Flail Mower 65" Ditch Bank flail mower and a Kioti CK4010?

Morphioss96 · Jul 9, 2017

I am wondering if I would have any problems running a Betsco FH-AGL165 mower with my 40hp kioti. It is right on the edge of the recommended hp rating but many of the threads on here say you can usually go bigger with no problem. The main reason I want the 65" is I have a lot of overhang on my driveway and walking paths and the longer the mower the higher I can clear, he extra cutting with is a bonus as well. I would be using it to maintain my 2 acres of normal lawn as well as my 3 acres of overgrown fields which is where the walking trails are. The only time I could imagine running into any issues is when I go to clear out some of the long heavy stuff but I have no problems going slow in these areas.

As of yet i have only used my tractor for the FEL and forks to move around materials so I have to experience with my PTO. Any and all input would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

Max

ericm979 · Jul 9, 2017

On their web site they say 30+ hp for the AFL165. Tractors with 37hp like mine normally run 6' rotary cutters. I'm planning on a 65-78" flail.

I'm not sure but think you'll want one valve with float so it can follow the terrain.

RjCorazza · Jul 9, 2017

I think he is referring to the one that shifts right and angles up and down. I believe in Europe they are called verge mowers. Anyway, the flail in question lists the minimum hp at 40. I am currently deciding on Italian or Chinese, but would not be overly concerned about being at the low end of the hp requirement. Since the standard flails of a similar size list a minimum hp of 30, I can only surmise they recommend a higher hp tractor because they are generally heavier.
The Italian brands are almost twice the price, so for my light use I may opt for the FH-AGL165 .

Morphioss96 · Jul 9, 2017

Yes the ditch bank version has 2 hydraulic cylinders. I am assuming that is what would be taking the extra HP, if your cutting and working the cylinders at the same time. I agree with you RJ I would really like to get a better quality machine for piece of mind but double the price for what I need it for is a bit out of the budget.

The float feature should be part of the 3 pt hitch if I am thinking about it correctly. The cylinders should only move it left/right and swivel it up and down.

RjCorazza · Jul 10, 2017

I didn't think about the hydraulic movement while mowing requiring more umph. Still manageable though - I'm not sure I would be capable of that many movements while going forward and cutting anyway. My primary use will be a long stream bank that I really need the longer reach of at least the 60" verge mowers, so I am willing to stretch the minimums. I am more concerned about tractor weight to handle the elevation and offset, but my tractor comes in at around 6800 lbs which should be heavy enough. Some other mfgs listed significantly lighter tractor weight requirements for slightly smaller verge flails.
Good luck with whatever you decide upon...

3Lfarms · Jul 10, 2017

40 hp should run it. The real concern is if the tractor is heavy enough to handle 1000lbs hanging 4 feet behind and 6 feet off the side. If you hang it out over a ditch, and aren't smooth with the hydraulics, I can see the tractor flopping over on its side.

Grandad4 · Jul 10, 2017

3Lfarms said:
40 hp should run it. The real concern is if the tractor is heavy enough to handle 1000lbs hanging 4 feet behind and 6 feet off the side. If you hang it out over a ditch, and aren't smooth with the hydraulics, I can see the tractor flopping over on its side.

What he said. Highway mowing crews use larger utility tractors for this work and even so have some serious counterweight for balance. Stability will be the issue with the size tractor you've got.

Morphioss96 · Jul 10, 2017

These are definitely the responses I am looking for! thank you for your input. I really would only be using it at maybe 36" out at most but the main use for the offset is to clear my driveway which I would be 12"-24" out. I cant think of a scenario on my property that it would be fully extended while being held in the air. That being said, I need to research what the 3pt hitch is rated at. I am looking forward to the extra weight also since my box blade is not a very good counter balance for my FEL.

Would you say that th3 65" extended 36" would be more or less stable than a 57" at the same 36"? The center of balance would be further in by 4"-5" depending on the weight of the hitch and swing arm. My other concern is at 90' the weight distribution but I would only have it out no more than 24" at max. The longer flail means I can keep it lower to the ground for stability as well.

Is their a big difference in weight distribution when talking 800 vs 900 pounds? Either one I would be just as concerned about with it 24" out 90" up. My tractor is roughly 3000lbs with a wheelbase of 55".

And my 3pt hitch is rated at 1600lbs at 24"

Thanks again for all of the input.

ericm979 · Jul 10, 2017

On this page it says 30+:

65 Ditch Bank Flail Mower w/Hammers Installed FH-AGL165 65" Ditch Bank Flail Mower w/Hammers Installed [FH-AGL165] - $2,429. : Betst Products LLC, Rugged Labor Saving Equipment Since 1995

That's more in line with the ratings on Italian flails that size.

The HP ratings on the Chinese flails can be all over the place. Some specs I've seen have the same HP ratings for a number of different sized flails, which is obviously incorrect. Try calling Betstco and asking about that and if the size and style is appropriate. Perhaps a side shifting model would suit your needs since you don't think you'll have to extend the ditch bank mower all the way.

The hydraulic cylinders don't take any appreciable HP.

Unless you're using it to trim trees it'll be on the ground when mowing, and the mower's weight will be on the roller. It's when you pick it up to transport or back up that the weight will be on the tractor.

3Lfarms · Jul 10, 2017

That machine specifies that the minimum tractor weight should be 4600lbs. If you have a loader and filled rears, you should be OK.
I have a 6.5' Berti mower ditch/bank mower like that,except it weighs almost 1300lbs. My 60 hp (PTO) tractor weighs about 6400lbs and I still need to load the rears to be comfortable using that mower.