Feguson TO30

[bford]

Note attached image...............not my tractor but this should give you the general idea..........

 

[beenthere]

That is kind of what I thought about the fluid levels....................there is a steady flow of fluid around the pto shaft. It is NOT leaking from behind the pto housing. That tells me that the seal is bad. Once I get it apart, my plan was to replace the seal, gasket, and bearings................

I think I finally caught up....thanks for the pic of the "leak".

I was thrown off when you announced you found the culprit. The OP indicated a problem of the 3 ph arms not lifting. I would not think a leak around the PTO output shaft would cause the problem of "not lifting". However it may be the reason the fluid level is too low.

But now I'm thinking you feel you need to fix the seal at the PTO output shaft so the fluid can be brought up to the correct level, and then maybe the 3 ph will function right. Right?

 

[bford]

Beenthere, that is correct. Everything that I have read/researched tells me that if the fluid level is not at the correct height, the pump cannot engage, thus the 3pt not working. There are absolutely no other leaks that I can see both internally and external. When I took off the PTO cover, I had a steady flow of fluid and I am sure that the level has to be REALLY low or even empty. Thoughts?

 

[beenthere]

Thoughts?
What I would do would be fill 'er up with oil, and check out the 3 ph. If it works, then just one thing to fix...that is the PTO seal. (yes, will have to drain the oil out )

If it doesn't work, then decide what is not working. May then have to pull and service the pump, or the rockshaft piston, and can replace the PTO seal at the same time.

 

[Jerry/MT]

Maybe I should rephrase that..............it is not just a leak, but a steady stream coming out of the rear end around the PTO shaft. The guy that I bought the tractor from claimed that he filled it too full. My assumption is that the fluid level is WAY low, not even registering on the dipstick.

I have read several posts about how to park the tractor with the front lower than the rear to preserve as much fluid as possible and pull the PTO to replace the seals. I did what you had suggested in an earlier post and did not see any leaks, turbulence in the pump, etc. My thought was to replace the seal and bearings, fill to the correct level and give it a shot.

Yes, I am a newb to the tractor world, but consider myself fairly mechanically inclined and I feel confident that I can tackle this issue. Thoughts??

So then the lift doesn't work because of a lack of fluid resulting from a pto shaft seal leak. Makes sense but you could have found that out by checking the fluid level first.
None the less, here's what I would recommend. With an empty sump you don't have to worry about parking the nose of the tractor in a ditch.What is the condition of the hydraulic sump? You had the side plate off and apparently there was little to no fluid in the hydraulic compartment. Is there sludge and crud on the bottom of the sump? If so, drain the remainder of the fluid from the system by opening all three drain ports. (I don't know whether you realize that not only was your pump starved for fluid, so was the transmission and the rear axle since the all share acommon sump.) It'll take some time to drain everything out even though the sump appears empty.

Pull the pto shaft assembly by removing the four bolts that hold it in place and then pull the shaft straight out. It should come out easy unless it's been damaged and is twisted.(I hope that it is not damaged because the degree od difficulty increases dramatically.) Between the right side access plate and the pto shaft hole, you can get good access to to clean the sump. put a big pan underneath to catch the drainage and the using a garden sprayer, spray diesel fuel in the sump throught the side hole and the back holeand let that soften the sludge. Decant the diesel off the sludge /diesel mix and respray it in the sump again and keep repeating untill you can get the sludge out. Use a scraper or paper towels to get the remants out and then let the diesel drain out over night. Mop it one final time with paper towels.

Does your tractor have a 1-1/8" OEM pto shaft or a 1-3/8" pto shaft? If it has the smaller shaft and you want to go to the bigger shaft, now's the time to do it. For a~$120 +/-, you can get a a complete 1-3/8" shaft assembly to just place right back into your machine. It has the bearing retainer the bearing, the seals etc. if you want to keep the original shaft or if it has the 1-3/8" shaft all ready then you'll need to get the seal replaced and you might consider replacing the bearing also.
When you're done, you'll need 6 gallons of fluid to refill the transmisson/rear axle/hydraulics.

By the way, invest in a Ferguson Shop Manual (~$20) because it will tell you how your tractor is supposed to work and will enable you to work on your tractor easily. I'd also recommend you get a TO-30 Owners Manual so you can learn about the correct operating methods for your machine. You can find them on ebay and you can also google them up elsewhere.

 

[bford]

Jerry, beenthere, thanks for the great info! As you might have guessed, I am very new to my own tractor maintenance. I grew up with a Case VAC but Dad did all of the maintenance for obvious reasons. The tractor is in GREAT condition and for $2000 (sale included a Howse brushhog, King Kutter box blade, and a single bottom plow), I could not turn it down. Did not even think to look at the PTO seal. Learning as I go.

Thanks again and I will let you know how everything turns out.

Regards,

 

[bford]

A couple more questions:

- Does the PTO need to be engaged before pulling the shaft?
- Can the seal be replaced without pulling the shaft?

Thanks

 

[beenthere]

You may give it a shot, and remove the four bolts shown holding the bearing housing. Then see if the housing will slide off the shaft (look for a snap ring that keeps the shaft in place. That may allow you to change out the seal and the gasket.
I would expect the easiest might be to just remove the shaft.
Remove and replace the four bolts evenly to avoid stress on the ears of the casting.

I'd recommend following Jerry's good advice, and be sure the sump is clean.

 

[Soundguy]

the hydro pump picks up oil from the lowest part of the sump. if you still have a leak at the pto.. the pump intke is submerged in oil.

i'd look to see if the control fork is moving the control valve on the pump body..



soundguy

Maybe I should rephrase that..............it is not just a leak, but a steady stream coming out of the rear end around the PTO shaft. The guy that I bought the tractor from claimed that he filled it too full. My assumption is that the fluid level is WAY low, not even registering on the dipstick.

I have read several posts about how to park the tractor with the front lower than the rear to preserve as much fluid as possible and pull the PTO to replace the seals. I did what you had suggested in an earlier post and did not see any leaks, turbulence in the pump, etc. My thought was to replace the seal and bearings, fill to the correct level and give it a shot.

Yes, I am a newb to the tractor world, but consider myself fairly mechanically inclined and I feel confident that I can tackle this issue. Thoughts??

 

[Soundguy]

the pto shaft seal will change out just like an N shaft seal.. need to pull shaft assy, remove retainer clip drop bearing carrier off, drive out seal.. drive in new seal ( 1 5/8 socket works great ).. slip bearing carrier back on shaf tif the bearing is good and wear ring on the pto shaft is good.. reinstall clip.. reinstall shaft assy with new gasket..

soundguy