Building up Pad site for Barn

[npaden]

Okay, I've decided the first real project for my new tractor will be leveling and building up a Pad site for my 30' x 40' metal barn.

The front is level and it slopes off about 2' to the back of where the barn will sit.

I've been quoted $1,800 to have it done by a professional but this will get me some loader time and help me justify the expense of the tractor to myself and my wife.

The first thing I need to decide is if I should just have fill dirt brought in or if I should move the dirt over from somewhere else.

It will take about 40 yards of fill the way I calculated it. The first 10' is flat then it slopes down 2' over the last 30'. 30' X 30' X 1' average fill = 25 cubic yards. I guess I need to have it slope down away from the building so assuming it slopes on a 4 to 1 ratio I need another 10 yards or so for that. (6.66 on the back and 3.33 on the sides) Plus I figure another 5 yards at least for extra.

I have a local gravel pit that has some stuff they call cement waste that I think would make excellent fill. They have a deal with the local concrete places to come and clean up their dump sites when the truck comes back from a job with leftover cement or they just wash them out. They screen it and it is really nice material and packs excellent with lots of fines and a little bit of gravel in it. It is kind of expensive though at $200 per semi load delivered vs. about $100 delivered for just regular topsoil. They said a load would be about 20 yards.

I really don't have anywhere close that I want to dig out to use my own fill. I have a pit about 100 yards from the site that I want to put the building but I would have to dig a road up out of that part of the pit because the road going into the pit would be about 300 yards. That would be quite a haul one bucket at a time with my FEL. I don't have a dump trailer or a dump truck to move the dirt with.

To put it down I've been told to spread 6" deep and drive over it with a bucket full of material back and forth to pack it in. Then spread 6" more etc. Does that sound right? How many times do you need to pack each layer and should it be watered down between packing?

The barn will have a 4" cement slab but the pad needs to be built up to level to before we put the slab down.

I think that should get things started. I appreciate all input and suggestions.

Thanks, Nathan

 

[srs]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">(
I have a local gravel pit that has some stuff they call cement waste that I think would make excellent fill. They screen it and it is really nice material and packs excellent with lots of fines and a little bit of gravel in it. It is kind of expensive though at $200 per semi load delivered vs. about $100 delivered for just regular topsoil. They said a load would be about 20 yards.
To put it down I've been told to spread 6" deep and drive over it with a bucket full of material back and forth to pack it in. Then spread 6" more etc. Does that sound right? How many times do you need to pack each layer and should it be watered down between packing? Nathan )</font>

Nathan, from what you are saying I would go with the "cement waste". I realize that it cost more but you are going to build the barn one time so why not do it right the first time. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif And yes you should put smaller layers, called "lifts" then compact each time. Watering the 'lifts' also helps to compact the cement waste. I'm no expert but other more knowledgeable members here at TBN have said to make sure the fill is compacted really good otherwise you'll get some nasty cracks in the concrete. Hopefully you'll have some photos for everybody. Good luck to you. Stanley

 

[3RRL]

What about cutting it down instead of filling? It might be less work and require les soil compaction on the cut part?

 

[npaden]

Unless I want to have a swimming pool I need to build the back side up rather than cutting the front down below the grade of the land around it.

 

[flusher]

Last June I had a 6" thick slab 24'x42' for a metal pole barn. The grade sloped about 18" along one of the diagonals (see attachment. The high point is the lower right corner; the low point is the far left corner).

Instead of cutting and filling or otherwise excavating, all my contractor did was dig the 12" x 12" trenches with his TLB for the footings and install his forms to make a level slab. Took extra concrete, but when you consider the cut/fill cost, it was a wash. Now I know I have a slab on solid, undisturbed soil that's not going anywhere.

 

[npaden]

That's actually what I had been sort of planning on and then coming in after the slab was poured but before the building was built and filling around it with topsoil sloping down to keep water from being able to run in underneath the slab and wash it out. I calculated out the cement that it would take and it did seem like it would be the way to go but not sure how long it takes 24" thick cement to cure.

That would also solve what some people are saying that a 4" thick slab isn't thick enough if I would ever want to put heavy equipment in the barn.

The contractor really didn't like that idea that much though. He wanted to build up the pad.

 

[EddieWalker]

I've never heard of using cement wash to build up a pad. I have a few problems with it, but none are overriding.

1. Getting compaction will take allot more effort. Gravel roads take a very long time to get compacted when driving cars over them. Those little fines need to work their way into every void created by the larger rock. Every single air void in the wash when you pour yor pad will lead to settling down the road.

What I don't know is if this is significant or not. Will it be more in some areas than others? Will it affect the integrity of your slab?

2. The price for cement wash is gonna be about the most expensive fill material you can use except for extra concrete.


Now for some alternatives.

The best is sand. Most places it's cheap and readily available. Nothing compacts as easily or as fully with minimal effort. In fact, sand is the only material that will self compact.

Next best would be dirt. Cheap, but harder to work with and compact.


Personallly, I'd fill with sand to a nice level base. Filling in the low spots with extra concrete is extremly wastefull with a very minimal benifit, and in some cases, it could be a bad idea. In your case, I doubt there would be a problem, just wasteful.

Good luck,
Eddie

 

[npaden]

I thought sand was next to impossible to compact?

 

[Egon]

Hope you remove the topsoil before adding any type of fill material.

A crushed granular product would work well for the backfill.

The cheapest is always atractive but only if applied in the long term.

Egon /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[rswyan]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I thought sand was next to impossible to compact? )</font>
Only from the standpoint that it's already 90%+ compacted when you dump it. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif