I witnessed foolishness today

[Bigkitty]

I have judged no one. I observed a 10 year old boy or less in age with one foot on the operators platform and the other on the step leaning back on the fender while the older person was pushing dirt. The machine was bouncing all around going up over rock and lumps of hard clay the size of basketballs. Anyone that has driven a rubber tired machine in those conditions knows exactly what I am talking about. You don't have to witness it first hand to understand. The kid was hanging on for dear life!! In my original post when I started this thread I was referring to this particular incident only. I didn't mention anything about farming, people mowing or dogs flying out of trucks. All good topics but ones that I didn't say anything about. Point is that if you have something to say about those things direct it to them and not me. Thank you

 

[two_bit_score]

I have judged no one. I observed a 10 year old boy or less in age with one foot on the operators platform and the other on the step leaning back on the fender while the older person was pushing dirt. The machine was bouncing all around going up over rock and lumps of hard clay the size of basketballs. Anyone that has driven a rubber tired machine in those conditions knows exactly what I am talking about. You don't have to witness it first hand to understand. The kid was hanging on for dear life!! In my original post when I started this thread I was referring to this particular incident only. I didn't mention anything about farming, people mowing or dogs flying out of trucks. All good topics but ones that I didn't say anything about. Point is that if you have something to say about those things direct it to them and not me. Thank you

You can't outlaw stupidity.

.

 

[Bigkitty]

Fine with me as long as when (God forbid) the kid gets hurt they don't sue the manufacturer for making the machine idiot proof or do something else that costs me money (drives up the price of goods, insurance, adds regulations/laws to protect us from idiots, etc.) If they want to risk their kids life so be it but don't come crying when it happens. Full responsibility incurrs full blame too.

How do you feel about child safety seat laws for cars?

Great statement... Even better question.. I would think from some of the responses child safety seats are not very important. It seams that children are supposed to be exposed to danger to make them a better person. So bouncing a child around inside a car or off a tractor will do nothing but toughen them up...... There are ways to do things that are dangerous with a child in a safe manner if you just put a little thought into it.

 

[dave1949]

I don't have any kids in this fight since mine are grown up.

But, another question is, do parents expect society (through personal actions, laws and enforcement) to protect their children from a variety of dangers? Yes, they do. From speeders in a school zone to child molesters, I do think parents expect society's aid in keeping their children safe. And I think the parents and children deserve that from the rest of us.

So, why expect that society will not protect children from their own parents? A child safety seat to me is a no-brainer if you want to protect a child in the event of an accident or sudden stop. If a parent isn't able to understand that fact, which is based upon simple physics (a body in motion tends to stay in motion), then it's left to the rest of us (society) to do our best to provide the protection that the child deserves--even though we are protecting that child from his or her parents.

There are many things society prevents parents from doing to or with their children simply because, like all rational societies who wish to continue on this earth, we value children. Think about it. It's not about politics, "gubmint" control, freedom or anything but that simple fact.

If you would risk injury to your child to make a political statement, it's time to get over yourself.

 

[two_bit_score]

I don't have any kids in this fight since mine are grown up.

But, another question is, do parents expect society (through personal actions, laws and enforcement) to protect their children from a variety of dangers? Yes, they do. From speeders in a school zone to child molesters, I do think parents expect society's aid in keeping their children safe. And I think the parents and children deserve that from the rest of us.

So, why expect that society will not protect children from their own parents? A child safety seat to me is a no-brainer if you want to protect a child in the event of an accident or sudden stop. If a parent isn't able to understand that fact, which is based upon simple physics (a body in motion tends to stay in motion), then it's left to the rest of us (society) to do our best to provide the protection that the child deserves--even though we are protecting that child from his or her parents.

There are many things society prevents parents from doing to or with their children simply because, like all rational societies who wish to continue on this earth, we value children. Think about it. It's not about politics, "gubmint" control, freedom or anything but that simple fact.

If you would risk injury to your child to make a political statement, it's time to get over yourself.

Get real. Government tries to protect people, both kids and adults, all the time from all kinds of real and perceived dangers. Both from others and even from themselves. That doesn't mean that it's successful in preventing harm from coming to everyone and from every potential danger that the government can imagine. Accidents still happen, criminals and stupid people still violate the law.

It's ridiculous to say that if someone is opposing some form of government over reaching that they are trying to "risk injury to their child to make a political statement". But, that's the way liberals roll. And,, it has no basis in fact or reason.

 

[the old grind]

... Government tries to protect people, both kids and adults, all the time from all kinds of real and perceived dangers, Both from others and even from themselves. That doesn't mean that it's successful in preventing harm from coming to everyone and from every potential danger that the government can imagine. Accidents still happen, criminals and stupid people still violate the law......

Yes, that is what government is selling us & we (as a <50%-voting Nation) keep going back for more. IMO, politics is the art of creating confusion by urging entirely logical viewpoints to disagree and then promising both sides to fix all their problems by taking control.

btw: What a shame that 'parenting' in our society is so often about accessorizing our kids to keep up with the Jones' kids and expecting them to raise themselves rather than preparing them to function as adults in the World we've created for them by spending constructive time with them. "My kid can do no wrong", eh? Well every bad person is someones kid & nobody 'down here' is keeping score, if you know what I mean.

 

[Oliver1655]

Like many, I grew up in a rural environment. By the time I was 10 years old, I had my own lawn mowing business. I never heard anyone complain they thought I was too young. They wanted to know how much I charged. I was taught how to use tools, equipment, firearms, ... safely/responsibly from the time I showed interest in each new area. I knew when I could do it independently & when I had to wait for supervision. At age 11, I was independently operating farm tractors in the field. (No cabs or seat belts). I also drove trucks pulling/backing trailers from one farm to another.

Do I think all kids should be doing the same things I did at the same ages? NO! You have to know your kids, their personalities, ability to follow instructions, & level of responsibility. I have two kids, (now grown), who grew up understanding how to use tools, mowers, ... safely / responsibly. Before they could drive they knew how to check all the fluids, tire pressure, & how to change their oil or a flat tire.

They helped operate chainsaws & swung axes, splitting mauls, & later used a hydraulic splitter. We do not have an antenna connected to our tv so they were not able to waste time on the trash you find there. Yes we do have a large collection of movies, but my wife I know what is on them. The movies could be stopped & finished another day if they need to do homework, chores, practice instruments, ... .

Did this type of environment scar them for life, I don't think so. One graduated valedictorian & the other was salutatorian of their high school classes & both have graduated from college.

Yes I do feel government oversteps their intended purpose our forefathers setup. But I will not elaborate here.

 

[fordmantpw]

Do I think all kids should be doing the same things I did at the same ages? NO! You have to know your kids, their personalities, ability to follow instructions, & level of responsibility.

Bingo! I have 3 kids, and there is a world of difference between them. Our oldest, a girl, is now 10. She is responsible, and we call her the mother hen. She does her best to keep the other 2 in line. I would trust her with quite a few responsibilities.

Our son, 8, is completely irresponsible, has no self control, cannot seem to think past the end of his eyebrows, and you can't even trust him to put his socks in his drawer! We can't trust him to go outside to ride his bike by himself because we don't know where he would end up. To his credit, he does have ADHD. I have mentioned to my wife that he will NEVER be able to drive my tractor or any of our vehicles!

Our youngest is 4, and she is following in her brother's footsteps. We don't know what we are going to do with her!

Bottom line, you have to treat each kid differently. I was mowing grass by myself when I was 8. I learned to drive by backing boat trailers down the boat ramp when I was 13. No way would my son be doing either of those...there is just too much responsibility involved, and he does not have it in him.

 

[Bigkitty]

This thread is not about the children...... It could have been a 50 year old on the side of a tractor and I would have said the same thing. It is about tractor safety.. But since the focus seems to be on children let me say that there is a huge difference in teaching verses putting someone in danger. Throwing a child on the side of a tractor like that is only teaching a bad habit nothing else..... If this way of running equipment is so advisable why don't we see it on construction sites, strip jobs, etc. I would think that if there would be an advantage to operate that way they would sure want to do it.......

 

[Coyote machine]

I think it works this way: those who claim they were doing whatever at age 6, (exaggeration to prove my point) will holler just as loud as the 'city slicker' who gets hurt doing whatever when the time comes to grieve the losses or pay the hospital bills or funeral expenses. Those who are clueless and warrant the endless safety stickers, laws, mandatory use of seat belts, car seats, helmets, etc. will also sue because ours is and is continuing to become a society in which few if any take responsibility, whether it be parents, banking executives, pharmaceutical manufacturers, or whomever; and ALL choose to sue to get out of taking responsibility, or to escape punishment, which they know they deserve but fight ever having to 'pay' for by jailtime, fines, etc.
It's a loosing battle to try to protect those who don't care or have enough common sense to do so on their own instead of the rest of us having to pay their bills when they arrive at the hospital beaten up from doing something stupid, and then put the costs on the rest of us who wouldn't have put ourselves in their shoes for any amount of money. We pay for the stupidity of other's irresponsibility all day long. they just keep on being stupid and doing stupid stuff because they can, and they get away with it.
There is no logic or sense to acting stupid or being stupid or irresponsible.