I know there are lots of older threads about Kioti vs. Kubota, but there are a fair number of new variables to consider here.
I've been searching around for awhile for a decent price on a ~30HP 4x4 tractor package with loader, box blade and shredder. Ive got 23 acres in central Texas with a lot of scrubby small mesquite, cedar elm and yaupon that I need to have shredded, sprayed and controlled regularly to keep it usable (most <3" diameter, I plan to use a brush grubber to pull out the 3"-5" trees and rent a dozer one day for the big stuff that has to come out). I will need to use the loader fairly often for spreading road base and piling up the berm on my private rifle range. I'll need to use the box blade to keep my roads graded. A backhoe would be nice but the price on those is simply unjustifiable right now. I'd REALLY prefer to have an HST over a geared tractor as it makes loader work easier and to be honest as a novice I found that driving the geared tractor Ive tested somewhat confusing and difficult to operate whereas the HST tractor seemed to be much more intuitive to operate. You can make of that what you will but thats my personal preference until Im convinced otherwise.
Anyway, I was hoping to find a nice used tractor on craigslist, etc as the economy has gotten worse and desperate people are shedding relative luxury items for much cheaper than they were up until recently. I've got a significant amount of cash to put down on a used tractor but not enough to fully cover a brand new one. I then discovered that as of recently many of the tractor manufacturers are doing 0% financing for as much as 60 months on new tractors. This sounds quite tempting as a new tractor with a warranty and with no penalty to financing might be preferrable in the long run. So I decided that I would check out the major makers who have local dealerships.
Of the major tractor manufacturers, I have reputable local dealers of: Kubota, Mahindra, Kioti, New Holland and John Deere. I eliminated John Deere right off the bat as I know their pricing simply cannot be competitive and I eliminated Mahindra and New Holland as they can only offer 0% for 60 months on geared tractors in the 30HP range, not HST. The local Kubota dealership has the lions share of the local compact tractor market and carries quite a large stock. I went to them first looking for a deal on a used tractor but of course the salesman tried to talk me into a new tractor.. and I must admit I was tempted. Here is the package quote they offered me:
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L2800HST-F 29hp Diesel Tractor, 4wd, hydro. $11,708.39
LA463FL Kubota 60" FEL $3,416.61
160 - 5' Rhino 160 5' Shredder w/slip clutch $1,255.00
BB5 Armstrong Ag 5' Box Blade $495.00
Doc/UCC/Prep Fee $125.00
Free delivery to my site $0
Down Payment -$2,550.00
Total $14,450.00
Payments 0.00%/60mo $240.83/mo
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I like that they offer local implements instead of cheap Chinese Howse implements, but the pricing on the shredder seems pretty high to me, however the tractor package seems pretty good. Keep in mnd this is a 2008 L2800 not the new 2009 "Xtra Power" model. This dealer has a lot of last years stock on the lot so hes able to quote at last years prices. I test drove the L2800 and liked the HST drive and the control layout.
From reading older posts on this board I have gleaned that Kioti offers a more fully featured, heavier, and better arranged tractor than Kubota at a lower price, so I contacted the local Kioti dealer and got a quote on the comparable CK30HST. Well, when I got the quote back, I was shocked. Apparently Kioti raised their prices significantly as of Oct 1 and the dealer I spoke to had sold all of their 2008 models and could only order the much more expensive 2009s. Here's the Kioti quote:
-------------------------------------------------------
2009 model Kioti CK30hst Ag w/KL130P front loader $18,499
2008 model Rhino 160 w/slipclutch and chains $ 1,595
2008 model Armstrong Ag Box blade w/rippers $ 450
Free Delivery $ 0
Total Price $20,544.00
Discount (whatever that means) -$744.00
Package price $19,800.00
0% for 60 months w/2000 down $297.00/mo
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As you can see, Kioti can no longer really claim to offer their better product at a lower price than Kubota. I haven't test driven the Kioti yet but frm the research Ive done, it has a lt of very desirable features such as the telescoping hitch arms and a heavier chassis. Once again, the shredder price seems out of line. Even tough its local American made, I don't see why what is considered to be a light duty shredder should cost more than maybe $750 or so. I called another Kioti dealer in San Antonio, and they did offer me a 2008 CK30HST but the salesman seemed really sketchy, they would not offer me free delivery (I have a 3/4 ton truck, but don't own a flatbed trailer, dont want to buy one right now and don't want the hassle of renting one) and they seemed uninterested in working up a "apples to apples" comparison quote relative to the Kubota quote. Maybe they thought I was not a worthwhile customer or I wasn't worth the small commission. Anyway, this is what passes for a "quote" they sent me:
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CK30hst Kioti Package:
2008 30hp Kioti four wheel drive tractor with three range hydrostatic transmission, ag style tires, KL130 Kioti front end loader with 60 inch bucket, 5 foot brush hog/shredder(upgrade Landpride Shredder w/clutch), and a 5 foot box blade with ripper shanks(upgrade Landpride) with upgrade - Landpride quick hitch, and canopy top.
Special Package Price $19,195.00
Down payment $3000
0%/60mo $269.91/mo
-----------------------------------------------------------
This "package" sounds like a decent price but they were somewhat difficult to work with and they haven't yet responded to my request to break out each item in the quote so i can know what their pricing on each is. Im not so sure I really need the canopy or the quick hitch, though that might be nice. If I do buy from these guys Im fairly sure I can get it warranty repaired at the much closer dealer #2 above, but something about the way these guys are making it difficult to get a quote or talk t me about my options is making me uncomfortable, despite their better price.
I plan to test drive the Kioti soon but I need to know what other factors I ought to consider. Both dealers #1 and #2 have a good reputation. Dealer #3 all I know is that they are the next closest Kioti dealer and can get me a cheaper 2008 CK30HST (ostensibly, we'll see once they send me a broken-ut quote - if they ever bother). I know that the criticism of the Kioti's KL130 loader having a problem with cracking is now moot as they have corrected that problem since the 2007 models. What other problems/concerns/considerations should I be aware of in the CK30HST given what I plan on using it for? What about the Kubota L2800HST? What kind of performance difference should I notice between them with regard to shredding, grading, and light dirt work? Should I consider just buying used implements elsewhere for cash? What would be he absolute optimal shredder and box blade implement brand/model choice for either the L2800HST or CK30HST, taking price into account as well as quality?
Thanks in advance for any help/advice you can provide.
I've been searching around for awhile for a decent price on a ~30HP 4x4 tractor package with loader, box blade and shredder. Ive got 23 acres in central Texas with a lot of scrubby small mesquite, cedar elm and yaupon that I need to have shredded, sprayed and controlled regularly to keep it usable (most <3" diameter, I plan to use a brush grubber to pull out the 3"-5" trees and rent a dozer one day for the big stuff that has to come out). I will need to use the loader fairly often for spreading road base and piling up the berm on my private rifle range. I'll need to use the box blade to keep my roads graded. A backhoe would be nice but the price on those is simply unjustifiable right now. I'd REALLY prefer to have an HST over a geared tractor as it makes loader work easier and to be honest as a novice I found that driving the geared tractor Ive tested somewhat confusing and difficult to operate whereas the HST tractor seemed to be much more intuitive to operate. You can make of that what you will but thats my personal preference until Im convinced otherwise.
Anyway, I was hoping to find a nice used tractor on craigslist, etc as the economy has gotten worse and desperate people are shedding relative luxury items for much cheaper than they were up until recently. I've got a significant amount of cash to put down on a used tractor but not enough to fully cover a brand new one. I then discovered that as of recently many of the tractor manufacturers are doing 0% financing for as much as 60 months on new tractors. This sounds quite tempting as a new tractor with a warranty and with no penalty to financing might be preferrable in the long run. So I decided that I would check out the major makers who have local dealerships.
Of the major tractor manufacturers, I have reputable local dealers of: Kubota, Mahindra, Kioti, New Holland and John Deere. I eliminated John Deere right off the bat as I know their pricing simply cannot be competitive and I eliminated Mahindra and New Holland as they can only offer 0% for 60 months on geared tractors in the 30HP range, not HST. The local Kubota dealership has the lions share of the local compact tractor market and carries quite a large stock. I went to them first looking for a deal on a used tractor but of course the salesman tried to talk me into a new tractor.. and I must admit I was tempted. Here is the package quote they offered me:
-----------------------------------------------------------------
L2800HST-F 29hp Diesel Tractor, 4wd, hydro. $11,708.39
LA463FL Kubota 60" FEL $3,416.61
160 - 5' Rhino 160 5' Shredder w/slip clutch $1,255.00
BB5 Armstrong Ag 5' Box Blade $495.00
Doc/UCC/Prep Fee $125.00
Free delivery to my site $0
Down Payment -$2,550.00
Total $14,450.00
Payments 0.00%/60mo $240.83/mo
-----------------------------------------------------------------
I like that they offer local implements instead of cheap Chinese Howse implements, but the pricing on the shredder seems pretty high to me, however the tractor package seems pretty good. Keep in mnd this is a 2008 L2800 not the new 2009 "Xtra Power" model. This dealer has a lot of last years stock on the lot so hes able to quote at last years prices. I test drove the L2800 and liked the HST drive and the control layout.
From reading older posts on this board I have gleaned that Kioti offers a more fully featured, heavier, and better arranged tractor than Kubota at a lower price, so I contacted the local Kioti dealer and got a quote on the comparable CK30HST. Well, when I got the quote back, I was shocked. Apparently Kioti raised their prices significantly as of Oct 1 and the dealer I spoke to had sold all of their 2008 models and could only order the much more expensive 2009s. Here's the Kioti quote:
-------------------------------------------------------
2009 model Kioti CK30hst Ag w/KL130P front loader $18,499
2008 model Rhino 160 w/slipclutch and chains $ 1,595
2008 model Armstrong Ag Box blade w/rippers $ 450
Free Delivery $ 0
Total Price $20,544.00
Discount (whatever that means) -$744.00
Package price $19,800.00
0% for 60 months w/2000 down $297.00/mo
----------------------------------------------------------------
As you can see, Kioti can no longer really claim to offer their better product at a lower price than Kubota. I haven't test driven the Kioti yet but frm the research Ive done, it has a lt of very desirable features such as the telescoping hitch arms and a heavier chassis. Once again, the shredder price seems out of line. Even tough its local American made, I don't see why what is considered to be a light duty shredder should cost more than maybe $750 or so. I called another Kioti dealer in San Antonio, and they did offer me a 2008 CK30HST but the salesman seemed really sketchy, they would not offer me free delivery (I have a 3/4 ton truck, but don't own a flatbed trailer, dont want to buy one right now and don't want the hassle of renting one) and they seemed uninterested in working up a "apples to apples" comparison quote relative to the Kubota quote. Maybe they thought I was not a worthwhile customer or I wasn't worth the small commission. Anyway, this is what passes for a "quote" they sent me:
---------------------------------------------------------------------
CK30hst Kioti Package:
2008 30hp Kioti four wheel drive tractor with three range hydrostatic transmission, ag style tires, KL130 Kioti front end loader with 60 inch bucket, 5 foot brush hog/shredder(upgrade Landpride Shredder w/clutch), and a 5 foot box blade with ripper shanks(upgrade Landpride) with upgrade - Landpride quick hitch, and canopy top.
Special Package Price $19,195.00
Down payment $3000
0%/60mo $269.91/mo
-----------------------------------------------------------
This "package" sounds like a decent price but they were somewhat difficult to work with and they haven't yet responded to my request to break out each item in the quote so i can know what their pricing on each is. Im not so sure I really need the canopy or the quick hitch, though that might be nice. If I do buy from these guys Im fairly sure I can get it warranty repaired at the much closer dealer #2 above, but something about the way these guys are making it difficult to get a quote or talk t me about my options is making me uncomfortable, despite their better price.
I plan to test drive the Kioti soon but I need to know what other factors I ought to consider. Both dealers #1 and #2 have a good reputation. Dealer #3 all I know is that they are the next closest Kioti dealer and can get me a cheaper 2008 CK30HST (ostensibly, we'll see once they send me a broken-ut quote - if they ever bother). I know that the criticism of the Kioti's KL130 loader having a problem with cracking is now moot as they have corrected that problem since the 2007 models. What other problems/concerns/considerations should I be aware of in the CK30HST given what I plan on using it for? What about the Kubota L2800HST? What kind of performance difference should I notice between them with regard to shredding, grading, and light dirt work? Should I consider just buying used implements elsewhere for cash? What would be he absolute optimal shredder and box blade implement brand/model choice for either the L2800HST or CK30HST, taking price into account as well as quality?
Thanks in advance for any help/advice you can provide.
. But a tire's ply rating has alot to do with it's load carrying capacity with FEL operation, I am not sure if ply rating applies to puncture resistance as well. I have a higher ply rating than is usual for my R-1's. Jay