PTO generator

   / PTO generator #261  
Here is a question for some of your electric gurus...
When I am feeding the double pole 50A breaker in my main panel, does the incoming neutral balance the load between the two 120V legs? I watched a video where someone placed a wattage meter around each 120V leg to manually try and balalnce the loads. Isn't that the very function of a neutral? Dumb it down...I am no electrician.
 
   / PTO generator #262  
I just heard that NYC is going to even/odd gas rationing that's supposed to last a couple of weeks.
 
   / PTO generator #263  
Here is a question for some of your electric gurus...
When I am feeding the double pole 50A breaker in my main panel, does the incoming neutral balance the load between the two 120V legs? I watched a video where someone placed a wattage meter around each 120V leg to manually try and balalnce the loads. Isn't that the very function of a neutral? Dumb it down...I am no electrician.

The neutral does not "balance the load". I provides a current path for any 120 volt load. In theory if you had two 120 volt loads that were identical, and each was wired to separate hot legs, there would be no current flow in the neutral leg. However since the loads on each leg is never identical, current does flow through the neutral leg. So it is needed, unless you had only 240 volt loads.

paul
 
   / PTO generator #264  
The neutral does not "balance the load". I provides a current path for any 120 volt load. In theory if you had two 120 volt loads that were identical, and each was wired to separate hot legs, there would be no current flow in the neutral leg. However since the loads on each leg is never identical, current does flow through the neutral leg. So it is needed, unless you had only 240 volt loads.

paul

To further my understanding...could a generator be damaged if one leg had a much higher load than the other leg or is it just a case of efficiency? Can each leg only supply 1/2 of the rated watts of the generator? Would a wattage meter for each leg be a wide investment when supplying generator power to a home in an attempt to manually balance the load?

I sincerely appreciate your time and consideration.
 
   / PTO generator #265  
To further my understanding...could a generator be damaged if one leg had a much higher load than the other leg or is it just a case of efficiency? Can each leg only supply 1/2 of the rated watts of the generator? Would a wattage meter for each leg be a wide investment when supplying generator power to a home in an attempt to manually balance the load?

I sincerely appreciate your time and consideration.

Each leg can supply 1/2 of the available power, as you stated. You can use the full output with 120 volt loads, if they are connected to each leg and neutral. Of course 240 volt loads is a balanced current on both legs. To answer your base question, will not damage the generator with unbalanced loads. If one leg is loaded enough to exceed the current rating on one leg, you are in a risky area, but you should have a circuit breaker on each leg which should prevent overloads on each leg independently. There is no real loss of efficiency if the loads are unbalanced. Just think of it like your panel box. Your main breaker will allow full rated current on each leg. Full power available occurs only when you pull full current from both legs. In the panel box, usually there is some effort to balance loads on both legs. Same on the generator, you should try to balance the loads on each leg so as not to overload one leg. Note overload, which implies in excess of full load.

paul
 
   / PTO generator #266  
Can each leg only supply 1/2 of the rated watts of the generator? Would a wattage meter for each leg be a wide investment when supplying generator power to a home in an attempt to manually balance the load?

The short answer to your question is yes. If you look at your generator, you will find that there are breakers for each of the circuits. For example, my generator has four breakers: one for each leg of the 240 receptacle and one for each of two 120 receptacles. The generator is a 5000 watt generator, which is just over 20 amps at 240 volts. Each of the two 240-volt breakers is 20 amps, which means that each leg of the 240-volt connection can provide 20 amps without popping the breaker. Each leg of the 240-volt service provides up to half of the generator's rated capacity, as you suggest.

This actually came into play when I was shopping for the generator. Before I bought this one, I bought a smaller one... perhaps 2000 or 3000 watts or something, which was just enough capacity to do what I wanted. Because each of the two 120-volt receptacles could only provide half the rated capacity, it wasn't enough to run the appliance(s) I wanted to run, because some of the appliances would exceed half the rated capacity and blow the breakers. This absolutely comes into play when sizing a generator, because (basically) all generators will be rated based on their 240-volt output, because that's what the alternator puts out. So if you need to run a 120-volt appliance that pulls 2000 watts, don't buy a 2500 watt generator. Each leg of the 120 service will only be able to provide 1250 watts. You need to size a single 120-volt leg of the generator to run your biggest 120-volt appliance, or whatever your biggest simultaneous load is going to be.

Additionally, you should consider the size of the breakers on the 120 receptacles if you plan to run a lot of 120 appliances directly off the generator. A good generator will have a big enough breaker to allow the full potential of the generator on each of the 120 legs, but that isn't always the case. For example, a 3000 watt generator works out to 12.5 amps. The 120 receptacles may only have 10 amp breakers, meaning that if you're pulling off the 120 receptacles, even if you perfectly balance the load, you'll only ever get 10 amps, or 2400 watts. The extra 600 watts that you paid for will only get used if you are running a 240 appliance. This can be circumvented by using a Y-cord that plugs into the 240 receptacle and manually splits out each leg of the service into separate 120 receptacles. Again: not all generators are designed this way. Quality ones will have the appropriate breaker size on the 120 receptacles. But do check! It doesn't matter what the rated capacity of the generator is if the breakers will prevent you from actually using it. This whole paragraph is moot if you are pulling 240 off the generator and not running 120 appliances directly off the receptacles in the generator.

I'm not familiar with the practical effects of an unbalanced load on a generator, but I do know that you need to make sure that neither leg is overloaded with 120 appliances. Ideally, the load on the two legs would be more or less balanced. For 240 appliances, this is not an issue, since they use both legs of the 240 service simultaneously (that's a poor way of putting it, but it'll do for the time being).
 
   / PTO generator #267  
Thank you posters for some excellent information!:thumbsup:
 
   / PTO generator #268  
For less than $10 at Harbor Freight you can get one that does the same: Digital Clamp-On Multimeter (note that you can only go over one leg of the wire going to the pump. If you go over both legs it doesn't read anything).

Aaron Z
Does this item have a peak hold feature?
 
   / PTO generator #270  
... It should be noted that this is a 3phase setup and may also be driving 120V or 208V single phase loads of unknown torque demand. The 3phase loads have less surge. The others, proportionately higher but not known from his post.
larry

So when I clamp each leg of the 3 phase separately, do I just add the three surge readings together or take the highest surge reading and multiply by three?
 

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