Royally screwed by propane company - What can I do?

[Domush]

I just can't get out alive with this propane company I rented a tank from.

Last year I moved into a new (used) house with propane heat. I call a local company (UPG) for new service and to rent a tank. They are having a great special for 1st time customers, twice the capacity of your tank for $.50 discount, so I'm thrilled at the cheaper than normal rate.

Upon delivering the tank, the guy shows up with no leveling blocks, so I let him use some blocks of mine. He complains about how the line is run and helps me move it to a spot he is happy with. In doing so, one guy managed to kink the line, forcing him to cut off the kinked section (5' of line). He informs me I now have to buy new line from them, as this one is no longer long enough. I happen to have an extra section of line I wasn't using, so I fetch that and have him use that. Annoyed he ruined my line, I shrug it off as a battle not worth waging.

A week later I get a bill for line burial for nearly twice the distance he *helped* move. The bill also includes a burial fee, when he didn't bury the line at all. I call and complain and get nowhere, so I file a BBB complaint. Months later, after much back and forth, they finally agree to remove the charge and bury the line. This was 12 months ago. I ask the BBB to reopen the complaint and UPG claims they can't bury the line because it is too wet.. It hadn't rained here for almost 3 months. Ignoring reality, BBB closes the claim anyway.

Fast forward a few months to the second propane delivery (first was when the tank was delivered).

7 months ago I prepaid for a delivery. They came out and filled 2 tanks with the amount of propane I prepaid for, but charged a $.50/gl higher rate. When I get home and see the messed up bill, I call and they say they know about it and will correct it. Bills continue to this day regarding this overbill amount.

Enter last week. I visit their office and, yet again, explain about the overbill and ask them to remove it. I also schedule a day to have them transfer the propane from the rented tank to a new one I bought. They set a day of today.

Today they arrive an hour early, saying a customer cancelled so they came early. I'm fine with this and I show them the new tank and they begin talking about how to transfer it until one guy says "you owe us XXX dollars and unless you write a check right now, I'm taking the tank with the propane still in it." I explain the overbill and he wants nothing of it. He tells the guy to start loading up their tank. He does and park my truck to block their exit as I go inside and call the police.

In hind-sight I'm guessing they arrived early hoping I wouldn't be home to meet them.

The police arrive by the time the tank is loaded up and tell me I must let them leave, even though they have my propane in the tank.

So, now UPG has stolen my propane, left me with an empty tank which is not connected or even within reach of the line (they were supposed to swap the tanks), stolen my leveling blocks and I'm out heat, 150gal of propane, leveling blocks and still have a fraudulent bill.

If not the BBB, the police or any kind of oversight at all (I called around as the propane line they 'installed' (moved) was left above ground, illegal according to fire code), who stops these companies from just running rampant as this one seems to be? I can hardly imagine I'm the only guy they are screwing at every turn.

What can I do? I'm new to this kind of treatment and my funds don't exactly provide for a lawyer on retainer, not that I would know what to sue for, if I could even sue at all.

Frankly, I don't understand how them stealing propane from me isn't theft, and how the police allow them to just drive off with it.

The whole thing seems analogous to my claiming you owe me $500, with no proof at all, and just grabbing things out of your yard and driving off with a police escort. If I'm missing something, I'd love to find out what it is, as I'm lost as to how this was all possible.

 

[hawkeye08]

Sorry for your troubles, probably gonna have to get a lawyer involved or maybe your state's attorney general? Have you been talking to office people or owner or ?? Escalate it if you can at their end (if there is anywhere to escalate to).

 

[dodge man]

How much are you out? 150 gallons of propane? Thats what maybe $300 or so. If thats all it is, I'd probably just right it off as experience. If its more than that, you could try small claims court. You don't need a lawyer, but they may show up with one. You could also hire a lawyer, but if its only a few hundred dollars, its probably not worth it. It almost seems like the problems they are causing you is deliberate.

 

[aczlan]

What did they say about the driver taking the tank with your propane?
How much do they claim that you owe them?
How much do they owe you (propane, etc)?

Assuming that you have this documented (who you spoke to, when you spoke to them and notes) and you are in the US (you don't have a location listed) and they are refusing to deal with you, I would take said documentation and file for your losses in small claims court.
That will get their attention and as long as you stick to the facts and are reasonable (ie: you present the facts and dont seem like a crackpot), you should get somewhere.
Failing that, you could contact your state attorney general, your local newspaper or TV station and (if applicable) your state utility regulation authority.

Aaron Z

 

[EddieWalker]

First, the BBB has no power or authority over any business. It's mostly a scam that charges a company to become a member, and stays in business by continuing to have those members pay their yearly bill to remain a member. Members used to be able to get a higher rating by the amount the spent on advertising with the BBB, but I heard that after gettting sued, they said they would stop doing this. I can't say for sure this happened or not.

The propane company is under some regulatory authority. Just like gasoline and electricity and the telephone is. Hopefully somebody on here will know who it is in your state. Fillling out your profile information and telling us where you are would really help in figuring out where to send you for help. Once you find out who controls the propane company, you will need to fill out a complaint with them. In my experience, this is the only thing that gets you anywhere.

Keep all your records and document everything. Take pictures and remain polite at all times. Don't name call, don't accuse them of anything, just state the facts and ask for help in resolving the problem.

Good luck,
Eddie

 

[aczlan]

Looks like you may be in KY. If so, contact the Kentucky Public Service Commission: KY Public Service Commission
I agree with Eddie, take pictures of EVERYTHING (video is good too) and make a drawing of where everything is. A picture is worth a thousand words.

Aaron Z

 

[Domush]

What did they say about the driver taking the tank with your propane?
How much do they claim that you owe them?
How much do they owe you (propane, etc)?

Aaron Z

The police said "It is a civil matter and if you don't move your vehicle I'll call a tow truck to move it"

When I asked him how their stealing my propane was not theft, I was told I was being a smart ***.

They claim I owe them $120

They now owe me 150gal of propane (which is now $2.20gal)

I live in Kentucky, BTW. Updated my profile to reflect that. If someone knows the regulatory body which oversees these companies, I'd love to find out, as I've done quite a bit of research and can't find any oversight body for propane delivery.

 

[aczlan]

The police said "It is a civil matter and if you don't move your vehicle I'll call a tow truck to move it"
When I asked him how their stealing my propane was not theft, I was told I was being a smart ***.

Do you have the officers name? I would file a complaint with his department.
Even if he was legally correct, if that is what he said, the rudeness is uncalled for and is unprofessional.

Aaron Z

 

[Cat_Driver]

Real simple, Small claims court. Even if it's $300.00. I once sued a company for $30.00, not a typo THIRTY dollars.

For me it's principal. Oh sure it cost me more in time and energy to collect, but the point is I won and they were forced to pay and I guarantee they will think twice before doing what they did to me with another customer.

I also sued a tractor repair facility. They quoted a price I signed and agreed to that price and at pick up time they wanted $250.00 MORE than what we agreed on. I refused and they would not release my tractor. I needed the tractor so I hired people to do the tractor work I needed while they held captive my tractor. I sued them for $3,500 or the amount I had to pay for tractor work.

They showed up in court stunned at the amount I was suing them for and at that time GLADLY agreed to charge me my original $500.00 repair fee.

Too late, the judge ruled in my favor and awarded me $3,500.00, plus no charge for the repairs in penalty for trying to screw me. They returned my tractor with a check the next day per the judge.

Do I hate suing people? Not as much as I hate being screwed by unscrupulous business people.

 

[brin]

Real simple, Small claims court. Even if it's $300.00. I once sued a company for $30.00, not a typo THIRTY dollars.

For me it's principal. Oh sure it cost me more in time and energy to collect, but the point is I won and they were forced to pay and I guarantee they will think twice before doing what they did to me with another customer.

I also sued a tractor repair facility. They quoted a price I signed and agreed to that price and at pick up time they wanted $250.00 MORE than what we agreed on. I refused and they would not release my tractor. I needed the tractor so I hired people to do the tractor work I needed while they held captive my tractor. I sued them for $3,500 or the amount I had to pay for tractor work.

They showed up in court stunned at the amount I was suing them for and at that time GLADLY agreed to charge me my original $500.00 repair fee.

Too late, the judge ruled in my favor and awarded me $3,500.00, plus no charge for the repairs in penalty for trying to screw me. They returned my tractor with a check the next day per the judge.

Do I hate suing people? Not as much as I hate being screwed by unscrupulous business people.

I agree with catdriver....I too have used Small claims court without a lawyer and won....it is cheap...$65 here and you will be surprised at the result..just be sure to take all your documents and plan out your testimony.