tiltmeter meeting

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

Rick,
You have my admiration and respect. From every indication and report, you are an honest, more than fair, industrious business man attempting to market a useful product that seems well received by the potential user, and is a "safety"
contribution in an area of well-recognized need ( tractor/heavy equipment-rollover injuries/deaths are numerous and constantly discussed in studies of agriculture/construction "hazards").

That you are meeting with more frustration than success in this worthy endeavor is a SORRY comentary on the state of affairs in this country re. "litigation".

It is a national disgrace that we have somehow permitted a situation to develop so that self-interested lawyers appealing to the worst in human nature, steer us by the elbow, lawsuit-in-hand, toward one another, promoting the idea that EVERYTHING that happens "to" us in this life is surely "someone's" fault (someone ELSE, that is) and they should be made to PAY !

I wish I could agree with Mark, that the lack of intelligence of manufacturers is the problem (that would make me less-angry). But I am certain that it is the FEAR of lawyers.. fed of course by their own lawyers... who know the ways of their-own-kind all too well.

These people have caused the slow erosion of more freedom in this land than any other group with their manipulation-for-self-gain approach to "helping" us with our legal "needs"... needs that only exist because THEY do.

My fury is quite likely making me ramble a bit... but I can't bring myself to apologize.

I am convinced Will Shakespeare had the right idea about these parasites.
I am not so convinced that my father was right (although he usually was)... He put it this way " It isn't fair to blame all lawyers for what 99% of them are like!"

With that in mind, I hereby exempt from my tirade the pitifully-few-in-number individuals of integrity and honor who have chosen that profession as being an admirable application of their gifts. We all make mistakes (I nearly made this very one, myself).

Rick, I am sure the fine people of this discussion group join me in offering all the encouragement that the appreciation of your fellows can give! I would like that sentiment to be the main thrust of this post.

But I know that my resentment at the "influence" of this segment of our society permeates my message. Quite simply, it is an OUTRAGE that a deserving person such as yourself... an exemplary "American success-story" in-the making, should find this obstacle in your path.

*(If my vigorous "free speech" is considered too-much, and deletion is to be my fate, I would like it to be a part of the record that I refrained, at a great cost in effort, from "expressing" myself by means of the string-of-profanities that fill my mind when I consider this subject.)

Rick, I wish you every success... and I do it INTENSELY!!

 

[BobT]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

Hi Rick,

Congratulations on your meeting with the OEM regarding implementing the Tiltmeter as a standard or optional safety item. Of course virtually every tractor owner instantly (or within a few days of riding) sees the value of this device. It is blatantly obvious.

However, bringing a device into an OEM manufacturing line takes considerable time and effort, usually 1-3 years, under favorable circumstances.

Do not become discouraged. It is really a great step forward to have a "first" meeting with these guys. Now, request meetings with all of the other OEM’s, the other “Big Three.” Develop a "plan of attack." Here are a few ideas.

Get the names and contact info for the whole slew of involved persons, from the CEO on down (company lawyers, engineers, marketing, design, etc.) about ten per company, say a total of 40-50 people.

Next, you want to refine your stats. I am pretty sure Muhammad would cooperate in devising a poll which could run for a couple of months, enough time to get 1-2,000 "votes."

Also, collect with names and addresses, all of the customer comments you receive. Ditto for cooperation here on the board.

Next, write (or hire somebody to write) two or three "newsey" articles about tractor safety, and the solution you provide (cheaply and easily). Of course, you will add your contact info in each article, and give it away to the mags free. I have a list of about 150 farm, ag and gardening related magazines and newspapers.

Finally, get the government involved! Yes! You must do it! These manufacturers will only take action if forced to. I would determine which government agency is responsible for farm safety, or product safety, and start writing them letters. You might even be able to appear before a congressional committee and give testimony about lack of safety devices on tractors. Believe me, the OEMs will look like total fools if such a committee gets hold of this info and puts it out to the news media.

Okay, I realize all of the foregoing is a lot of work, and will cost some dough. But, that is the path to follow if you are serious and determined. It CAN BE DONE. If you are persistent, you will in the end prevail. I say this because there is a true need, and you have a perfect solution.

In my opinion, it is not the fear of lawsuits or the buyer perception at all which makes the OEMs hesitate. It is only money. They don’t want to add a measly $50-80 to their cost, is all it is. You'll have to bring PUBLIC OPINION PRESSURE on them.

The only problem(s) I see is whether or not you have any kind of patent on this device. If not, forget the OEMs and put more effort into selling direct. If you do, then the OEMs will have to deal with you, probably. I say that because as any lawyer can tell you, any patent can be ignored, engineered around, etc. It happens all the time. Lawyers make a lot of fees over patent litigation ($400 an hour).

Persistence is all that counts. If you want to pursue this and believe in your product, this will ultimately be a grand success, is my prediction.

All the best,

BobT.

A Indiana Boy

 

[BobT]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

Hi Rick,

P.S. Get a Trademark on the name of your product, and EVERY TIME you mention it, use the mark, like this
TiltmeterTM. This way you'll start to build a Brand Name for your product, and everyone will know this is the market leading product, the premium preferred choice. Who, after all, wants the discount brand of a device that can save their life?

BobT.

P.S. You can file the TM app yourself on the Govt page. It costs about $375 filing fee is all. You can do all the paperwork, and take it to a trademark lawyer (if you want) for a final review, and save yourself a couple of grand. Go to http://www.uspto.gov/teas/index.html.

A Indiana Boy

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

Bob T,

My compliments and thanks for your offering Rick some very constructive and practical advice, as opposed to the morally supportive (I hope) but not very useful comment I posted.

[You sound knowledgeable about these things... makes me wonder (I'm not asking!) if you're among my "the few.. the exempt"!]

Anyway, "Attaboy" for a helpful AND encouraging post,

Larry

 

[BobT]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

Uh, dare I ask? What are "the few ... the exempt."

BobT.

A Indiana Boy

 

[roysallis]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

Rick,
Maybe you should market the Tiltmeter to state and local governments to use on their tractors. When the OEMs know that the governments are using them they may change their minds. Also, this would be a great sales opportunity if you can get some government agencies using them.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

BobT, scruffy, ihsmith, and all you guys,
WHAT ENCOURAGEMENT !!!!! I will be on the phone today
Trying to find out who all the guys are that call the shots.
If I was a big wig in one of these companies, and I saw
a few HUNDRED of comments like the last ones made here, I
would be BEGGING someone to sell me tiltmeters. I have
tried before to get these guys names. I think it would be
easier to get a list of U.S. secret service agents than a
list of these guys. I am very persistant. I will keep
trying. One of the truck o.e.ms. I met with on my trip
has asked me to develope a meter for a military "secret
truck ". He told me what he expects the meter to do, but
says I cannot see the truck. Says he would have to shoot me
if I saw it. Not going to be the easiest meter to build.
I was up until midnight last night working on the idea.
If you guys keep the comments coming, I will continue to
compile the information, and hopefully find the right
people to get it to. I, myself, and I believe you all too
would get much satisfaction knowing I had a hand in helping
get a product on a machine that could save who knows how
many lives. Even if the o.e.m. used someone elses meters, I
would feel great knowing I helped get the ball rolling.
As far as a patent, I have my products protected up to a
point, but my patent lawyer tells me that a few changes and
someone could take the idea any way. If I make the best
possible tiltmeters, and continuously try to improve my
products, (with your help) I believe I will always have
a good part of the market. Anyone can make tiltmeters, BUT
only one company can make the best. I plan on that company
being mine. Later Dudes. Rick

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

roysallis,
I have a nice market with many state highway depts. (28).
If comments keep coming like they are, along with my list
of current customers, and all other pertinent information I
can gather, I believe some o.e.m. will get the idea.
All I can say is I wish you guys all worked for me. Talk
about a sales force. We could sell Air conditioners to the
eskimos. Thanks, Rick

 

[bpence]

Rick, congratulations on some great firsts steps. You may be experiencing some degree of frustration over the outcome of your meeting with the OEM, but don't give up. Follow-up relentlessly, make suggestions, offer-offer-offer-offer, and then offer to help some more. I do speak from a position of some experience, working in a marketing/sales capacity for one of the big 3 auto companies in beautiful Southeast Michigan.

We, as consumers of tractors & related stuff, agree that there is a strong value proposition for your particular tiltmeter....a lot of us have put our money down for the product and more importantly, are "completely satisfied" with it. Sell that...."completely satisfied". In today's world you can't imagine the weight those two simple words can carry. Selling to an OEM is more than one presentation to a group of engineers, who as you probably learned are only part of the decision making group. You have to remember that ROPS and seatbelts, shielding, safety switch interlocks, and other safety related items were not installed on tractors willingly by the tractor manufacturers. Part of the reason some of those things are now standard equipment is due to a plea from the consumers as well as evolving government safety standards.

In the auto industry, safety in vehicles has become a major marketing tool for all of the companies. No one has "mandated" 100% of the safety items being built into cars and trucks to day, but the consumers (you and me) have made it clear through focus groups and other customer studies that they want safe vehicles. Period.

As tractor consumers, I would dare say we want safe tractors. I'm not talking about air bags and 5 mph bumpers, I'm suggesting things that help us operate the tractors in what I would call a "safe mode". To me, a tiltmeter is no different than a sticker on the visor of my Ford Explorer that warns me of the hazards of certain types of manuvers with an SUV type vehicle. I still have the choice to do as I choose, but I have been warned. Why is a tiltmeter or other safety oriented device any different?

I would recommend you ask the OEM to poll tractor customers about possible safety enhancements to their machines, including items like tiltemeters that don't necessarily prevent things from happening, but promote safer operation. Offer to help them do it. And not just their brand customers; they need feedback from a variety of tractor brand consumers. Let's be realistic, all manufacturers use focus groups, consumer test groups, in-market product reviews, and other means to gather data on product development and enhancement. No manufacturer wants to get into the nitty gritty safety stuff with customers if they don't have to, but if a company decides to get out in front on something like this, the right marketing approach can give them an edge on competition.

They talk about liability. Ask how many lawsuits are pending because a tractor rolled over, the operator was seriously injured, and was NOT wearing the seatbelt in conjunction with the ROPS. The lawsuits are there, I would guess in the product liability area. Good attorneys can easily move a jury from negligent operation to product design or flaw.

It's folks like me (and many of the folks on this board), the baby boomers, who will drive where the compact tractor industry goes over the next decade or two. They can choose to provide us what we want, or not. As a demographic group, we will get what what we want. Pretty demanding aren't we? That's fact, not hype. Have the folks you met with ask their marketing department who's buying their compact tractors and what kind of profile they have on the typical customer. Trust me on this one. We, the consuming generation, are the drivers here. If Kubota, John Deere, New Holland and all the other companies choose to listen to us, we'll buy their products. If not, someone will build the product we want......and we'll buy it. We're going to demand more than just a compact tractor. We're going to demand a safe and secure compact tractor.

OK, that's my 2 or 3 cents worth. A "completely satisfied" tiltmeter customer.

Bob Pence

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: tiltmeter / lawyers

Hi Bob,
The reference was to a statement in my original "tiltmeter/lawyer" post.

There are a "few" (possibly!) lawyers with character and integrity...who deserve to be "exempt" from my blanket condemnation of the breed.

This gives you the "flavor" of my post,... and explains my complimenting your "more useful" e-mail to Rick.

Larry