TCJatko
Platinum Member
OP mentioned some kind of EU scheme to reclaim the pond. I wonder if the invaders were EU bureaucrats.
Alien Invasion - I want my pond back !
- Thread starter Eric Salop
- Start date
OP
Eric Salop
Elite Member
The Pipe
A trailer load of pipe was gratefully received on loan in the summer of 2006 and I set to laying it out on the grass to see what I had taken on. The black, 2" diameter MDPE turned out to be in a few more sections than I first thought, each no more than 50 yards in length. In some places it also had nicks and gashes where it had been caught by a mower cutting hay.
Most of it was easy enough to uncoil and move around, although a couple of lengths were really heavy. Perhaps there was still water inside ? I dragged these onto the slope, expecting, or at least hoping, for water to pour out. Nope, it was something more solid. The pipe had previously been used for emptying waste water from a cattle yard, so chances were the contents were probably something that had previously come out of the rear end of a cow. Maybe that's why it had been left in a field. By lifting the pipe by hand a few inches off the ground, I could feel where the blockages where. In the middle on both lengths.
With nothing much to loose I set to connecting the first bunged up pipe to a water pump. The pump ran quite happily at first, no doubt as the water was initially only compressing air. Then the Honda engine started to hunt harder as the load increased. This went on for a minute or two with nothing moving, but the pump wasn't giving up and neither was I. A bit of lifting and dropping of the pipe had something moving and I could tell from the sound and increasing weight that the Honda was winning ground. The engine changed note and with a final whoosh out popped the poop. Whole piles of it. A few minutes later and the water was running clear.
The second blocked length must have realised that it wasn't worth putting up any resistance after what had just happened to the other one and gave up it's smelly contents without much fuss at all.
Now all I had to do was join and repair the pipes. 2" compression couplers are not cheap and anyway, were against the rules, as by then I was determined to try and empty the pond for free. I had read a little about butt fusion weld joints and was tempted to have a go at a home made version, although time was not on my side. Then I remembered dismantling an old storage tank, which had a short length of plastic pipe on the outlet. At the time I put it to one side, as it was another one of those things that was "too good to throw away", though I had no idea at the time what it could be used for. As luck would have it, the internal diameter of the hoarded outlet pipe was the same size as the external diameter of the 2" pipe. A perfect sleeve. :dance1:
With the permission of the pipe's owner I set to cutting out the damaged sections. A sleeve was made for each end, pushing it half way on one pipe before butting the ends together and melting the sleeve in place with a blowtorch to make one long run of pipe. A quick test with the water pump on the end showed up a couple of poor joints that wept a little, but easy enough to seal.
For good measure I taped over the whole joint to try and keep air from entering the pipe as siphons work below atmospheric pressure. Siphons suck - potentially, in a good way
A trailer load of pipe was gratefully received on loan in the summer of 2006 and I set to laying it out on the grass to see what I had taken on. The black, 2" diameter MDPE turned out to be in a few more sections than I first thought, each no more than 50 yards in length. In some places it also had nicks and gashes where it had been caught by a mower cutting hay.
Most of it was easy enough to uncoil and move around, although a couple of lengths were really heavy. Perhaps there was still water inside ? I dragged these onto the slope, expecting, or at least hoping, for water to pour out. Nope, it was something more solid. The pipe had previously been used for emptying waste water from a cattle yard, so chances were the contents were probably something that had previously come out of the rear end of a cow. Maybe that's why it had been left in a field. By lifting the pipe by hand a few inches off the ground, I could feel where the blockages where. In the middle on both lengths.
With nothing much to loose I set to connecting the first bunged up pipe to a water pump. The pump ran quite happily at first, no doubt as the water was initially only compressing air. Then the Honda engine started to hunt harder as the load increased. This went on for a minute or two with nothing moving, but the pump wasn't giving up and neither was I. A bit of lifting and dropping of the pipe had something moving and I could tell from the sound and increasing weight that the Honda was winning ground. The engine changed note and with a final whoosh out popped the poop. Whole piles of it. A few minutes later and the water was running clear.
The second blocked length must have realised that it wasn't worth putting up any resistance after what had just happened to the other one and gave up it's smelly contents without much fuss at all.
Now all I had to do was join and repair the pipes. 2" compression couplers are not cheap and anyway, were against the rules, as by then I was determined to try and empty the pond for free. I had read a little about butt fusion weld joints and was tempted to have a go at a home made version, although time was not on my side. Then I remembered dismantling an old storage tank, which had a short length of plastic pipe on the outlet. At the time I put it to one side, as it was another one of those things that was "too good to throw away", though I had no idea at the time what it could be used for. As luck would have it, the internal diameter of the hoarded outlet pipe was the same size as the external diameter of the 2" pipe. A perfect sleeve. :dance1:
With the permission of the pipe's owner I set to cutting out the damaged sections. A sleeve was made for each end, pushing it half way on one pipe before butting the ends together and melting the sleeve in place with a blowtorch to make one long run of pipe. A quick test with the water pump on the end showed up a couple of poor joints that wept a little, but easy enough to seal.
For good measure I taped over the whole joint to try and keep air from entering the pipe as siphons work below atmospheric pressure. Siphons suck - potentially, in a good way
KevT
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Has me glued to the chair...
tractorshopper
Veteran Member
Most likely with a story 10 years in the making, this should be pretty epic.
dave1949
Super Star Member
Eric, you are making a profit to this point in the saga--free fertilizer.
Luke'sScreenName
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Following
texasjohn
Super Member
Is it a pipe dream or a dream pipe?? Only time will tell!!:listen:
murphy1244
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Free BS, good deal.
OP
Eric Salop
Elite Member
The filter
With all the pipe in place I had a good feeling that the siphon was going to work. Only question in my mind was how long would it run before getting clogged. I have used short lengths of tubing many times to siphon off small tanks and sooner or later, if there are leaves at the bottom of the tank, they get sucked in and bring everything to a stop. Not too bad when you are there, but this one was going to have to run day and night unattended if it was to empty in time. The pond had a full summer of weed growth, providing lots of potential for constant blockages. It was going to need a good filter on the end.
I reckoned that a fine strainer on the suction end would clog too quickly. It would be better to accept that small stuff getting in would be acceptable, as long as there was with plenty of flow, then the inside of the pipe would be self cleaning. When I sleeved the pipe joints, I had been as careful as possible to keep the inside of the pipe smooth, chamfering the ends before butting them up, so hopefully there was nothing for weed to catch on once it was in the pipe.
The wonders of the internet told me a lot about siphons. One potential problem is that a whirlpool can form when a suction pipe is running just below the surface, in the same way as when water empties out of a bath. This allows air to be sucked down and into into the pipe. Air is the siphons worst enemy, as it can accumulate at the highest point and bring everything to a halt. The faster the water flows, the further down the whirlpool effect goes.
It seems there are 2 ways to overcome this :-
1) Slow the flow down. Not a good idea for me. Reduce the gallons per minute and the pool wouldn't be empty by September.
2) Increase the area of the last bit of pipe at the suction end. This doesn't alter the gpm going through the pipe, but does slow down the water at the point of entry. For example, fitting a "T" section on the end of the pipe would double the area and half the velocity.
I made up what I thought was a simple alternative - drill holes in the sides. With a sharp drill bit I drilled lots of 10mm holes in the last 10" or so of the pipe to give a similar area-increasing effect and crossed my fingers that it would work too.
A sump had been dug out at the edge of the pond, with chicken netting stretched across the mouth of the sump as the primary filter. The filter box was dropped into the sump and weighted down to the bottom.
All set to go, except for one bit of detail. How do you prime a siphon that's over 200 yards in length ?
With all the pipe in place I had a good feeling that the siphon was going to work. Only question in my mind was how long would it run before getting clogged. I have used short lengths of tubing many times to siphon off small tanks and sooner or later, if there are leaves at the bottom of the tank, they get sucked in and bring everything to a stop. Not too bad when you are there, but this one was going to have to run day and night unattended if it was to empty in time. The pond had a full summer of weed growth, providing lots of potential for constant blockages. It was going to need a good filter on the end.
I reckoned that a fine strainer on the suction end would clog too quickly. It would be better to accept that small stuff getting in would be acceptable, as long as there was with plenty of flow, then the inside of the pipe would be self cleaning. When I sleeved the pipe joints, I had been as careful as possible to keep the inside of the pipe smooth, chamfering the ends before butting them up, so hopefully there was nothing for weed to catch on once it was in the pipe.
The wonders of the internet told me a lot about siphons. One potential problem is that a whirlpool can form when a suction pipe is running just below the surface, in the same way as when water empties out of a bath. This allows air to be sucked down and into into the pipe. Air is the siphons worst enemy, as it can accumulate at the highest point and bring everything to a halt. The faster the water flows, the further down the whirlpool effect goes.
It seems there are 2 ways to overcome this :-
1) Slow the flow down. Not a good idea for me. Reduce the gallons per minute and the pool wouldn't be empty by September.
2) Increase the area of the last bit of pipe at the suction end. This doesn't alter the gpm going through the pipe, but does slow down the water at the point of entry. For example, fitting a "T" section on the end of the pipe would double the area and half the velocity.
I made up what I thought was a simple alternative - drill holes in the sides. With a sharp drill bit I drilled lots of 10mm holes in the last 10" or so of the pipe to give a similar area-increasing effect and crossed my fingers that it would work too.
A sump had been dug out at the edge of the pond, with chicken netting stretched across the mouth of the sump as the primary filter. The filter box was dropped into the sump and weighted down to the bottom.
All set to go, except for one bit of detail. How do you prime a siphon that's over 200 yards in length ?