Using a 4x20 Series JD for Mowing/Bailing Hay?

[chetlenox]

Mickey, I definitely get the impression talking to local folks, that yield estimates around here can vary quit a bit based on the weather (last summer being an example of pretty severe drought). Now I've got a dumb question for you, I would assume I would want to double-up rows just for efficiency of baling, right? Just to get the job done faster? It wouldn't actually hurt the quality of the bale just to run down a "light" row and have it take more pumps of the plunger to make a full bale, right?

Thanks for the feedback KLM. To make myself feel better I looked up the specs on a Ford 8N and compared them to a 4320 (since I haven't really settled on which model of 4x20 yet):

Weight:
8N-2410 lbs
4320-3700 lbs
Engine HP:
8N-27HP
4320-48HP
Engine Torque:
8N-92 ft-lbs
4320-102 ft-lbs

On weight and HP, the new fancy machine is clearly ahead. It's interesting to see that the engine torque is actually pretty close. Of course, you could jack up the 4x20 torque to 115 or 134 ft-lbs by spending more cash on the 4520 or 4720. It's interesting that the Ford is generating pretty close to equivalent torque (compared to a 4120) with 20% less displacement (119 versus 148 cu-in for 8N and 4x20). But I think I'm starting to get a little spec nutty now.

Bottom line answer to my question seems to be: For my "hobby farmer" status, baling hay with a 4x20 series tractor is going to work just fine.

Thanks to everybody for their feedback. I really appreciate it.

Chet

 

[Mickey_Fx]

Mickey, I definitely get the impression talking to local folks, that yield estimates around here can vary quit a bit based on the weather (last summer being an example of pretty severe drought). Now I've got a dumb question for you, I would assume I would want to double-up rows just for efficiency of baling, right? Just to get the job done faster? It wouldn't actually hurt the quality of the bale just to run down a "light" row and have it take more pumps of the plunger to make a full bale, right?

Thanks to everybody for their feedback. I really appreciate it.

Chet

Yes, I'd think you would want to have a decent sized rows just for the efficiency of not taking forever to get the job done. Gound conditions will somewhat determine how fast you can travel as you don't want to get too jarred around. On lite yields I'd want to double up on the rows so the bailer throat had a decent slug of hay in it at each stroke. Due to field condition getting consistent rows is not always easy.

Give some thought on the direction you mow, rake and bail. You don't want to get caught with having the equip on the outside of the outer row and up against the fence line. Outer row needs to be cut CCW as equip hangs off the right side. I raked & bailed CW from the outside moved inwards. I didn't like to straddle rows as I bailed. Usually had to double up on first 2 rows to get outer row away from the fence line. After a few times is comes naturally.

 

[chetlenox]

Thanks for the tips Mickey, I appreciate it. Believe it or not, I AM taking notes...

Chet.

 

[BleedGreen]

chet,

I apologize that I took so long to get back to you on this thread... It makes me very happy to see that your wife is "encouraging" you to go green! I know an earlier poster recommended that you look at the M Series Kubota's, and while they are a fine tractor, due to your wife's arm, you really should go with an HST - but you already know that! If you and your better half have yet to get to your Deere dealer, I would say that you two get out and on one soon and go for a test drive! Once you run an eHydro with the TwinTouch pedals - nothing else will be good enough! On an eHydro side note - I highly recommend getting the Automotive Style Cruise Control option installed - it will allow you and your wife, especially, increased control of the tractor in many different situations.

You have already gotten some great advice regarding baling, but since you asked me, I will throw in my two (or three) cents. Here goes - the 43 or 4520 is more than adequate for a small square baler - preferably a side baler, not the newer in-line baler. Since you will be purchasing used implements, the side style is probably all you will be looking at anyway. Just for comparison, a new small JD 328 baler requires 35 PTO hp, so that is not an issue. You did bring up a very good point as far as ballast goes - at 80 (JD 328 specs) plunge strokes a minute, balers do have a tendency to push you around a little bit. I see your specs comparing the 8N and the 4x20's - but remember that the 8N has a MUCH lower center of gravity then the 4x20's, that makes a huge difference in baling operations. That being said, ballast should definitely be your friend when it comes to baling time! If you are not already planning on a FEL, you will definitely need some serious weight on the front, as well as loaded rear tires, and possibly rear wheel weights. If you will have a FEL - you may still need to add weight to the front. The nice thing about ballast is that you can always add more if you need. Start with the loaded rear tires and the FEL or front weights - if you still need more, add rear wheel weights, etc.

The next thing on your list (or maybe it should be before the baler, since you cant bale without mowing first ) will be a swather of some sort... As with any implement, make sure you have enough PTO hp to run it - without seriously taxing the tractor. I personally prefer a mower-conditioner over the swather style but again, with purchasing used implements, you probably wont find a small enough, inexpensive enough mo-co.

I hope I answered your questions for you, albeit tardily! I will try to respond quicker if you have more!

 

[chetlenox]

BleedGreen,

Thanks for the reply. Your suggestion to go ahead and check out the models at the John Deere dealer was a good one, we did just that last night. We were extremely impressed with the ease of handling on the eHydro transmission on the 4520 they had on the lot, it is clearly the way to go with my wife's disability. We jumped in a larger 52xx and tried out the PowerReverser, and it was definitely more of a chore for her. About the only real challenge on the hydrostatic transmission was the parking break, which requires a "pull up and push with your thumb with some force" combination to release. But my wife was able to compensate by using the palm of her hand, so we worked through it. She was especially impressed with the ease of power steering, loader level and foot pedals, she described it as effortless. Granted, we were just taking it for a spin around an empty lot, but I was very pleased.

Your points on ballast are received, we'll definitely have to look into that once we get as far as the baling. I hadn't thought of your point on CG when comparing the 8N, that seems fair.

Like I mentioned before, we will start at the beginning by becoming capable of "field prep" (dragging, rough mowing weeds, spreading fertilizer, etc), move on to mowing, and then finish with baling. I'm not sure how long it will take to get that far, but I'm looking forward to each stage. I think it's time to start educating myself on the mowers available. We'll get a rough-cut rotary mower right away, to take care of around-the-property rough cutting. But I just haven't done that much work comparing the used hay-compatible mowers.

By the way, I was impressed enough with the 4520 that we played with all evening that we went ahead and purchased it. We will be back to the dealer to pick it up on Saturday, I'm really looking forward to it. We seem to have gotten a real helpful guy for a salesman, so he offered to spend his Saturday morning showing me how to run the tractor, hook-up and detach the FEL, how to use the attachments, etc. before we put it on a trailer and take it home. Should be a ball.

Thanks again to everyone for the help. I'm sure I'll have other questions as I go, but the feedback was very helpful with initial tractor selection.

Take care, Chet.

 

[turbo36]

BleedGreen,

By the way, I was impressed enough with the 4520 that we played with all evening that we went ahead and purchased it. Take care, Chet.

Wow, you didn't waste anytime! You saw what you wanted and went for it, good job. Enjoy your tractor.

 

[chetlenox]

Ha! I suppose you are right.

To be honest, after hearing enough folks tell me that the machine should be a good fit for us, then going and really enjoying the testdrive, then the salesman treating us very well and giving us a good price... it was sortof a no brainer.

Besides, my pasture needs dragging and I want a toy to play with!

Chet.

 

[BleedGreen]

Congratulations!!! Welcome to the family!

 

[Kyle_in_Tex]

Congrats,
Be sure to thank your wife for her input.

The 4X20 series is really a great size tractor. You can do quite a bit more work than the 3X20 size with just a small compromise in turn radius, weight etc. There might be a few times when you might want to drive across a lawn but can't because it is wet/soaked. Actually the weight is a big plus for almost all other activities.

I have a 4310 and my FIL lets me keep his 5420 here on our place so I have the best of both worlds. Believe me, if money was no object, I'd have a 4720 or 5525 AC Cab model. It really gets hot here for 5 months from about May thru September. I have a steering knob on both of the tractors. Your wife may appreciate one.

Don't worry too much about the parking brake. You'll only need it if you park on a slope. Consult your owners manual as to when JD recommends actually setting it. I get on and off of mine on flat land all the time without setting it.

I'd recommend a MX-6 cutter. It will compliment the 4520 nicely.

Enjoy your tractor and Be Safe. Give yourself lots of practice in open areas until it feels like an extension of your arm...

 

[chetlenox]

Thanks "Bleed" and Kyle,

Oh, I didn't really have to thank my wife too much for her input. It was a bit more the other way around. About half-way through the time we spent trying out different models and having a good time at the dealership, she turned to me and made some comment about "Gee, I think it's great that you are showing so much interest and getting educated on MY future tractor..." I think there is some applicable saying about taking the girl outta the country, but not the other way around...

On the weight part, we chose to go ahead and leave the tractor stock for now, no wheel weights, filled tires, ballast box, etc. Since it will be doing mostly "light duty" for a while (mowing, dragging, light FEL work, etc), we figured it would be fine. I'll revisit once I get an idea of what my hay mower and baler are gonna look like.

Kyle, I hear you on the heat. I'm in Texas as well, so I imagine I'll be suffering right along side you. I just recently moved here from Oregon, but lived in Texas for 8 years while going to school, so I know how it is. I did get a chance to try a 52xx tractor with a cab on it... man, you are right, that is nice.

Your comments on the parking brake was exactly what the salesman had to say (most of the time, it's not all that necessary). But either way, my wife got it figured out, she just has to do a little finagling. Fortunately, all other controls that require "real time" use are really well placed and easy for her to handle. We will be installing a steering ball, she uses them for driving our regular vehicles.

I'm afraid I'm too late on the cutter, we bought the LX6 to go with it. I think the lighter duty model will be fine for us (we don't have a lot of rocks and brush, it's just grass and grass pasture). The only way I'll be in trouble is if we end up buying some of the property around ours, which is more rough and wooded. Time will tell, I guess. We almost bought a very lightly used International cutter that was on the lot, but it turned out the mount dimensions on that weren't a good fit to the iMatch system, so we just bought a new LX6. The iMatch is pretty critical for us with my wife's condition.

I hear you on the safety part, we are definitely going to approach things slowly and keep it safe. It was one of the major reasons why we opted for a new, simple to operate tractor rather than something older. I'm really looking forward to picking up the rig tomorrow morning and getting to play (I'm meeting the salesman at the dealership at 7am sharp). Of course, we've got some really nasty weather scheduled for tonight... Murphy's law.

Chet.