Tax breaks for small farmers?

   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #31  
You don't need to be a farmer to benefit from the depreciation of your tractor, truck, buildings, etc..., which is where the real tax benefits are. Being a farmer provides other benefits on top of tax deductions (such as being able to take your tax deduction at time of purchase).

All you need to do is set up a business (non-farming is OK) which requires all of the investments mentioned above (along with anything else you want to depreciate) to operate.

Your business needs to show some revenue (I think the minimum is $2400) to the IRS within a two year period, but there are ways around this as well (tree farming seems to be one way), which is why hiring an tax accountant with relevant small business experience is a really good idea. Business tax laws vary from state to state as well; another good reason to hire an accountant. Note that you can write off the cost of the accountant as well.

If you have a good income from your regular job, and set up a *real* small business on the side, the depreciation deductions from the business will translate into significant income tax savings from your regular job, which can be further spent on business improvements, propogating your depreciation write-off for future years.

If you are running a legitimate business, then you don't ever have to worry when the audit comes, because you'll easily be able to back up any claims you've made, with your accountant at your side, when the audit arrives. The audit *will* come, so you're best to expect and prepare for it rather than try to avoid it.

My wife and I are a case in point. We run a horse boarding business and a hot-rod business on top of our regular jobs. So far we have spent well over $150K of our regular income and savings on starting up the two business in the past year, and we've only shown a very small amount of revenue (around $10K) since we started.

However, our investment in equipment and business-related costs gets depreciated, which reduces our income tax significantly, and we expect both our businesses to grow over the years, to the point where both of us can retire from our 'day job'.

We have put together a very conservative business plan and don't expect to see any net profit for around six years. Revenue, however, is certainly climbing, and is expected to grow significantly as our place gets completed, allowing to transition into a very comfortable self-sufficient and self-owned operation as we reach an early retirement age.

The point is not to get out of paying taxes; you're going to have to pay at some point no matter what you do. The point is really to create a better life for yourself and to benefit society in the process. The government seems quite willing to help if you take the time to understand and play by their rules.
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #32  
There are a lot more than sales tax etc. If you need that new tractor, you can tell wife it's 28% paid for by IRS if we Sec179 it! Also this year I had a bit too good of a year and took advantage of Income Averaging for Farmers. I don't think Income Averagingt is offered any longer to gen public.
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #33  
Wow,
and my taxes this year are $2969 for a 2400sf house on 5 acres...and my assessment is going up 60%....
At this rate gonna have to become a squatter somewhere....
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #34  
<font color="blue"> 1) Property tax exemption (local)

It looks like the easiest and safest is to start with #1 and save several thousand per year.
Either one needs an accountant at first )</font> </font>

<font color="brown"> ************ </font>
In my county property listed by the auditor as agricultural is taxed at a much lower rate.
You don't have to be a farmer or farm the land so you don't need an accountant for that.
They go by the size of the land rather than the activity on it or your occupation.
Several years ago I bought 7.82 acres off of a 35 acre farm.
The 7.82 acres was already classified as agricultural property so I didn't have to do anything to get the lower agricultural rate.
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #35  
<font color="blue"> "Your business needs to show some revenue (I think the minimum is $2400) to the IRS within a two year period, but there are ways around this as well (tree farming seems to be one way), which is why hiring an tax accountant with relevant small business experience is a really good idea." </font>

This is a myth. The IRS requires that the business be operated for a profit and not as a hobby. To determine which it is, they may apply a number of 'tests.' None of the tests that I have seen in any IRS pub requires revenue within two years, nor have I seen any minimum revenue requirements.

If you mean profit instead of revenue, one of the tests requires a profit in two or three out of five years of operation, but that is only one of the tests, and even it doesn't have to be met if a sufficient number of the other tests are met.

Basically, you have to prove profit motive, not profit, and making a profit doesn't necessarily prove profit motive, according to the IRS. If they decide your business wasn't operated with a profit motive, your loss deductions are limited to no more than your actual profit -- what they call 'hobby losses.'
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #36  
<font color="blue"> "If you are a tree farmer and you are reforesting you do not need to show a profit." </font>

I understand this to be true. In fact, I'm counting on it. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

However, I haven't been able to find it in black and white in any IRS pub. Do you have any reference to a rule, ruling, or court order pertaining to this?
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #37  
Myth?

Credentials, please. What makes you the definitive source of information on this subject?

I'll ask my accountant to show me where she learned this information, she's the one who explained it to me. She claims 20 years of experience doing business taxes, and specializes in equestrian operations like mine.

Maybe I need a new accountant - I sure don't want to have to pay back the tax refund from last year!
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #38  
<font color="blue"> (Myth?

Credentials, please. What makes you the definitive source of information on this subject?) </font>

Ah, a challenge. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Take a look here under the section titled "Not-for-Profit Farming". Note the statement "In determining whether you are carrying on your farming activity for profit, all the facts are taken into account. No one factor alone is decisive. Among the factors to consider are whether:......." (Emphasis added, various IRS tests not shown)

You should also find that the referenced document does not use the term 'revenue,' except in regard to the agency itself, and the definition of profit has no minimum dollar amount required.

I think you will find the IRS has the same sort of rules for non-farm businesses, too.

<font color="blue"> "Maybe I need a new accountant - I sure don't want to have to pay back the tax refund from last year!" </font>

Here's how I would handle it. Walk into your accountant's office with a copy of the relevant IRS document and ask her to show you where she came up with her figures. If she can't, maybe you do need a new accountant.
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #39  
Not sure if this site will answer your questions regarding forestry, but it was helpul to me.

timber tax
 
   / Tax breaks for small farmers? #40  
Thanks for the reference to the document. Seems your about as sure this is a myth as I am that it's not. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I'm not trying to be a farm... my understanding of the rules for that say I need to produce something for sale ie beef, pork, vegatables, grain, etc... to qualify for that. Maybe I'll try growing some grapes in a few years, just for grins. I can drink the results.

From the doc you referenced it seems that profit is unnecessary, ever. That was my previous understanding as well. No laws (yet) against running a bad business. I'm not sure how revenue requirements are calculated, nor do I care that much... we are making ample and growing revenue now.

Regardless, the point is that to justify being a business, vs. a hobby, you need to show some rationale that it's more than a hobby... and significant, regular revenue certainly does a good job of that.

By the way, you still haven't faced the challenge and shown any credentials... you've just a given me pointer to a single government publication... sounds like your trying to DIY... my recommendation is 'Don't'. Best to get professional help; at least you have someone to point your finger at if things don't work the way you thought they should.
 
 
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