash, but there are really only two that should be lit before the tractor starts, the parking brake and the oil pressure light. I’ll never know if this inattention led to this failure, but it could have. I posted my problems relating to the hydraulic oil cooler on this tractor in a different thread, but suffice it to say, I no longer use and LS cooler and I have temperature and pressure sensors on both the inlet and outlet of my cooler. So now I have engine oil pressure to add to the information that was not originally available on the tractor. A friend of mine was always saying that “it’s not the things you know that hurt you, it’s the things you think you know that are not so that hurt you”. I thought I had engine oil pressure, but I may not have. Going forward, I now have a gauge to measure the engine oil pressure.

Thanks for all your inputs. I've got three months to see if everything holds together. That's about 100 hours at my current usage rate. Maybe a bit more, I've got a lot of stuff that I need to use the grapple to move. I think this thread is finished at this point.

 

[Avenger]

Thank you for the update! And congratulations on getting your machine back and in good working order! Hopefully it will last a bit longer than the last engine.