Will this be tomorrow's transportation?

[dickfoster]

I did simple estimation of the break even point. If I buy Cruze for 18000 or Bolt for 30000. Assuming 1200 miles /month. Depending on cost of gas it will take anywhere between 10 years at 2.50/gal to 5 years at 5 gal. But if I decide to buy gasoline car I would most likely spend about 25000. And that lovers the break even point to about 2.5 years at 2.5/gal. I know 25000 buys better car but that make only little difference to me. Any new car will be step up from what I drive now.
I would predict that that electric cars will gain popularity in near future.
1.) They are fun to drive.
2.) They are quiet.
3.) They cost about 3 to 4 times less to operate.

It is true there is still oil in ground but there is no cheap oil in ground.
I am currently working at oil production facility. The wells are about 20 years in operation and are significantly depleted. What comes from ground is 80% water and 20% oil. The water was pumped under ground to increase pressure of oil to push it to the surface. So it cost more to process the oil (separate water and gas) and in the same time there is less coming out. In other words large investment had to be made (hundreds of million of dollars) to add pumps and compressors to get less oil than when the oil wells were new. I do lot of work for oil and gas all over the world and I see the same story everywhere.

One wrinkle in your plan is the elimination of idiotic gubberment subsidies. Not exactly a remote prospect given the last election.
Bear in mind that with the present state of the grid, we can't even satisfy 100% of the demand on a hot day. What happens if all of a sudden everyone is plugging a car into the grid? Is the tooth fairy gonna come to the rescue?

 

[dickfoster]

At a huge cost in compression, cryogenics, storing and transport.

Well it ain't exactly easy to produce, transport and dispense gasoline either but we manage to do it in multiple flavors and grades. All of those problems are not really problems, they are simple engineering exercises. The biggest problem with hydrogen is where it comes from. Today that's right back at the oil well but with enough electricity from nuclear it could be done. A lot of things could be done including solving a lot of water shortage issues. The big nut to crack in a many problems is the energy nut. Crack that nut and all of a sudden you find economical solutions to lots of problems. With enough cheap electricity on tap you could even make your own hydrogen fuel from your garden hose. BTW They have hydrogen fuel stations in place in Iceland. The first went into operation in 2003 I think it was. The hydrogen is produced with electrolysis because Iceland has a heapin helpin of geothermal on tap.

 

[KennyG]

Freight traines could beat or equal that speed while caryying 10x as much. Okay, the 10x may be a bit much but...

10X is a vast understatement. Coal trains typically weigh 15,000 to 20,000 tons, 100 times what the airship would carry. Our rail system continues to be underused and poorly maintained and planned.

 

[rox]

Will the transporting industry be converted?

The technology seems to look Good.
[video]https://electrek.co/2016/07/20/tesla-semi-truck-business-cargo/[/video]

Great topic Egon!
This is really fascinating isn't it?

 

[Redneck in training]

Yeah and I think that will be Thorium fueled fission reactors, likely the molten salt type. With enough cheap and clean energy on tap, you can make a lot of stuff start to make sense. And this seems to be the most likely with few or the drawbacks present in today's light water uranium fueled reactors. But just uttering nuclear is a lot like shouting boogeyman to those who simply don't want to understand. And this is a technology that could even help eliminate much of the radioactive crap that we're currently stuck with. Instead of stockpiling it for a gazillion years, you can burn it up and use it to make power. Even the plutonium from nuclear weapons and be disposed of. Remember all we're trying to do is make heat to boil water and make steam so in addition to building more power plants, you could conceivably convert every power plant today to use a thorium fueled reactor as the heat source and do it safely.

Thorium Fuel Cycle - IAEA NEFW

If what you say will happen then electric cars will become mainstream. Hydrocarbons will be used to make something more useful than fuel.

 

[vvanders]

LOL Well some have to believe and belong to the herd but I don't. I don't have any tattoos either.
Funny thing you try to talk about something that has some real hope of being truly green and the greenies won't hear it and don't want to hear it. Their hopeless, idiotic wind, solar and electric car crap that will never work has them all bamboozled. I guess unless some idiot like Al Gore tells em it's so, it just can't be so. I call em the drooling masses for good reasons. Lucy for us most of em will be fully occupied, sobbing over their coloring books for a few years now. :laughing:

I liked TBN for being fairly a-political, there's no need for that kinda stuff here. If you've got technical arguments I'm all for hashing it out.

For what it's worth(from your other post) I think salt based breeder reactors are something that should be looked at. I think designs that fail-safe and can be engineered based off of operational learning over the last 100 years have lots of potential, however they can still be difficult to implement at a local level.

 

[houstonscott]

Final wind-turbine rule permits thousands of eagle deaths - Breitbart

I'd ban wind power.

HS

 

[the old grind]

Hydrogen distribution would have to build its infrastructure over time, like the cel networks did with placing towers one by one. They'll have to compete with dino fuels for quite some time, and it'll surely take a while for gas and diesel vehicles to be emission tested off the roads altogether.

We're not all being closed-minded about green technology, but subsidies seem necessary until economy of scale can provide profit margins to those in the biz big time. Remember that just because a company is involved in 'green technology' doesn't mean it's a good investment. Some will fail despite the growing fervor and gov't help. ("Solyndra, report!")

As long as operating cost favors ICE over electric or hybrid options by a large enough margin a lot of us still won't 'pay the freight' just to 'go green'. I'm sure many of us will also die waiting for a pickup that will tow squat vs a puny commuter 'beer can' that's far from living up to our 'manly' demands. (Just sayin' ...)

 

[Egon]

Great topic Egon!
This is really fascinating isn't it?

Hi Rox.

What will happen and what is possible is always interesting.

Even more interesting is the introduction of a new sceince displaceing what's in place now. As an example the introduction of the automobile met with considerable resistance from some.

The current California Hydrogen vehicle infrastructure looks promising.

European use of wind and solar also get my attention. Just wish there were reliable sources of the cost parameters.

 

[Egon]

Final wind-turbine rule permits thousands of eagle deaths - Breitbart

I'd ban wind power.

HS

Gonna tear Down all the tall buildings too?