McDonalds.....Don't Eat the Food!

[MossRoad]

Exactly.

It's crass to simply say that people that want to make more should just get a higher paying job. As if you could just open a file folder, flip thru the tabs till you find a salary you like, pull it out and POOF.. you have the better job.

In today's economy.. that's fiction at best.

Exactly. There are no jobs in inner-cities for uneducated poor people with ZERO work experience. As I mentioned before, that was not the case 30 years ago. You could get a decent paying factory job with no high school diploma. Those days are gone. Raising minimum wage will not solve anything.

 

[MossRoad]

I'm certainly not looking for a discussion about the politics of health care.

There is an oddity in how people look at these benefits as compensation that Soundguy's post brought to mind. How many employees would like to receive direct compensation instead of health insurance payments? I don't recall people saying much about that trade-off. Are there employers who will pay salary in-lieu of insurance if the employee opts out?

My assumption is that generally, outside of a group plan, the employee could not purchase equivalent coverage on their own for the same dollars--were they inclined to. Supposing they were a person within the employer group plan that contributes to its lower cost, but they would rather have the dollars than the insurance? Under the Health Care law, they could conceivably meet the requirement for insurance with a plan that costs less than the employer's benefit value.

Bottom line, not all compensation is created equal--even if it graphs well. :laughing:

Yes, there are employers that will pay you to opt-out of their insurance. I know of several of my co-workers that do just that.

 

[smstonypoint]

Not sure the historical facts bear that out. Corporations are responsible for society. As public charters, We The People allow them to exist. As such, they should serve society, not exploit it. We give them the rights of people, to lobby and sue, buy politicians, commit crimes (yet cant be jailed) ; they are not confined to the limits of a mortal life to accumulate wealth and influence and thus have become more powerful than us mortals. And that folks is called Fascism Welcome to the NWO.

Really?

I own 500 corporations, so I (a mortal) think you have just called me a Fascist.*

Firms, regardless of legal structure (sole proprietorship, partnership, LLC, and for-profit corporations), serve society by providing consumers with goods and services. No one is compelling consumers to buy the products and services -- the consumers are free to choose. These firms are not charities -- they are in business to make profits. As the great man said, "It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest."

Corporations can't be jailed, but their employees can be.

That wealth belongs to the corporations' shareholders. Do you want to confiscate it from me and the millions of other shareholders? That hardly seems fair.

Would you abolish the corporate legal structure? What do you think the chances are that Deere and Company, the manufacturer of your tractor, would still be around had it not incorporated in 1868?

Would you have the government tell corporations what they should produce and how they should set prices? (BTW, that fits the description of fascism.)

Some corporations are certainly involved in rent-seeking, as are unions and other special-interest groups. In my opinion, we should focus on devising means to curtail rent-seeking behavior rather than throwing out the baby with the bath water.

Steve

* Well, I own a minute portion of 500 corporations though the S & P 500 Index Fund in my IRA.

 

[dave1949]

That's a 20% increase in the food budget of millions of Americans.

Only if they eat all their meals from low-paying restaurants. On a national average, as I posted earlier, people spend about 85 cents eating away from home for every $1 they spend eating at home. Not all of that eating away from home is done at places paying the minimum wage.

But even if that were true, you are seeing only one aspect of what happens in the larger picture. Your $3.21 (including tax) breakfast would cost 64 cents more at a minimum wage of $15/hour. What does that 64 cents accomplish? Will you go broke? Will the recipient become self-supporting and save you money in the long run?

It takes two basic things to fight poverty: effort and money.

Since you, as a moderator, could not resist expounding on your pet political theories, I offer a quote from John Kenneth Galbraith:

"The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness."

 

[brin]

Personally, I don't think this " One World Order" has helped us here in the US...I don't think it is helping Europe and the EU nations...Seems to me the world did much better when it was decentralized and peacefully trading with one another. I think the same can be said about the States of the US...Did we not do much better with much less Federal centralization ?

(This is Not Political...non partisan problem here )

 

[farmgirl19]

I agree, brin! Globalization is what hurt. It doesn't matter what party or person, it is the fact that we are supposed to be part of the worldwide system that has killed jobs, and set us back.

 

[dave1949]

According to this news story, McD's has taken the web content down that is being discussed.
McDonald's on employee resources site: Not lovin' it - CNN.com


"The University of California Berkeley Labor Center and University of Illinois released a study in October that said 52% of families of fast food workers receive assistance from a public program like Medicaid, food stamps, the Earned Income Tax Credit or Temporary Assistance for Needy Families."

Who pays for that?

 

[smstonypoint]

"The University of California Berkeley Labor Center and University of Illinois released a study in October that said 52% of families of fast food workers receive assistance from a public program like Medicaid, food stamps, the Earned Income Tax Credit or Temporary Assistance for Needy Families."

Dave,

I haven't read the referenced study yet, but I noticed on page 2 (http://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/publiccosts/fast_food_poverty_wages.pdf) that the study was funded by "Fast Food Forward."

Googling "Fast Food Forward" turns up this (Worker Centers | Fast Food Forward):

Fast Food Forward is an SEIU-funded coalition operating as a worker center with the open goal of unionizing restaurant employees in New York City chain restaurants. A secondary goal of the campaign is a $15 minimum wage.

The worker center takes the form of a "Fast Food Workers Committee, an entity that appears to have no other legal existence. Its registered address (as declared on the campaign site's privacy page, 2 - 4 Nevins St., 2nd Floor Brooklyn, NY 11217) is that of New York Communities for Change (NYCC). NYCC is a supporting organization in the campaign, and the New York Post has reported that NYCC is the remnant of Brooklyn's ACORN office.

The Service Employees International Union (SEIU) International headquarters has funneled large sums of money to NYCC. On the SEIU's 2012 LM-2 disclosure form filed with the Department of Labor, the SEIU reported funding the group in the amount of $2,447,126 for "support for organizing. Other groups in the Fast Food Forward coalition have received significant funding from other unions as well.

Fast Food Forward has encouraged multiple walkouts of restaurant employees in New York City since its founding. It is not clear how many workers have actually participated. Additionally, similar Workers Committees which may be linked to SEIU are operating on a national basis in many major cities.

One of the study's authors, Jeremy Thompson, "is the founder and principal of Economic Justice Research
Hub." Another Google search turned up this: (About Economic Justice Research Hub)

Jeremy Thompson founded Economic Justice Research Hub in September 2012.

Before founding Economic Justice Research Hub in September 2012, Jeremy Thompson was a Senior Researcher at 1199SEIU United Healthcare Workers East, a union representing 370,000 healthcare workers in Massachusetts, New York, New Jersey, Maryland, Washington DC, and Florida.

Corporations and unions engage in rent-seeking behaviors.

Steve

 

[dave1949]

Dave,

I haven't read the referenced study yet, but I noticed on page 2 (http://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/publiccosts/fast_food_poverty_wages.pdf) that the study was funded by "Fast Food Forward."

Googling "Fast Food Forward" turns up this (Worker Centers | Fast Food Forward):



One of the study's authors, Jeremy Thompson, "is the founder and principal of Economic Justice Research
Hub." Another Google search turned up this: (About Economic Justice Research Hub)



Corporations and unions engage in rent-seeking behaviors.

Steve

So, the pot is calling the kettle black? :laughing:
Worker Centers | About

"WorkerCenters.com is a project of the Center for Union Facts (CUF), a 501(c)3 non-profit organization dedicated to keeping a watchful eye on America’s labor union movement." You can read about CUF here: Center for Union Facts - SourceWatch

If the Center for Union Facts had factual information that contradicted the contents of the Fast Food Forward study, they should publish that. They seem to be the self-appointed anti-union police. Who funds that effort while they also hide behind the 501(c)3 non-profit organization label?

As to rent-seeking, I'm not sure publicizing factual information qualifies for that term.

 

[ddb123]

"The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness."

As concerns moral philosophy, a non question-begging obligation to selflessness is more difficult to produce.