New PT, New Problems

[marrt]

Well, in the course of the day, I had time to do a little battery research since my tractor isn’t working (btw, did I mention my tractor is broken). What I found startled me. Here are the highlights:

- There are basically three types of common batteries on the market: Flooded (the most common and an apt description to what this type of battery did to my poor little ole PT), GEL, and AGM (Absorbed Glass Mat). Unlike Flooded cells, GEL and AGM batteries are hermetically sealed and operate under pressure to recombine the oxygen and hydrogen produced during the charge process back into water. In short, they don’t leak under normal circumstances and require no maintenance. Optima is a fairly common brand of AGM battery.

- All batteries are EXTREMELY sensitive to temperature. “For every additional 15 degrees of heat over 77 deg F, lead acid battery life (regardless of type) is cut in half (batteries self-destruct with time, you can only slow that process).”

- AGMs and GELs have very high vibration and G force tolerance. They are commonly used in the aircraft and marine industries.

- AGMs and GELs have other appealing qualities such as the ability to operate in any orientation, the ability to dispense a charge at a higher rate the Flooded batteries, and the ability to maintain a charge much longer than Flooded batteries under storage conditions.

Most batteries are extremely sensitive to charging voltage. AGMs and GELs for example prefer a charging voltage that does not exceed 14 volts. However, according to the Kohler engine manual, the normal charging range for the CH25 is 13.8-14.7. Combined with the high ambient temperatures experienced in the engine compartment, a charging voltage above 14 volts is very problematic. I noted previously that the rear hitch on the tractor got so hot that I could barely touch it. I’m guessing it was 130-140 degrees. In these conditions, any battery will suffer and, in general, charging should be stopped completely when the battery temperature exceeds 125 degrees.

Next Steps.
At this point, I’m seriously considering replacing the standard PT Flooded battery with a GEL or AGM battery. However, even if the charging voltage is “normal”, I think the engine compartment is too hot for any battery. Therefore, I may need to relocate the battery (although I have no idea where). Based on what I’ve learned, I’m surprised others haven’t had problems with battery leakage. Be sure to watch this during the summer as temperatures rise.

 

[PTRich]

This is my second year with my PT425, I run it very hard even in the heat. My battery has never shown any problems. The battery is located very low, heat rises. Is there a crack in your battery or did it leak out the top? I would also bet that Power Trac will send you a new battery and paint.

I used my tractor today to repair my driveway, it got washed out Friday night. I dug a 60 foot long trench, spread a load of aggregaite and back bladed with 2 large rocks in the bucket. All at full throttle for about 3 hours working the tractor very hard. The machine was hot and I had no problems, I am sure yours will work out.

Please keep us informed

 

[Carpenter]

I have to agree with Rich. It seems if the problem was with the battery type or 425 design, that the rest of us would have had similar problems. It looks like the only different factor is the new and "improved" muffler. I wonder if it has anything to do with your problems.

Anyway, I hope you get it figured out quickly. I know it must be frustrating, not to be able to use your new tractor. Good luck, and keep us posted.

 

[duane]

I'm going to see if I can find a thermometer to place in my engine compartment to see how hot it gets. With the engine and hydraulic cooling fan pulling in outside air, it will be interesting. The muffler is like a little wood stove.

Duane

 

[deadstick]

I have the same style muffler and I'm running it 4hrs a day in 92+ degree heat with no problems (knock on wood ). Now myself on the other hand I tend to overheat, but it's hard to get off when you're having so much fun

 

[ernemats]

Sorry to hear of your problems. I have had my pt422 for over 2 years and 300 hours , I have used it in temperatures of 90 degrees plus for 3 hours or longer at a time mowing with no problems with the battery or anything else. Just hang in there and talk to power trac about your problems. Good luck.

 

[Scott_F]

marrt,
I was just getting ready to start a new thread when I read yours. While I was mowing this weekend, I noticed the fan wasn't running. Checked the fuse - blown. Put a new one in, worked a while longer - noticed the fan wasn't working, checked the fuse - blown. Haven't had a chance to troubleshoot or call Power-Trac yet. Will call them this afternoon if I get a chance. Let me know if you figure anything out. Haven't noticed my battery leaking, but I will check when I get home.

Scott

 

[davesisk]

Just a thought, but check the fan for blockage or difficulty in spinning, etc. Usually, there's something making it draw more current (like leaves, dirt in the bearings, worn brushes, etc.), thus blowing the fuse. Just worked through something like this on one of my vehicles...

HTH,
Dave

 

[marrt]

I called PT this morning. Don’t have much time (I’m at work) but here is the short story:

- Leaking Battery: this was a big surprise to PT. Don said I may be “the first ever.” So, this is obviously not a common problem. Don suggested I have the battery tested by an Interstate dealer as it may be bad. If so, they will replace. If not, I will need to test the voltage from the charger to see if it within spec. One thing to note is that the battery leaked from both caps.

- Blow Fuse: Don said I should check if the fan had seized or was obstructed in any way. Don suggested I try to turn the fan with my hand. If it moves, apply power to the fan by jumping the relay. If it runs, put a new fuse in a see what happens.

- Damaged Paint: PT offered to send me some paint. I said I would look locally first. The number is Sherwin Williams F77 G 13. The exact part number for the 5 gallon container (which SW can use if the above number doesn’t work) is 5010-04618. I went to a SW store and they needed two weeks to order at $37 per gallon. Since this is on the inside of the tractor (and it is a tractor after all) I may just use a close substitute from TSC. PT offered to send me some paint but they don’t have any in a spray can and I don’t have a sprayer. I will probably get some from them later.

- Damage to Tractor from Overheating: Don said this was highly unlikely. Mentioned that some of the other versions don’t even have fans (which I knew) and that I really didn’t run it long enough anyway. I looked at the hydraulic oil and engine oil and both looked and smelled new. So, I agree with the others that I didn’t likely hurt anything.

- Muffler: Didn’t have a chance to investigate this issue. Will save for a later call.

So, the bottom line is that I have more testing to do to determine the root cause. More Later.

 

[davesisk]

Sounds like you had a positive call. I've talked to Don several times myself. He's a really nice fella, and I'm amazed at his knowledge of these machines. He was able to tell me details about mine even though it's 12 years old...

Good luck with your troubleshooting!
Dave