Gravel driveway help.

[mjncad]

First I want to thank everyone who replied so quickly.

Need lots of fines to work into the recycled concrete rock. Sounds like you didn't get any.
Just the 1" x 3/4" ends up like marbles.

Yep, like driving on marbles. The 5-ton vibratory roller did great; but it's that turn into the garage that's tearing both driveways up.

I've got about 10 - 12 tons of road base, which is about like crusher fines left that I'll spread on mine and compact.

For starters, the soil under the gravel driveway must be well-drained and strong. It also must be free of any organic material like sticks, tree roots and leaves or grass. All topsoil must be stripped off the driveway location and stockpiled for use at some other place on your lot. It is a very bad practice to build a driveway on top of spongy topsoil filled with organic debris.

In our case it is strong as we left the builder installed material in place. Over the course of 10-years it was packed down well. I had to dig some of it out at the concrete aprons so we could get a good transition. It was a good thing I have a toothbar on my loader as the original stuff took some doing to crack through. Any organic material was removed.

Water is the enemy of gravel driveways and any roadway. Surface water can erode the gravel off the surface of the driveway and subsurface water can turn strong subsoil into a quagmire. The weight of cars and trucks pressing down on a gravel driveway is not much different than the powerful hydraulic pressure used on construction machinery, car lifts and any other machine that uses the leveraged force of hydraulics.

The mud bog issue we had was due to the driveways being at the same level as surrounding yard. This allowed dirt to wash over the driveway making it a mess to drive and walk on in winter.

Water that is forced under pressure under the gravel can transport silt from the subsoil into the gravel. As the silt squeezes between individual pieces of gravel, it causes the friction bonds between individual pieces of gravel to weaken. When this happens, your gravel driveway can fall apart in no time.

It is often a great idea to install a geotextile fabric on top of the subsoil before the first layer of gravel is installed. This fabric prevents the silt in the subsoil from fouling the gravel. These products come in wide rolls and can easily be installed by two people who just unroll the fabric allowing it to lay on the soil. On windy days it needs to be covered quickly with a 4 or 6-inch-thick layer of crushed gravel. If you don't do this, the fabric might end up on your neighbor's lot.

We thought about adding fabric; but didn't due to cost considerations.

The first layer of crushed gravel needs to be a larger-sized gravel. Try to locate stones that are the size of baseballs or even softballs. Never use gravel that is rounded as each piece can move easily when pressure is applied to it. Angular gravel interlocks with adjacent pieces and the combined mass can act as on larger piece of rock.

Add additional layers of crushed rock in 4-inch thick layers with each layer being a smaller sized stone. Compact each layer with a mechanical roller or tamping machine. The final layer of gravel should have pieces of angular stone no larger than a golf ball, with many of the stones being the size of marbles. If you can install 10 - 12 inches of gravel on top of the geotextile fabric, you should have a gravel driveway that will last decades.

Since we only went 3" deep on the gravel, we chose the 1" x 3/4" rock versus the 1-1/2" x 3/4" rock. In hindsight, I think we should have ordered a 50-50 mix of both types.

Be sure the gravel driveway has a crown in it. This means the center of the driveway is always higher than the two edges. The crown allows water to flow off to the sides of the driveway preventing any ponding of water on the gravel surface.

Gravel driveways need some periodic care in the form of grading or dressing. Low spots need to be filled with gravel scraped from any high spots. If your driveway has curves, you will discover that car and truck traffic tends to push loose gravel to the outer edges of the curves. This gravel needs to be brought back to the center and inner part of the curves.

Any driveway will need maintenance, which we know. Asphalt and poured concrete were out of the question due to cost, and how they react with our expansive soils.

Gravel driveways built on hillsides need ditches on the high side of the driveway. These ditches capture surface water that runs down the hill and otherwise would run across the driveway. Larger angular rocks should be placed in the ditch to slow down the speed of the running water in the ditch. Monitor the ditch to ensure the running water is not cutting too deep a channel or eroding the ditch causing failure of the gravel driveway.

Fortunately our driveways are on fairly flat ground with any slope running more or less parallel with the slope.

OPTION 2 - The build up should go as follows - the first layer will be #3 stone (fist size); the second will be #57(little less than ping pong ball); and the final will be #21-A, or called crusher run (thumb nail sized stone with stone dust mixed in with it).

I like how each part of the country has different designations for stuff.

With a layered set up like this, you will have a driveway that will last many, many years.

Build A Gravel Driveway

Put some fines on top of the recycled concrete. Recycle concrete has no bonding agents. So put down some sreenings or fines

Yup..Some powder would probably help. I use 2A with powder and it packs like concrete. My neighbors covered the last 500ft of our road with straight 2A without and fines...That stuff is moving all over the place. Like driving on a pillow. My 500 FT with the powder is like cement.

That's my next step using the left over road-base I have as its mostly fines.

Regardless of how well built it is all gravel driveways require regular maintenance. I live at the end of a 1 mile long private gravel road. My lower neighbor maintains the 1st half mile and I the second half. Sounds like you have some settling issues going on. It's a waste of time and money to tear it out and rebuild it IMO so you're best bet is to devise a maintenance schedule after adding some fine particulates to help keep the rock from shifting. The most important rule we have on our road is SLOW DOWN. We have 10 MPH signs posted. Loose gravel is very easy to loose control on and the faster you go the more it will tear up your road especially when it's wet. 7

Slow is good; turns are what's tearing it up.

Again: what they said

The above image was my new driveway as it was being installed back in late summer of 2005 - topsoil dug out down to clay, geotextile fabric laid down, covered with a base course of #1's & #2's, then topped with crusher run, which had tons of fines in it.

It was mostly compacted by us driving over it with our vehicles (cars, trucks, tractor) .... although having those dumptrucks roll down it loaded a time or two no doubt helped.

Five years later and it is holding up extremely well - there are one or two small places (shallow potholes) that need some minor attention - and they likely wouldn't even be a problem ...... if I could train my wife to not drive right dead-center thru the middle of them when it's wet out and there is a little standing water in the potholes :confused2:

It looks pretty much like a "dirt" road - but it's really not (so if you are going for a different aesthetic it might not be for you) - it's a rock road. I was going for solid roadbase and really didn't care about the initial looks - with the idea that it would eventually be paved, probably with asphalt.

When it is dry, it's about like concrete ..... when it's wet, it's softer (surface mostly) - but provided you don't spin the tires and drive like a maniac it will support alot of weight ... even when wet. It's solid enough that it really hasn't even developed any tire track ruts.

I have had to do almost zero maintenance on it .... although at this point it could probably use a little crusher run in a few spots, and it might be time to do the bi-annual "hit-it-with-the-landscape-rake" thing ......

Looks good, and we expect to have to add some crusher run to it and a dressing with a blade/rake/bucket from time to time.

 

[PILOON]

Instaed of pricy geotextile fabric, I have seen some folks use old carpeting.

Most carpeting nowdays is synthetic so it has most of the geotextile's desired qualities.
Main problem is obtaining suitable quantity, however I am shure that a commercial carpet layer that serves hotels or office complexes would be happy to donate his remouvals as he'd probably have to pay to dump the stuff.

 

[gwjd]

i have cleaned tons of the stuff up out of the river bottom park lands the dirt will not go threw it much and it gets really heavy and plants will rarely grow threw it but a bunch of mix and match pieces not sure if they have the same effect. but the free price tag is attractive i would build a small test zone say 2x2 foot with some lumber on the sides and put in some local soil then your rock mix then get it Sophey wet and see if the dirt comes threw or the rock fines get out

 

[AlanB]

Looking at your responses, cost is a consideration (as it always is with me) You may find that you can get "washout" from the local concrete plant for free (or pay for delivery) and there are lots of fines and binder stuff in that stuff.

Good luck sorting it out.

I keep joking that I am actually installing a gravel drive in China, it is just taking a bit to get there.

 

[doall]

me too Alan. Probably 18 yards every couple of years. But it's pretty solid, just keeps going down.

 

[mjncad]

An update. I put down 10-tons of 1/2"-minus crusher fines the other day and mixed it in. I still need to do some touch up work; but so far, so good.