Snow Attachments Using box blade in reverse for gravel / snow

[hz293]

After this last hard rain, for the first time I have cuts in the gravel on my driveway. I've tried pulling the the box blade lightly over the gravel but find it bunches up in the box and then drops out in a mass. I try to lift the box slowly to release the gravel but I can't seem to get raising and lowering the box right. Since there's also a blade on the back of the box blade, would it work better for the tractor to go in reverse and push the gravel? For those of you using box blades on a gravel driveway, how do you do it?

Harris

 

[Slamfire]

You fill the box with gravel, then shorten the top link, lifting the rear blade to allow a little to leak out as you drive forward. 3-point hitches don't much like to be used in reverse you can bend the lower arms, and the box will keep trying to lift. It might work on powder snow, but we get mostly wet heavy stuff here, and it won't push much of that!

 

[biker128pedal]

I extend the top link waaaaay out so the rear blade drags and the front blade only catches the high stuff. This is like using a standard blade in reverse. I have been told a rake works well for large size gravel.

 

[browns40]

Hz293,

A box blade is a fantastic snow removal tool... if it rides up, you need either more weight on it, or to take smaller bites

Check out the front mount units shopping malls in Northern states use on the FEL's & tractors; it's basically a giant box blade/plow blade with sides.

The nice thing is there are no windrows from it, plus you can back up to a door, set it down, and take away the snow... pushging with the back side works well for clean-up & edges too, but go slowly, it is not meant to ram things.

I vastly prefer it over the FEL for cleaning a lot. Have front & back blades both level on the ground.

As far as levelling your drive, your material sounds a bit wet & sticky, so to let it be dry would prevent cumpind; YES using the back blade on bumps & ruts requires far less technique than timing the raising & lowering of the box to cut/dump material.

Go around & shear off your high points with the back once it's dried out; you may ned to scarify the surface if it's compacted, but if the box will fill up well, then it's just practice/learning what height it needs to be upslope, downslope, etc to cut off high spots & drop in low spots. You do need to offset terrain changes on the fly with your rockshaft.

A rake is probably the best upkeep tool to keep a nice driveway nice, as it doesn't run the risk of displacing large volumes of material... for reconditioning one though, some sort of blade is necessary.

 

[John_Mc]

A couple of general driveway tips:

One key is to work on your driveway when the moisture content is just right. Too wet, and the stuff just doesn't move around freely enough... you get clumping and a bumpy mess. Too dry, and you loose a lot of the fines that hold your driveway together (though things will certainly flow more easily).

You don't just want to scrape up the bare minimum needed to fill the ruts in a gravel driveway. The repairs will last much longer if you dig down to the bottom of the ruts with the boxblade (and the surrounding driveway) and stir up the material, then let the whole thing "re-compact". It's the same thing with pot holes... If you just throw material into the holes, they'll reappear pretty quickly. If you stir things up in the hole and surrounding area all the way down to the level of the bottom of the pot hole, the repair will last much longer.

And a tip on spreading evenly:

I try to get a good bit of material loaded up into the box, then lengthen the toplink, tipping the box backwards until it rides on the rear blade, and the front blade is up in the air a bit (this assumes you have a box blade with a fixed rear blade... it won't ride on a swinging rear blade). Once you've done this, the material will tend to drop out of the bottom of the box as you drive along. You still may have to help it a bit by raising the 3 pt hitch a bit, but adjustments are much less touchy than if you have the toplink shortened (which causes the front blade to dig in).

If you are unable to get smooth enough results, you can shorten the toplink to tilt the box forward (raising the rear blade, so the box rides on the front blade). Then back up over the area, feathering the 3 point hitch height adjustment as needed... if you have the angle of the box right, you won't need to feather much... the box will float and spread material pretty evenly. The advantage of backing up is that your tractor wheels are driving over something that has already been smoothed, eliminating some of the variables in getting a good result. Backing through loos gravel should not be a problem... just don't ram anything. Take it slow

In any case, the whole process goes much more quickly if you have a hydraulic toplink to make adjustments on the fly, though obviously that's not a requirement.

John Mc

 

[Henro]

For those of you using box blades on a gravel driveway, how do you do it?

I use my box blade for the rough work, and extend the top link all the way so the rear blade drags on the ground and nothing digs in. Some crushed stone will fall out as I move forward, and things do smooth out a bit.

But for final finish work nothing beats a landscape rake. The rake can be pulled in reverse if desired and is least aggressive that way.

Landscape rakes are not cheap (even KingKutter) but are really nice to have, especially if you get the gage wheels for them.

As always, each tool has it own advantages. If you can afford one, I would recommend you consider a rake to compliment your box blade for driveway maintenance.

 

[3RRL]

About "Using the box blade in reverse for gravel / snow"
I don't know about snow because I don't have any here in So. Cal. but the concept should be universal.

Using the boxblade in reverse is a wonderful technique. It is very hard when using the fel or pulling the box blade to cut a level surface when your tractor drives over humps and gullies or on a slope. The fel or box blade tends to "follow" those contours and slope. Even adjusting the "tilt" on the box blade to cut out a slope, it will still rise and fall over the humps. The advantages are that when you push in reverse, your tires are now on the part that is cut and level....no more rise and fall.

I find that my box blade cuts really good in reverse so I use it like a dozer blade to level an area. Sometimes I don't want to use the scarifiers when leveling an area. Seems like on some hard surfaces, pulling doesn't penetrate but the cutting blade just rides over the hard spot. Not so in reverse...the blade digs in and really cuts good. After you've gotten rid of all the humps you can then drag the box blade and it will produce a really nice smooth surface, and follow the slope you made because you've prepped it properly.

Here is a picture of some road smoothing done with the box blade.




Another thing about dozing in reverse is that you push the pile of dirt clear off the area, instead of leaving the pile in the road. So when I wanted to cut a slope for a drainage gutter, I pushed the dirt clean out of the way with the desired slope/tilt. I'd have to stop the tractor before falling off a drop off if I did it pulling.




Be sure to determine your lower drag links are sturdy enough to take the pressure. I have read many posts where those arms bent. So with that in mind, I'd seriously consider strengthening them so I could use that method frequently. My tractor is pretty heavy duty with thick lower arms, but I may still weld a gusset reinforcing along the length for that very purpose.

Hope that helps.

 

[Gavman]

As far as pushing in reverse goes, I have had no problem doing it with my equipment. I have even gotten slightly aggressive using this method and haven't bent anything. I would definitely get a hydraulic top link as it makes box blading way, way easier.

Another method I was taught that I haven't seen mentioned on this thread, is to turn circles as tight as you can across your work area. Assuming you can turn in the area your working in. This method doesn't work real well on two lane driveways and smaller, but parking lots and such it works very well. By turning as tight as you can in a pattern across your work area, the box blade cuts the high spots and moves the extra material until it comes to a low spot, which it then fills. This works because the tires do not go over the same terrain as the blade.

 

[Highbeam]

I think I would rather have a nonreinforced lower arm bend than to snap the lower casting off of the tractor rear end.

If your gravel is bunching up in clumps then it has been contaminated with mud and maybe, in Kalama, clay. The drive is now going to be a mess until it dries again or until you bring in new clean material. You are smoothing out frosting now.

 

[3RRL]

I think I would rather have a nonreinforced lower arm bend than to snap the lower casting off of the tractor rear end.

I certainly agree with you on that point Highbeam. I'd hate for that to happen too.

On the other hand (if you think about it) how many times have you been box blading and hit a big root or giant rock that brings the tractor to a jolting halt? Tires keep spinning but the tractor is dead stopped. That is the force the casting can endure.... in either direction....same thing.

Now this is all my opinion based on observation of design only, and I'm not disputing the fact that you do not want to break the casting.
The resistance to arm failure pulling has to be 10 times more than it's resistance to bending? (just a guess) That's because of the angles when pushing on them in reverse and they were not designed to take the same force in that direction. They appear to be the weak link in that respect.

So all I'm saying is the casting can certainly take more stress than what is imposed on it when pushing in reverse because the drag links will fail first. If there was a way to get the all force straight back to the housing without going through that deflected vector force created by those angles, then THAT would simulate the force on the housing as when pulling. And we already know the casting can take that kind of force. Same scenario except in reverse, tractor comes to jolting halt, tires spinning, etc.

This is of extreme interest to me because I will be doing a lot of dirt shaping using that technique, and I'd like to save as much as I can on new drag links.
Like I said, it's my opinion only and my math is crummy. But I'm sure someone here can do the calcs to see how much to beef up (and where) the drag links so they can take the same force pushing on them as pulling with them.