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  1. #1
    Epic Contributor Bird's Avatar
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    Default Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    Decided to start a new thread because the other one got too long. If anyone has read it, and looked at the pictures of the "tip 'n tilt" job I did and intended to try to copy it; WAIT! It looks like the old man goofed again.[img]/w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif[/img] When I finished it, I thought it sounded like a relief valve might be open (only when moving, i.e., HST pedal depressed), but being hard of hearing, wasn't sure, and it's been too wet and cold to use the tractor lately. Today, I got the top link shortened about an inch (wasn't bad as it was, but decided I wanted it to tilt forward a little more and it would tilt back a lot farther than necessary), then I tilled the garden plots. Sure enough, that's a relief valve I hear, and the hydraulic oil got hot. So, I'm waiting for the dealer to call; don't know whether this Tisco valve is NOT an open center valve, or just what the problem is yet, but of course it annoyed me that Tisco sent absolutely no paperwork with the valve and cylinders anyway. I'll let you know when I get a final diagnoses and correction done.

    Bird

  2. #2
    Gold Member
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    Henrietta, NY, USA
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    790 John Deere, 2000

    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    Oh man, Bird! What a bummer! [img]/w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif[/img]

    What was the GPM rating on that valve? I'm sitting here trying to remember, but that adaptor made the fluid flow to your new valves before the SCV, didn't it? Any chance there is too much of a restriction, even though the valve is open-centered?

    <font color=green>mark</font color=green>

  3. #3
    Epic Contributor Bird's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    Mark, I don't think that would be the problem. The tractor specs say 6.4 gal/min (plus 3.1 gal/min for the power steering pump) and the hydraulic outlet block manual says for 4.5 gal/min, but it's listed as being an option for the B2710 in the parts manual, and the size of the channel, through which it had to go before changing to that outlet, certainly doesn't appear to be as big as the quarter inch hydraulic lines I'm using.

    Bird

  4. #4
    Veteran Member gordon's Avatar
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    Delaware
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    L4310hst-loader-hydraulic top link

    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    Bird I'm sorry to hear that, after all that hard work. I would be pretty steamed at Tisco right about now. Any help from a company is better than none.

    Let me ask you this are you sure that you plumbed in the in and the out correctly on the valve? Just a thought. If it was a closed center valve you would more than likely hear the relief constantly instead of just when depressing the hst pedal.

    Guess you realize the best thing to do is leave the tractor parked until you get this thing figured out. Good luck with it!!
    You will win in the end and have that thing running great!
    Gordon


  5. #5
    Gold Member
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    Henrietta, NY, USA
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    790 John Deere, 2000

    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    I don't know about leaving it parked[img]/w3tcompact/icons/tongue.gif[/img]. If the dealer says "we didn't install it" etc, then at least put the little cap assembly back on. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img]

    <font color=green>mark</font color=green>

  6. #6
    Super Member ronjhall's Avatar
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    SE Michigan, TX when its cold in MI.
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    Kubota 2910 HST

    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    Bird. I remember the reply that you sent me about hooking up a Power Beyond Valve. I don't remember it all but you said something about plugging one of the ports. Does your problem have something to do with the plugged port?
    You may have to tee the three hoses that run your FEL valve. My dealer showed me a Tisco catalog the other day. They have a lot of information in it. If you can see, one it may give you all the information you need.




  7. #7
    Epic Contributor Bird's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    Ron, I'm getting a lot of valuable experience. I know it must be valuable because it's costing me a fortune.[img]/w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif[/img] I talked to a Tisco tech support rep today and he says this valve is an open center valve, rated for 6 to 8 gallons per minute, but you have to hook up the inlet as I did, then run from the power beyond port back to the tractor hydraulic block, and use a third hose from the valve outlet to dump back to the reservoir. In other words, plumb it just like the loader valve. I don't know why the valve came with a plug in the power beyond port, but now I've got to order a "power beyond sleeve", and then I'll have to figure some way to put a "T" where the loader valve outlet dumps back to the reservoir so this valve can do the same thing.

    In the meantime, I just took all the new stuff off and put it back like it was originally so I could till the garden today.

    Bird

  8. #8
    Super Member JerryG's Avatar
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    Northwest Arkansas
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    MF 1440-4 PowerShuttle

    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    Geees Bird,
    I hate it when I put something new together, then I have to take it apart because something is missing. When you live a long way out in the country it is even worse. Running back and forth to town is a killer. When you get it all straightened out, please give all of us a complete update. I'm sure that there are quite a few following this thread. Even those of us with different colored tractors (Red) can learn something from the experience you are getting with hydralics.
    JerryG


  9. #9
    Gold Member
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    790 John Deere, 2000

    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    Bird,
    On that little adapter you installed there were two ports. I thought one went from the tractor, to your new valves and from there back to the tractor. I figured the "PB" would be return to the tractor. On my SCV, the PB is the return for when under pressure, and the "tank" is for when not under pressure. Under pressure would be either something controlled by the valve OR another valve beyond this valve.

    Is that what you've discovered? Did you actually have the "tank" connected back to your adapter?

    <font color=green>mark</font color=green>

    ps - with the "PB" plugged, it sounds like closed-centered, while with the "PB" unplugged, it becomes open-centered.<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by markcg2000 on 02/07/01 08:31 AM (server time).</FONT></P>

  10. #10
    Epic Contributor Bird's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hydraulic Tip \'N Tilt - OK, Top \'N Tilt

    <font color=blue>I hate it when I put something new together, then I have to take it apart because something is missing.</font color=blue>

    Me, too, Jerry!!!

    Mark, that's the (interesting?) part about this project. I cannot determine from the manuals exactly where the oil flow goes after that adapter, and I've talked to 3 kubota dealers and none of them know. I guess I should have asked my dealer to call Kubota tech support folks to ask. <font color=blue>PB is the return for when under pressure, and the "tank" is for when not under pressure</font color=blue>. That's right, as I understand it, power beyond simply means the oil is flowing through, under pressure, and going on to power something else, when the control valve is not being used. When the valve is used, the oil leaving that spool at that time is not under pressure and is returned to the reservoir. And I think you're right about plugging the PB port making it a closed center (but don't really know), so that's causing a relief valve on the tractor to open. So it seems to me that means wherever that oil was flowing before I put that adapter on there, it was under pressure which would seem to indicate that it was enroute to operate something. And putting the adapter on, with the PB plugged, would stop that flow. Now that would make me thing something wouldn't work because it wouldn't be getting the oil pressure it had before. However, everything worked just fine.

    I've used tractor hydraulics a good bit; but I've never worked on or altered any before, so it's puzzling to say the least.

    Bird

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