TODAY'S GUN TIME

[paulsharvey]

Can't tell you how many videos, guy shoots 1 group of 5, and calls one of the shots a flyer, and says this thing shoots 1 MOA "all day long". Bullcrap, it shot 1 group that you video, thats 1.47" but when you decide to delete 1 of the 5, you can call it a 1" group. In reality, you want humbled, shoot 20 rounds at 1 target, or shoot 7 SKUs of ammo, each at ita own target, and tell me it is 1 MOA all day every day.

I would feel comfortable shooting a rifle I know, with ammo I know, in my part of the world, anything sub 4 moa at deer. If I was shooting ground hogs and long range yotes; I would want something better.

All that said, I like to shoot small groups, and I Want my guns to shoot better than me. I enjoy the work of taking 2" groups, and finding ways to bring them down to 1.25" or 1" or 0.75". Now, to get those small groups, you often are shooting projectiles not intended for deer, (those 40gr VMaxs my gun likes). I would rather a hunting gun shoot a hunting load at 2 MOA than worry about how it shoots Sierra Matchkings, or Berger VLDs.

If you can set a 4" or 6" gong at hunting distance, and hit it 9 out of 10 times: call that your max range and enjoy.

BTW; luckily that 223 shoots 50gr GMX at like 1.5"; and that's what I use on deer if I take the 223.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

I never load match bullets for big game hunting guns. My first choice will be either a Nosler partition, or ballistic tip. If it will shoot those (most of the time), I'm "settled" on the bullet. I will use varmint bullets for match shooting with no worries, if they meet my accuracy requirement, because you're either trying to punch a hole in paper, or just whack a steel gong, so whether it's a "varmint" bullet or a "match" bullet is going to perform the same function. It comes down to which bullet worked up into an acceptable load for that rifle. I also prefer not to use "match" bullets while prairie dogging. I prefer varmint bullets that will come apart easily when hitting bean bears or skipping off of the ground at range. Only exception to that is my 6.5x284 shoots a 139 gr Lapua scenar (match bullet) better than any varmint bullet I've been able to try. The 140 gr LR-VLD Berger is a close second. I just have to be *very* careful about what's down range in case that bullet "skips" off the ground. I'm very particular on where or when I'll use that rifle in the field.

I shot a local 600 yard benchrest match once with my 243 shooting an 87 gr Hornady Vmax, to the "horror" of all the experts at the range. They were convinced I was wrong to shoot such a "bad" cartridge (a 243 Win - isn't "cool" enough anymore) and horrified that I was shooting an actual varmint bullet. Pretty funny when I put those experts "on the trailer" (old drag racing term) in the match scoring.

 

[bcp]

Your big game rifles should be tested by shooting one shot per day or week at the same target. The first shot matters most. Shoot a "first shot" group.

Bruce

 

[paulsharvey]

Your big game rifles should be tested by shooting one shot per day or week at the same target. The first shot matters most. Shoot a "first shot" group.

Bruce

Yeah, but thats not realistic really either. But most rifles, you can get idea if the first shot stays with the group or not pretty easily.

 

[paulsharvey]

I do think people are too quick general to call a shot outside the group a 'flyer'. First, odds are pretty good it could be the shooter, and that's fine; However, if it truly is mechanically a Flyer, then that's worse, and you probably should try to narrow down what is causing it. It could be a damaged tip, bad powder charge, slow/cold primer, but those are things you really want to work out before shooting at your once in a life time buck/bull/ect.

What I'm trying to say, you can't just throw that data point out, unless you can determine what caused it, and it's been rectified.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

True points to be sure.

This is what loosing your focus looks like while shooting from a bench:

That is 4 shots (the first 4 shots) into one hole at 100 yards. Then, stupidly, after shot #4, I picked my head up off the gun to turn to my shooting buddy to have him check out the group I was running. Then, yup, shot #5, I pulled it. Never let anyone (including yourself) break your concentration when at the bench.

I kept that target to remind myself not to shoot my mouth off when I'm running a good group.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

On flyers,

I was having issues with my new (at the time) 6.5x284 and working up a load with the 142 gr Sierra matchkings. I kept getting these random flyers in my test groups. It was maddening. I'd run 3-4 groups in a row that were all nice and tight, and then wham, I'd get a flyer. It wasn't by total round count or the same shot # in the group each time. I was getting pretty frustrated and I was talking to the guru at Bruno's Shooting Sports (I used to live less than 30 min from them) and he said, "yeah I was having the same problem with mine, until I ditched those Sierras, now I'm shooting Lapua scenars, you should try those." After switching to the Lapua's, my flyers went away permanently. I'd always had good luck with Sierra matchkings before, it had been my previous opinion that if a rifle won't shoot the Sierra's, then the rifle just won't shoot. You never know until you try.

I still have 400-500 of those Sierras sitting on a shelf. I should try to trade those out for something else one of these days.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Your big game rifles should be tested by shooting one shot per day or week at the same target. The first shot matters most. Shoot a "first shot" group.

Bruce

The old saying, "One shot = One deer, Two shots *maybe* One deer."

This is 5 shots from my coyote rifle, from a cold, clean barrel. Yes, I know, I measured it from "outside to outside", and not "center to center", but I figured the coyotes would be more concerned with "outside to outside". Lol.

It's a Savage Stevens 200 model in .223 . Bone stock other than I did stone the crappy trigger and take off some of the spring tension. I bought it originally to turn it into a 6x45 or 6x47 (I have tons of 222 Rem mag brass), but I made the mistake of working up a load for it, and since it shoots like this, I just couldn't bring myself to pull it apart. Butt-ugly gun to be sure, but it makes a dandy coyote rifle, especially when hiking through the heavy brush. I usually bring it along when prairie dogging, for short to mid range shots (shoots a 50 gr Vmax). I just shoot it slowly so the light sporter barrel doesn't heat up.

The offending rifle:

 

[sandman2234]

It's a Savage Stevens 200 model in .223 . Bone stock other than I did stone the crappy trigger and take off some of the spring tension. I bought it originally to turn it into a 6x45 or 6x47 (I have tons of 222 Rem mag brass), but I made the mistake of working up a load for it, and since it shoots like this, I just couldn't bring myself to pull it apart. Butt-ugly gun to be sure, but it makes a dandy coyote rifle, especially when hiking through the heavy brush. I usually bring it along when prairie dogging, for short to mid range shots (shoots a 50 gr Vmax). I just shoot it slowly so the light sporter barrel doesn't heat up.

The offending rifle:

View attachment 862067

Sorry to have to inform you, that isn't a "butt-ugly" gun! Now, it's not a beautiful gun, but definitely not B/U!
David from jax

 

[the old grind]

I bought 200s in .243 & .223, put Timney triggers in them, and haven't shot either one. One has the factory camo stock and the other got a Hogue with camo pattern. That I don't remember which is which hints at how much bench time I don't get, but then I trap more critters than I'll ever shoot.