Chains Straps or chains

[LarryRB]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Are there any accessory stores on line from which I could get one of these items? I but I have never come accross a company that deals in tie down chains.
John M )</font>

any home depot or lowe's sell grade 70 chains. About 25.00 for a 30 ft 3/8th gr70.. Here at the scale in Union CT, they will fine you for using straps to any "live" load. They consider any machinery or vehicle with rubber tires, as a live load, therefore,., gr70 chains or better is all they allow,

 

[jcmseven]

Hydraman,

I appreciate your insight and that of others as well. When I stated my scratch the paint statement, I was not being coy, but merely stating why scratch up your equipment if you do not have to and be safe? As for hooking by attachments, I would not do that alone, but when combined with frame hookup also it seems it would give multiple points of contact. To me adding another mounting of a chain to a loader mount makes sense. One could probably hang the tractor by the loader, so although it is technically an attachment if one hooks to it and the frame, that should be pretty sturdy.

John M

 

[Highbeam]

I've often wondered about the requirement to chain down the loader or implement. Those attachments are attached to the tractor very well. Much better than the chain hooks are attached to the chain.

I would not use straps on your tractor, mainly for just the reason you stated. They get old and get weak with time and exposure to the elements and you don't know how much strength is left.

My vote for you, and what I do, is four chains and four ratchet binders, all attached between the frame of the tractor and the frame of the trailer such that they restrain the tractor side to side and front to back. Most folks like G70 chain and it is certainly the ideal chain grade for binding.

A bullring in the center front and rear of the trailer is insufficient. The trailer tie down points need to be along the outer edge.

Hooks on the loader or rear implement are not sufficient to hold the tractor on the trailer. Use the frame of the tractor or something bolted to the frame of great strength.

I really, really, like those NH hooks for preventing paint damage.

 

[Dargo]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Hooks on the loader or rear implement are not sufficient to hold the tractor on the trailer. )</font>

I know what you say is universally accepted as true, but why is that? If there is a sudden shock load great enough to pull the loader off of my tractor, I don't know about in your case, but I'd bet in my case that shock load would be great enough to rip the attachment point off of the trailer. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif The same goes for my rear box scraper, If a shock load is strong enough to rip the 3 pt. attachment point lugs off of the box scraper, I think I will be long past having many other serious issues.

Again, I am agreeing with you, but wondering where they get their logic?

 

[Hydraman]

When one hits a bump at speed, the inertial stress is more longitudinal (forward and back) than vertical, and these stresses are multiplied with speed and weight ( whiplash effect) is why your straps broke. Your tractor was moving one direction ( forward) and the bed of your trailer ( in relation to the tractor) another. This is especially true in "bumper pull" trailers, more so than gooseneck or 5th wheel. If you take the hitch of a stationary trailer, and move it up and down, you can see the bed move back and forth over the wheels. This same action will take place while rolling down the highway. Hope this helps you to understand some of the dynamics involved in trailering. Also, as the load gets higher, as in tractor, the effect is multiplied by the height. I know that the most of the weight on a tractor is carried lower than the seat and ROPS; but it is still not like carrying an iron block. Also, if the brakes are set, and the wheels chocked, this helps to prevent any movement of the "live" load. Don

 

[Highbeam]

"( Hooks on the loader or rear implement are not sufficient to hold the tractor on the trailer. )

I know what you say is universally accepted as true, but why is that? If there is a sudden shock load great enough to pull the loader off of my tractor, I don't know about in your case, but I'd bet in my case that shock load would be great enough to rip the attachment point off of the trailer. The same goes for my rear box scraper, If a shock load is strong enough to rip the 3 pt. attachment point lugs off of the box scraper, I think I will be long past having many other serious issues.

Again, I am agreeing with you, but wondering where they get their logic?"

That goes back to the first question of why we chain down the tractor and the implement separately. It seems that someone doesn't trust the attachment of these implements to the tractor. Whether it be to keep the implement on the tractor/trailer or to keep the tractor attached to the implements which are chained to the trailer. Look at your chain hooks and see the little tiny pin with the cotter on one side that keeps the chain/hook combo together. Then look at the pins that hold the loader to the tractor.

Maybe it is the slop in the implement attachment. Those pins aren't really tight compared to the frame connection is a rigid one with less chance for human error.

I have actually thought about why it is necessary to chain down the loader. It is one thing if you leave the engine running and the hydraulics might mysteriously raise the loader.

 

[Ryno1]

Well I'm going to be the bad guy here You say ' I have used straps to this point, but I have never really felt they would offer much resistance if the load got moving in the wrong direction." So you risk the lives of other drivers/passengers by hauling a load YOU know isn't safely tied down?

" There have been a few reasons why I have not yet switched to chains: first I have not wanted to scratch up the machinery," This is a poor excuse for risking the lives of other people.


"It waffled all down the road delivering it the other day, and that was with parking it well and all. The crosswinds were bad, and there were a couple times where I felt the tractor was driving the truck. " Your either overloaded or improperly balanced. When the trailer is waffling and driving your truck - PARK IT. Find out what the problem is, correct it and then continue.


"I want a system that is easy to use, quick to attach and detach and would hold the tractor on the trailer if the road were upside down. Small task, huh?" Chains and binders aren't hard or time consuming but it really doesn't matter. Quick and easy doesn't work into the equation, safe. solid and sure do.

Sorry, it's not often I sound off but... Anyway jcmseven error on the safe side please.

 

[RegL]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( </font><font color="blueclass=small">( Hooks on the loader or rear implement are not sufficient to hold the tractor on the trailer. )</font>

I know what you say is universally accepted as true, but why is that? If there is a sudden shock load great enough to pull the loader off of my tractor, I don't know about in your case, but I'd bet in my case that shock load would be great enough to rip the attachment point off of the trailer. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif The same goes for my rear box scraper, If a shock load is strong enough to rip the 3 pt. attachment point lugs off of the box scraper, I think I will be long past having many other serious issues.

Again, I am agreeing with you, but wondering where they get their logic? )</font>

Not saying what's right or wrong, but I believe power trac uses a quick attach plate bolted or welded to their trailer. Drive in and connect loader to quick attach. I don't know what they use in the rear, but I guess they feel the loader is strong enough to hold the front.

 

[hunterridgefarm]

John,
I have always used chains and rachet binders. I have in the past used heavy duty straps to tie down implements.

I do agree with everyone else, 4 chains and 4 rachet binders. Also in NC you are required to tie down the FEL and any implement. This is where I use the straps but I will by going to chains soon for the FEL and implement.

You can buy the chain and binder at Tractor Supply and Northern Tool which are in the Asheville area. Also all the tractor dealers in my area carry the chain and rachets so check with your dealers.

I feel the same as you about scratching the paint on your tractor. You can get pipe insulation to wrap around the chains; I have even seen people use sections of bike tires for protection.

 

[jcmseven]

Ryno,

I do not think you are the "bad guy", just mistaken. I never place others at risk by intention, thus is the reason for starting this post. My DEALER suggested the strap concept to me, and I think he is a bright guy and has hauled a lot of tractors to and from various places. He also lives in a much flatter area than I, and might not know exactly the topography in which I live. My big question was, and I now think the answer is "no" by now, whether a thick braided strap offers or can offer the same level of integrity of binding as a chain. A similar example of this would be with my other hobby: cycling. I have an older steel framed bike that has a frame weighing about four pounds. It is 4130 chromoly. I also have a carbon fiber frame weighing less than two pounds. Which one is stronger? The carbon, and by a lot. It is over five times stronger for compression and in lateral rigidity than the steel frame, and over 50, yes FIFTY, times stronger when corrected for weight. My inquisition was to see if similar tech applied to this application. When I said I was not sure about the tie downs, I really meant "Can I do better???" Why do I ask this: for safety. I want to haul things as efficiently as possible. Yes, time is important to me. Would I ever jeopardize a good tie-down job for the sake of time? No. Do I want to gouge up and scratch my expensive machine? No. Do I want my expensive machine to fly off my trailer and total it, me or someone else? No. Is it possible to achieve each of these things? I think so, and that is the reason for the post: do chains really offer a benefit over the newer material straps? The group at this point seems to think so, and that is good enough for me. As for the waffling comment being taken as noted, realize that I no longer own the machine in question. The MAIN reason for my desire to downsize? I did not feel with my current package I could safely haul it to and from my parents for whom I do work frequently, among other places, without jeopardizing safety. Even when balanced with a heavy truck and trailer, the machine I owned was a handful if windy or in bad weather and I cannot risk it. To assume that I take lightly the concept of safety is an erroneous assumption, but I do know there are people there like myself, who maybe do not have a lot of experience hauling, perhaps were led in one direction but are not sure that is best--thus the post. Thanks for the replies and the help.

John M