SAFETY!!! Couldn't turn tractor Off! Anyone experience this?

[Volfandt]

I've personally seen a Detroit 6-71 (2 cycle diesel) run away. The valve cover was off and it was running on it's own oil. It was running WOT for what seemed like forever but we finally got ti shutdown by stuffing rags etc into the intake.
Let me tell you, when a diesel is screaming WOT as a runaway, the last thing you want to do is get close enough to it to try and shut it down....
It's amazing it held together and even more amazing that when we replaced the stuck injector, we put it back in service
It was the powerplant for an MC-10 GSE gear.

Everyone w/a BX should familurize yourself with where that manual fuel injection pump shutdown lever is. I'm going on 600 hrs and over 7 yrs on a BX23 and I've not had to use it yet, but with that said, I knows where it's at

Dave

 

[jgheck]

I've personally seen a Detroit 6-71 (2 cycle diesel) run away. The valve cover was off and it was running on it's own oil. It was running WOT for what seemed like forever but we finally got ti shutdown by stuffing rags etc into the intake.
Let me tell you, when a diesel is screaming WOT as a runaway, the last thing you want to do is get close enough to it to try and shut it down....
It's amazing it held together and even more amazing that when we replaced the stuck injector, we put it back in service
It was the powerplant for an MC-10 GSE gear.

Everyone w/a BX should familurize yourself with where that manual fuel injection pump shutdown lever is. I'm going on 600 hrs and over 7 yrs on a BX23 and I've not had to use it yet, but with that said, I knows where it's at

Dave

Dave, I have since put a wire on the injection pump lever on my BX23, which is visible and easy to get to. I can shut it down immediately if need be. It is a good safety device to have in the rare occasion that I would need it, but it is there now. Hopefully this will help others in the future.

 

[Max Power]

Actually, many cars (all Volvos with EFI) DO have a rev limiter in the fuel injection "brain".
If you hold the gas pedal to the floor on a Volvo 940, you can bounce the engine against the rev limiter all day long. When it hits the rev limiter, it stops feeding fuel until the RPMs drop to below the limit.

Aaron Z

yes I am aware of that. (they were in use (limited) in high performance cars through the spark ignition cut-out for decades, not sure if they work through the fuel system on newer fuel injected cars) With modern electronic engine controls it is an easy thing to do.

those rev limiters will not necessarily stop the engine from destructing since they still allow for a very high RPM and without load the engine can suffer serious damage.

my point is that diesels by nature of their design are governed.

these tractors are governed to something like 2700, highway tractor trailers to 1800 to 2400 depending on type. Large ship engines to under 1000rpm. ..these are general numbers and there are other possible variations. car engines have their "red lines" around the 5000 to 6000 rpm. not recommended to be operated there no load and even with load I would not expect a long life for an engine being operated there.

 

[EE_Bota]

Hello Homeputter, Let me clarify a little of what the condition was. If you read the entire thread it probably will make more sense. The BX 25 is a 4 cycle diesel. Not as EE_Bota mentioned. It is not a 2 cycle, it also was not getting its fuel from a different source. He apparently has not read the entire thread as this was explained. I only posted all this to help others that may run into this problem.

No, I was confused. I thought he was replying to the the post right in front of his about the diesel boat motor running wide open out of control. I think you will admit, that is a pretty reasonable assumption, since the kubota under discussion simply would not turn off, and noone has claimed that it was not being governed.

If the gentleman wants to compare the Kubota to gas running wide open, he would need to compare it to a governed motor, such as on a lawnmower, not on an automobile (although many modern cars have high rpm spark cutouts.)

 

[EE_Bota]

4 cycle diesels can run away as well as 2 cycle ...the detroit diesel 2 cycle was more apt to run away then other types of diesels (many industrial applications had emergency shutdown systems that would drop a plate across the air inlet.) ...also it will not usually run away when at low speed ..they usually run away when operated at high speeds (RPMs)

..and the 2 cycle wasn't designed to be a boat engine per se.

the 2 cycle Detroit Diesel was the only engine in locomotives and highway buses for many years in north america.

My brothers VW did it many many moons ago. When I adjusted the valves on my VW diesel, I put in a special baffle plate under the valve cover that makes it far less likely to happen. Didn't want the scary experience he had.

 

[Max Power]

I've personally seen a Detroit 6-71 (2 cycle diesel) run away. The valve cover was off and it was running on it's own oil. It was running WOT for what seemed like forever but we finally got ti shutdown by stuffing rags etc into the intake.
Let me tell you, when a diesel is screaming WOT as a runaway, the last thing you want to do is get close enough to it to try and shut it down....
It's amazing it held together and even more amazing that when we replaced the stuck injector, we put it back in service
It was the powerplant for an MC-10 GSE gear.

Everyone w/a BX should familurize yourself with where that manual fuel injection pump shutdown lever is. I'm going on 600 hrs and over 7 yrs on a BX23 and I've not had to use it yet, but with that said, I knows where it's at

Dave

...are you saying it was WOT because the valve cover was off ..I cannot see how that would have any bearing on the engine using it's own oil.

the fuel injector linkages are inside the valve cover and I can see it going WOT with the linkages being jammed due to people working on it.

and should a BX run away burning it's own oil the shutdown lever on the governor might have no effect.

 

[EE_Bota]

...are you saying it was WOT because the valve cover was off ..I cannot see how that would have any bearing on the engine using it's own oil.

the fuel injector linkages are inside the valve cover and I can see it going WOT with the linkages being jammed due to people working on it.

and should a BX run away burning it's own oil the shutdown lever on the governor might have no effect.

He said it "ran away" which is different than WOT. That was the point I was trying to make for new folks learning about diesels. Volfant make it a bit clearer I think.

 

[EE_Bota]

I haven't tried this, because my BX25 hasn't had a runaway engine (yet!)...but I have a feeling that if you completely obstruct the exhaust, the engine will quit.

I am very skeptical about that working on a diesel, as the pressure should be very high. What do others think about that? It is practical?

 

[Max Power]

My brothers VW did it many many moons ago. When I adjusted the valves on my VW diesel, I put in a special baffle plate under the valve cover that makes it far less likely to happen. Didn't want the scary experience he had.

yes I have had the pleasure of my VW golf ..running away. It had about 2 hundred thousand kilometers on it. They became more susceptible to burning their own oil when pollution laws changed and the crank-case was no longer vented to atmosphere. The vent line was routed into the intake manifold after the air filter (the idea was to burn the vapor and generally there was not enough to do anything to the engine operation). I did get a few more years out of that VW.

in the 1930's they made engines that burned wood smoke from a fire they would build on the truck ...same idea.

 

[Max Power]

He said it "ran away" which is different than WOT. That was the point I was trying to make for new folks learning about diesels. Volfant make it a bit clearer I think.

I know he said it ran away. But did it? no Volfant did not make it clearer. I hope this isn't personal with you. It isn't with me.

..... or was it just WOT. Running away means there is no RPM limit and those engines usually just go faster and faster till the destruct (If there is sufficient combustible fuel available). or you can shut it down somehow.

standing beside one of those engines at WOT is is pretty loud. they don't call them screamers for no reason.