Captain Philips: Somali Pirates. Any sailors Here?

[Egon]

It seems to me that even if going into a country that did not allow firearms, on a large transport ship, it would be so easy to carry a vessel large enough to offload security personnel and weapons into international waters while the ship was loading/unloading in port. Then rendezvous back with the security boat, load it back on the deck of the larger ship and be on the way. A 25-30 foot speed boat would be more than capable of staying out in the open ocean beyond the coastal limit for a week while the mother ship was in harbor and easily handled by the ship cranes when ready to disembark or reload onto the ship.

That may already be happening.

 

[MacLawn]

And, we are also losing our second amendment right. Thugs everywhere WILL have weapons. Maybe the rest of us will have to become thugs.

 

[houstonscott]

And, we are also losing our second amendment right. Thugs everywhere WILL have weapons. Maybe the rest of us will have to become thugs.

Your second amendment right doesn't apply in a foreign port. HS

 

[ovrszd]

Any country that bans a ship from entering it's ports because it's armed needs to go without the world trade the ship provides for a month. Then their minds would be changed. I fully understand some method to list and track those weapons along with a restriction that they stay onboard. I fully do not understand a country banning the ship. That country needs what I call a "Coming to Jesus" reality check.

 

[dmccarty]

Any country that bans a ship from entering it's ports because it's armed needs to go without the world trade the ship provides for a month. Then their minds would be changed. I fully understand some method to list and track those weapons along with a restriction that they stay onboard. I fully do not understand a country banning the ship. That country needs what I call a "Coming to Jesus" reality check.

While I agree with you, most countries and I think many of the people in them, do not agree. You see some anti gun arguments on TBN but what I have seen on the boating forums is amazing. Some people just do not understand the idea of a person defending themselves, or others, as an option and I am not talking about just using firearms either. It is unreal to me but that attitude seems to be very prevalent in other countries. I have seen this on websites and with many individuals I have known from other countries not to mention in the US. It is something that I simply cannot understand.

Some countries, and even US states, ban pepper/tear spray and tasers. An old fall back on boats for self defense was a flare gun but these have been made illegal in some places. Even spear guns are illegal from what I have read. The attitude of many of these people is that if you are getting robbed just give them thieves the money. Fine. I am ok with that but often the robbery turns into rape and murder. Now what? There was a boat with I think eight people on board, four couples and four "pirates" boarded the boat when it was at anchor. At least one of the woman, 60ish years old, was raped. Now one can argue that nobody was killed just a few people beaten and at least one woman raped so it could have been worse. Which to me is a complete misunderstanding of rape and some crimes. I know of someone who was raped in college. She never delt with the crime in spite of the best efforts of her husband. Long story very short, they are now getting divorced because the woman never came to terms with what happened to her. The guy, if he was even sent to prison, almost certainly was released years ago but this woman has a life sentence that she cannot escape. The crime against her has destroyed her life, impacted her kids, and ruined a marriage.

There are boats that have just disappeared in good weather in certain areas. Almost certainly the boat was pirated and the crew killed. I am looking at a very specific type of boat of which very small numbers have been built by 3-4 commercial yards and home builders. One of the boats was cruising in Venezuelan waters and by their own account were almost attacked. They were aware of their surroundings, saw suspicious activity, and when it got dark, they used the navigation system to get them out of Dodge. If they had not left ASAP, they would have been attacked and may never have been heard from again. They were lucky in that they were not attacked in day light because they were in an area with no one else around. No witnesses. They also should not have been there in the first place.

Having said this, attacks on small boats is not very common. Frankly, I know it is far riskier for me to drive to work than to go to sea. There really are few attacks on boats though I think there are more than are recorded because the crew is killed and the boat stolen but there are still not many attacks.

What I find very curious about the boating world is that if you are going to be in a boat, even in a coastal waters, you need to have your scat together. You need to plan what ifs. You need to have backup equipment and plans. If going offshore, one needs to be even better prepared. One needs more equipment to handle storms and to provide communication. One needs to develop skills and gain knowledge to survive on the ocean. Some of these skills are tractor related, i.e., diesel engine maintenance, hydraulics, electrical systems, etc. It is amazing to me how ignorant some/many captains are regarding their boats yet they are going offshore. :confused3: The anti gun people on the boating forums would agree with what I just said, yet they will have a fit if one mentions that a tool, aka a gun, is a valid item to carry on a boat for a variety of reasons. The anti gun people are often VERY knowledgeable about going to sea and being very well prepared boating wise, but mention G U N and they are like a bull with a red cape.

Now, the reality is, that if one is going to cruise the world, one just cannot have a firearm on board due to laws in other countries. You just have to provide means of defense through other methods and avoid places where piracy and crimes are taking place. A UK man was just murdered on his boat in St. Lucia after his boat was boarded in a port. If one reads up on the islands down there, some are great to visit, others not so much and you need to avoid certain areas/ports on some islands. The boat that was just attacked was in a port that should have been avoided but the boat owners may not have been aware. Just like you would avoid certain areas in any city or town.

Later,
Dan

 

[k0ua]

Dan you have hit the nail on the head, it is not just guns that many people are against it is the whole concept of self defense. I have never understood that as even a rabbit will often try to defend itself, but some people will not. To that I say OK. So be it, if that is how you want to be fine. Just don't try to stop me from defending myself with whatever is the best tool. And often the best tool is a gun and lots of ammo. When I saw the movie Capt. Phillps, the whole time I was thinking if I could have just been there with a handgun, I could have prevented the pirates from boarding. Just one handgun and a few magazines, with the other measures they were taking to prevent boarding (the firehoses and the zigzaging) would have made the difference. Imagine what one old bolt action rifle could have done while the pirate boats were astern and attempting to gain on the large ship. The whole thing just seems silly to me, to not have small arm aboard.

 

[brin]

My wife and I have talked about buying a 40' or so combination motor /sail boat and keeping it in Tybee Island , GA....we will not even consider doing that unless we can figure a way to create a compartment to keep weapons...there is no way we would sail to the Bahamas or anywhere else unarmed ...even just out a few miles off the coast..I would want a weapon....There are no cops out there...no nothing....Just nuts to go out on the open blue water without arms....I would never do it.

 

[dmccarty]

Dan you have hit the nail on the head, it is not just guns that many people are against it is the whole concept of self defense. I have never understood that as even a rabbit will often try to defend itself, but some people will not. To that I say OK. So be it, if that is how you want to be fine. Just don't try to stop me from defending myself with whatever is the best tool. And often the best tool is a gun and lots of ammo. When I saw the movie Capt. Phillps, the whole time I was thinking if I could have just been there with a handgun, I could have prevented the pirates from boarding. Just one handgun and a few magazines, with the other measures they were taking to prevent boarding (the firehoses and the zigzaging) would have made the difference. Imagine what one old bolt action rifle could have done while the pirate boats were astern and attempting to gain on the large ship. The whole thing just seems silly to me, to not have small arm aboard.

Absolutely. And that one little bolt gun could easily disable the engine on the pirate skiff. The larger merchant ships should never had a problem with the pirates and the smaller boats just are not worth the money. The piracy was and is about MONEY. Cut off the money and the pirates go away. A small private boat is simply not going to provide the huge money stream the merchant ships provide. But government policy prohibits people from defending themselves, even in lawless areas. It is irrational. You used to be able to go to the Bahamas with a firearm but the law changed over there in the last few years so that is now illegal. Crime against boats is not common over there from what I can tell but boats have been attacked in the past and the crew killed. It is not likely to happen, the odds are low, just like being in a bad storm at sea and precautions should be taken for both events.

It is funny to me, but if I went ever got the sail assisted power boat we are looking at to travel the oceans, we would have storm sails, sea drogue, sea anchors as well as 2-3 ground anchors and related rodes. The boat we are looking at has an option to have two separate steering mechanisms and auto pilots. The steering is hydraulic by the way. :thumbsup: We would want the backed up steering because I have heard of steering failures and it always occurs at the worst possible time. One needs to carry spare oil, alternators, repair kits, filters, hoses, belts, etc. One is considered unprepared if one is not so equipped. But if you have, shhhhhhh, a GUN on board, you are a NUT. :confused3::shocked:

When I read the boating discussions that are defense related, the anti defense people are amazing. Some of these guys are just awesome sailors who really know their stuff. They have been in storms and done things I would never want to do but they were prepared for the storms with training, equipment, and pre planning. If someone ever boards there boat, their plan is to given the thieves whatever the thieves want. They figure that is the safest thing to do. I guess if the pirates want their wife, the captain can tell her to relax and enjoy it. Morons.

While a firearm would be the best, easiest protection, boats can be made more secure, harder to board and easier to defend. What is an ironic hoot is that the anti defenders then argue that the defenses will just make the attackers more angry and they will take it out on you. :confused3: What the anti's don't understand, is that if Boat A has taken some simple defensive steps, attackers are going to go after Boat B that has done nothing... What they also do not seem to understand is that if they give up the money so easily, the thieves are likely to figure out that there is more to get, other wise, why give it up so early. A common tactic is to beat the heck out of the crew, aka torture, especially the wife to get the husband to give up more money. The thieves figure there is money on the boat and they want to get it all. If they don't think they have all of the money, they will work over the crew to make sure. Good luck with the Give Them The Money defense.

These protections are the same things one would do for a house, use lights, locked entries, if we ever got the boat I am obsessed with, netting aka fence, over the stern swim platform would protect both boat entry as well as the dingy, and if things are really iffy, the boaters can set up a watch system through the night. Some boaters have done this in some iffy ports. Boats trade off watch during the night and shine a light every once in awhile to make it obvious that a security watch is in place and active. Course, just like living on land, the best policy is to avoid trouble so one has to know the trouble spots which is not that hard in the 21st Century. But trouble can find you anywhere which is what happened to the eight people who were attacked one night. They were in a safe area, in a safe country, but trouble still found them.

One might not be able to use the most optimum tool for defense but there are other tools that can be used in spite of the Anti Defense People.

Later,
Dan

 

[kudzu04]

I know a guy who spends time aboard ships doing seismographic work.
At one time the company suggested painting broom handles black to simulate rifles.

 

[J_J]

You would think six mini-Gatling guns with laser sighting and night vision would be sufficient to ward off just about anything.

Or flame throwers.

Or the ships own remote controlled small boat or small sub loaded with C-4 or whatever to eliminate the foe with extreme prejudice.

If they still want to talk, use emergency channel.

No mercy.