First Truck for a Tractorman

[DVerbarg]

Glenn,

Like Bird said, don't believe a word a sales person tells you at a dealer when it comes to engineering numbers.

It sounds like towing a trailer will be a sporadic activity. If the truck is to be used all the time for commuting with only an occasional tow then some of the smaller trucks can work OK if you are in flat lands and you have a large enough engine and appropriate transmission. Had a '81 GMC half-ton (6 cyl) that I used to pull a 16ft trailer. Ruined the transmission "torque convertor" locking mechanism when pulling 6000 lbs on flat roads at 45 mph for 25 miles. Transmission still worked fine, the "overdrive" just never worked again (and fuel economy dropped 3 mpg).

Since getting rid of the truck I have used my parent's Ford 3/4 ton van to tow the trailer with my TC40D. Not sure which engine they have but know that it is one of the smaller 8 cylinders. Have to baby it, even in these flat lands. Also wish I had trailer brakes. But for the occasional tow every few months, it seems to be OK. If I were going to be towing every couple of weeks I would have to get another truck. I would get a 3/4 ton Diesel. The diesels get much better fuel economy for the same amount of torque. Diesels usually last longer but the fuel usually costs a little more. My ideal truck would have the sterotypical reliability of the Toyota name, the frame and diesel engine of the Ford, the front suspension of the Chevy, and the looks of the Dodge.


DaveV

 

[Kelvin]

You say that you have decided that you may go for an extended cab but not a quad cab. How are you defining "quad cab"? To some, that is a 4-door pickup. In the full-sized Dodge, Quad Cab is the extended cab model with the rear doors that open up.

I personally feel that an extended cab truck with rear doors is the way to go. For convience and resale value. All you have to do is put a set of golf clubs in the back seat or a set of tools in the rear floor board a time or two before you realize how nice it is to not have to fight the front seats.

Dodge Dakota: I have the older model non-aerodymanic Dakota Club Cab (4x4, V8 with 3:92 axle ratio) which I use to tow my 6.5x16' dual axle trailer with B2150 with FEL and finish mower (the B2150 is slightly heavier than the B2710 and B2910) when I am not using the '74 Ford Rollback. It has 6 seat belts and is suitable as a backup family vehicle, but the back seat is not especially large; the newer model that you may be looking seems even smaller to me. My Dakota does an excellent job pulling the load and an adequate job stopping the load (I do have to have my front rotors turned more often than I used to before the towing duties began...). The 2001 models are rated to tow over 6,000lbs when properly equipped (ie, towing package). I strongly recommend the V8 engine and the 3.92 axle ratio if you go with the Dakota.

Toyota: I believe that the Tundra V8 is the only Toyota to consider. I don't know what the tow ratings are. The Tundra is labeled as a "full sized" pickup and is larger than the Dakota.

Chevy, Dodge & Ford Full Sized Trucks: As has been mentioned, a full size truck is probably the best way to go for towing. You don't want a dually (4 wheels on the rear). Other than looking at the model number or the number of lugs on the wheels the 1/2 and 3/4 ton trucks look pretty much alike. For the "properly equipped" Dodge full size with V8 or larger engine, the towing capacity starts at 7170 lbs for the 1/2 ton and 8400 for the 3/4 ton models. The V10 and diesel 3/4 models' towing capacity starts out about 13,000 lbs. Ford and Chevy specifications are similiar.

1969 Dodge Charger: My first car was a copper-colored 1969 Plymouth Road Runner and like you, wished I still had it.

Good luck. Sounds like you are going through the same experience as buying the first tractor.

Kelvin

 

[Bird]

<font color=blue>1969 Dodge Charger: My first car was a copper-colored 1969 Plymouth Road Runner</font color=blue>

Being a little older than you kids, it was a long ways from my first car, but I bought one of the first ('68) Road Runners; green metallic and my wife wishes she still had it./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif It sure would scat, but I still remember what kind of gas mileage it got, too./w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif

Bird

 

[Bird]

Glennmac, for an example of the trailering chart I mentioned in the previous post, go to http://www.chevrolet.com/silverado/index.htm and click on the "trailering chart" in the upper right corner and it'll list the different trailer weights for different Chev. pickups with different engines and differentials. You can pull trailers in excess of 8,000 lbs. with a properly equipped half ton pickup (of course you may not like it as well as a 3/4 ton).

Bird

 

[RobertN]

Sure, 8000-8800 is probably just right.

So, you have a 2000lb trailer. Now, lets add equipment... Based on what I have, and yes, some weights are guesstimates...

2000 Trailer
1300 Kubota B8200
500 Scraper
400 rotary mower
800 loader
100 tools, shovels, tie downs, "ect"
50 ice chest, beer/soda/tea, sandwich
40 5gal diesel
---------
5190lbs estimated

So, now, most ad's I see on tv talk about 5000lb trailer capacity for various 1/2 tons. So, you are already exceeding that. So, you only tow occasionally, yet you are exceeding 100% of the capacity of the truck. Even with trailer brakes, you are in a dangerous zone. What happens when that kid chases the ball right out in front of you? You are overloaded and can't miss them...

So, I jaust pulled that yesterday during a side job behind my 8800lb rated 3/4 ton. I still had plenty of safety room; I was only running the truck at 59% capacity. Now, add the yard of road base I need to haul Monday, in the bed, whil I still have the above load on the trailer; I'm still in the safe zone. It may not be pretty when I react to miss the above mentioned kid, but it should be safer.

So, a 3/4 ton truck is very reasonable for hauling these tractors around.

RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

 

[RobertN]

Add up the numbers like the ones I posted before reading this; that's what you want to take to the dealer. When you look at the numbers, remember, you doun't want your load at 100 % of what the truck can handle. Just because it can, does not mean you want to operate it there.

RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

 

[glennmac]

Looked at trucks. By quad, I mean the 4 door models. Yes, I can understand the convenience of the 4 doors, but they get their extra length at the expense of shortening the truck's bed. I dont want another passenger vehicle; I want a hauling vehicle.

I think we are overemphasizing the trailering. It would only be very occasional, but it is hilly here. Hauling implements and lumber and gravel and logs and commuters will be what it does the vast majority of time.

Talk about complicated! Dodge gave me a 21 page brochure entitled 2001 Towing Guide. Definitions, acronyms, formulas, tables, Class I to IV, axle ratios, engines, weight distributing hitches, geese necks--this is rocket science.

Robert, your math makes a good point. Then when I add in my weight, we've even got a worse problem.

Aside from all this fuzzy trailer math, my first reaction is that the Dakota is too big. Saw a Tacoma and it looked a little small, and I didnt like that it was so very high off the ground. They must make it for so-called offroading. I say off road, schmoff road. Nobody does that. This is Connecticut, not Afganhistan! I might like something something between the size of the Dakota and Tacoma, which could handle maybe 6500 pounds.

By the way, I cant relate anything to this 1/2 ton 3/4 ton terminology everyone is slinging around. None of the literature uses that terminology, none of the elaborate definitions use it, and none of the weight capacity or payload statistics are anywhere near as low as 1/2 ton, which as I recall is 1000 lbs.

I said my first new car was the Charger. I have no doubt, however, that Bird owned a car earlier than I did. I think the legal driving age in Texas is about 14yrs old (compared to 18 in New York), and from my two years living in Austin I think the actual driving age was as low as 10 yrs old out in the boonies.

 

[kerr]

69 charger,black ,mickey thompson wheels ,big ol fat tires.440-4barrel,4-speed 15 yrs old.Alabama was kinda easy ta get around in.O,8 trek tape player!Get a 3/4 ton full size GMC long wheel base.Any engine ya want ,your set.

 

[Wheeldog]

cowboydoc,

This thread is pretty well moved along and it sounds like glenmac has gotten some good guidance. Given the fact that many people here (including myself) respect your views quite a bit, I have to respond to a couple of statements that you made.

<font color=blue>Also they are a relatively new design and they have been redesigning them ever since they came out to get them right. </font color=blue>
What are you referring to here? The original Toyota 4x4 pickup was sold from between 1979 and 1995 and was very much the same design throughout. EFI was added in the early 80's, the front suspension was changed in 86'(?), and a V6 option was added in the late 80's. Other than that, the changes were sheet metal for the most part. The Tacoma came out in 1995 and still uses the same two engines, same transmissions, same suspension - just cosmetic changes as I understand it. If anything Toyota is usually criticized for not changing their truck designs more often. Are you referring to the Tundra (new in 1999, I think)? What exactly do they keep re-designing?

<font color=blue>The new Fords, not to say Chevy and Dodge don't just not as familiar with them, are every bit as reliable as the Toyota</font color=blue>
What sort of evidence are you basing this on?

Rob

 

[Bird]

Actually, Glennmac, my first drivers license was in Oklahoma at the age of 16 (moved to Texas shortly before my 17th birthday), but yes, I started driving my aunt's car ('47 Ford coupe) when I was 11. And Dad was mad at me and her both when he found out./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

Bird