DPF issue

[cbright1]

I have a fairly CK3510 hst, it only has 23 hours on it, about a year old. I was using it and got a "CEL" alarm and the motor shut off. This is a DPF error and upon further research it means the tractor attempted to do a passive regen but was interrupted twice. The owners manual says the DPF needs replacing. I removed the DPF and inspected it. Based on what I am seeing, I doubt it needs replacing. It is hardly soiled. I can't get the tractor to run for more than 15 seconds, so I cannot perform a manual regen, and according to the manual, it cannot be done once the CEL alarm has been activated. I am suspicious that the problem is the differential sensor, but I can't be sure. I spoke with the dealer and he told me I needed to bring the tractor in, but I don't have a trailer, a rental yard is an hour away, and the dealer wants $75 p/hr to come and get it. This would amount to about $500 just to get it to the dealer and back. If there is just a secret dealer reset that needs to be done, it seems like a waste of time and money to just do that. Is anyone aware of the procedure to reset the cel alarm? Any ideas for things to try?

 

[wiskioti]

I have a fairly CK3510 hst, it only has 23 hours on it, about a year old. I was using it and got a "CEL" alarm and the motor shut off. This is a DPF error and upon further research it means the tractor attempted to do a passive regen but was interrupted twice. The owners manual says the DPF needs replacing. I removed the DPF and inspected it. Based on what I am seeing, I doubt it needs replacing. It is hardly soiled. I can't get the tractor to run for more than 15 seconds, so I cannot perform a manual regen, and according to the manual, it cannot be done once the CEL alarm has been activated. I am suspicious that the problem is the differential sensor, but I can't be sure. I spoke with the dealer and he told me I needed to bring the tractor in, but I don't have a trailer, a rental yard is an hour away, and the dealer wants $75 p/hr to come and get it. This would amount to about $500 just to get it to the dealer and back. If there is just a secret dealer reset that needs to be done, it seems like a waste of time and money to just do that. Is anyone aware of the procedure to reset the cel alarm? Any ideas for things to try?

I can't say for sure as I'm also fairly new to DPF tractor ownership but this sounds exactly like what the my local dealers told me about missing passive regens when I was tractor shopping. Note, a very similar version of this scenario came from Kubota dealer AND a Kioti dealer so this is absolutely NOT a certain manufacturer issue. Essentially, missing 2 required regens puts the tractor in limp mode that can only be solved through a dealer procedure to reprogram the DPF system. It's interesting that your tractor does not stay running and maybe that is why the dealer is requesting that the tractor come to them versus in-field service, but I was under the impression from both dealers that I talked to about this scenario in that the tractor could be reprogrammed in the field. Good luck with the issue. Sorry to hear that you're experiencing it, but let us know what the resolution ends up being.

 

[cbright1]

I think the dealer wanted me to bring it in because he felt the DPF needed cleaning.

 

[countrybumpkin]

You might try to use a code scanner and reset the cel, this may allow you to start the tractor and do a park regen. Just curios how you decided it was a regen issue without knowing what code it’s throwing to activate the cel.

 

[hillwood]

You can do a system rest by disconnecting the battery ground for 10 minutes...
If it starts and runs.. warm it up and do the regeneration....
If it doesn't work, then you will have to get the dealership to reset it.. you can only skip so many regens before the ECM locks up operation.. it is trying to stop the DPF from degrading....
When the regeneration light comes on... Start the process and let it complete..

 

[countrybumpkin]

That will not reset the cel.

 

[hillwood]

If it is a current code with a hard failure.. No.. it won't clear...
If it is a non current history code.. It will reset...
Won't know until you try.

 

[cbright1]

You might try to use a code scanner and reset the cel, this may allow you to start the tractor and do a park regen. Just curios how you decided it was a regen issue without knowing what code it’s throwing to activate the cel.

I got the CEL alarm light on the dash.

 

[countrybumpkin]

Not saying it’s not a regen issue, but the cel light is thrown for many other issues, that’s why you need to have a scanner to read the code and go from there. It also depends on the code as to what the tractor may do, some codes degrade the power output, some actually make the engine idle at a higher rpm and some as you found out will shut the engine down.

 

[LMychajluk]

Ugh.... Don't tell me this. After originally wanting a Mahindra 1500/1600 series for just this reason, and seeing similar issues reported w/ the Kubota 3350, I went to the Kobota dealer to discuss the issue when I realized it was actually a Kioti dealer. I liked what I saw, and haven't seen too many mentions of a problem like this w/ Kioti, so I was just about committed to a CK3510SE and just trying to work out the financing for it.

Am I correct in reading the CK3510 manual that you're supposed to bring the RPMs up >1500rpms and the Regen has to be manually initiated with the dash switch when the light comes on on the dash? This does not happen automatically, right? So, if you ignore / don't notice that light, you end up in the OP's situation (not saying the OP ignored it)?

Whatever I buy will see alot of intermittent use, and most likely won't be running all day, so this worries me.

 

[countrybumpkin]

These problems are issues with all brands, yes the higher RPM and the longer you run a tier 4 the better it is on the DPF issues.

 

[fried1765]

These problems are issues with all brands, yes the higher RPM and the longer you run a tier 4 the better it is on the DPF issues.

I am SO disappointed that I did not spend my money to buy one of these whiz-bang new tractors.
I am just going to have to keep on muddling through, without a heated cup holder and DPF.

 

[wiskioti]

Ugh.... Don't tell me this. After originally wanting a Mahindra 1500/1600 series for just this reason, and seeing similar issues reported w/ the Kubota 3350, I went to the Kobota dealer to discuss the issue when I realized it was actually a Kioti dealer. I liked what I saw, and haven't seen too many mentions of a problem like this w/ Kioti, so I was just about committed to a CK3510SE and just trying to work out the financing for it.

Am I correct in reading the CK3510 manual that you're supposed to bring the RPMs up >1500rpms and the Regen has to be manually initiated with the dash switch when the light comes on on the dash? This does not happen automatically, right? So, if you ignore / don't notice that light, you end up in the OP's situation (not saying the OP ignored it)?

Whatever I buy will see alot of intermittent use, and most likely won't be running all day, so this worries me.

I just had my first regen on my NX which happened at 39 hours. My dealer said that the passive regen would start and run on it's own as long as you keep the RPMs over ~1800 and that's exactly what happened. While using the tractor, I first noticed that the tractor sounded different. It actually got slightly quieter, and after 30 seconds, I noticed the regen light on the dash was on, so I set the manual throttle at about 2000 and continued using the tractor. During the regen, you could smell the extra heat the tractor was generating. After about 15 minutes, the tractor sound returned to normal and I noticed the light was off indicating the cycle was complete.

So, after initially being concerned about this process, it was pretty seamless. I do wish there was a little more indication that the regen process is running (a beep, audible alarm, etc). If I wouldn't have noticed the sound of the tractor changed, I probably would have missed the light on the dash and may have shut down the tractor thinking all was normal. Or, I can see this being an issue if you are wearing hearing protection. I know there is a light on the dash, but really, clearly seeing those lights in daylight is not going to happen. Because I caught the process starting, I was able to set the manual throttle AND be perfectly aware of the safety features (parking break and neutral) before getting off the tractor so it didn't shut down on me when getting off. Since I used the linked pedal, I'm also not sure how forgiving the process would be of the RPMs dropping below the required level. Maybe another TBNer can answer this and also how the tractor acts at startup when a regen is needed? It would be nice to know that the tractor is trying harder to let you know a regen is needed before it starts to actually reduce power.

 

[LMychajluk]

That's good to know, wiskioti. Since I'll be getting the linked pedal option, often I may not need to even set the throttle, but then the RPM's could drop below 1500. Maybe I'll try and make a habit of setting the throttle at ~1600 rpms minimum when using the linked pedal feature. It's a shame they wouldn't just program the ECU to keep the RPMs up during the auto regen as well instead of having to manually set the throttle.

 

[ovrszd]

I run a JD road grader that is Interim Tier IV. When working and the light comes on I increase engine speed if necessary and if possible put a load on the machine to help it create heat. If it's in regen mode when I'm ready to park it I set the throttle to 17-1800 rpms and wait for the cycle to finish. I NEVER shut it off during regen.

It's simply the nature of the beast and something we as operators need to be conscious of.

 

[wiskioti]

That's good to know, wiskioti. Since I'll be getting the linked pedal option, often I may not need to even set the throttle, but then the RPM's could drop below 1500. Maybe I'll try and make a habit of setting the throttle at ~1600 rpms minimum when using the linked pedal feature. It's a shame they wouldn't just program the ECU to keep the RPMs up during the auto regen as well instead of having to manually set the throttle.

The RPMs are controlled in a parked regen (tractor is stationary in neutral with parking break on), but not in a passive regen. I'm sure this is a liability issue because there are lawyers that will say an unexpected increase in RPM is what caused their client to launch their tractor off a cliff and injure the neighbor's cat.

 

[LMychajluk]

Good point. Between the EPA and the lawyers, it's amazing anything gets done.

 

[cbright1]

Ugh.... Don't tell me this. After originally wanting a Mahindra 1500/1600 series for just this reason, and seeing similar issues reported w/ the Kubota 3350, I went to the Kobota dealer to discuss the issue when I realized it was actually a Kioti dealer. I liked what I saw, and haven't seen too many mentions of a problem like this w/ Kioti, so I was just about committed to a CK3510SE and just trying to work out the financing for it.

Am I correct in reading the CK3510 manual that you're supposed to bring the RPMs up >1500rpms and the Regen has to be manually initiated with the dash switch when the light comes on on the dash? This does not happen automatically, right? So, if you ignore / don't notice that light, you end up in the OP's situation (not saying the OP ignored it)?

Whatever I buy will see alot of intermittent use, and most likely won't be running all day, so this worries me.

yup, I never saw the light come on to do a manual regen.

 

[ovrszd]

I'm a control freak, I don't want the computer deciding to change my engine rpms on an impulse.....

 

[xcgreene]

Ugh.... Don't tell me this. After originally wanting a Mahindra 1500/1600 series for just this reason, and seeing similar issues reported w/ the Kubota 3350, I went to the Kobota dealer to discuss the issue when I realized it was actually a Kioti dealer. I liked what I saw, and haven't seen too many mentions of a problem like this w/ Kioti, so I was just about committed to a CK3510SE and just trying to work out the financing for it.

Am I correct in reading the CK3510 manual that you're supposed to bring the RPMs up >1500rpms and the Regen has to be manually initiated with the dash switch when the light comes on on the dash? This does not happen automatically, right? So, if you ignore / don't notice that light, you end up in the OP's situation (not saying the OP ignored it)?

Whatever I buy will see alot of intermittent use, and most likely won't be running all day, so this worries me.

Keep in mind that Mahindras engines are meeting tier 4 emissions by running hotter and recirculating exhaust gases back into the intake. For engine longevity, in my opinion, regen is the way to go. Perhaps not, but time will tell.