Diesel hard to start, boggs down,quits running

[DieselBound]

Look for collapsing lines.

Might try blowing some compressed air (use lower pressure) back toward the tank from the fuel filter to see if you can detect any blockages.

A) There's a debris blockage that shifts around;
B) You have a collapsing fuel line (scrutinize any soft lines);
C) IP is bad.

Have you tried pulling fuel from a can (or such) directly to the IP (put an in-line filter in any line you use)?

 

[Fallon]

20 minutes is about right to make a vacuum in the fuel tank if it can't breath when you suck the fuel out. Open the tank after it dies & listen for air rushing in or the tank reinflating. If so check your vent line or the vent in the cap, or wherever it is.

 

[crazyhorsemd]

Can't thank you all enough for the assistance. Nice to get helpful advice without all the negative personal thoughts

DieselBound: #1. I actually blew compressed air in line from tank a few weeks ago, tractor started. Thought of dirt in tank or lines...that's when I removed/cleaned tank, replaced lines, filters. Started, ran 20 minutes then died......again
#2. Replaced fuel lines ( Regular rubber lines, from what I can see ...no collapse
Fallon: Took fuel cap off, even drilled a small hole 1/8" in cap thinking "if vacuum built up this would take care of it" Never thought of removing cap after dies to listen. That I'll try.....
Don't want to be a pain... but $ tight and feel that the way it dies out...it sounds to me ( and my neighbor) it's starved for fuel and I SHOULD be able to figure it out. Should being the operative word.
Thanks all

Thinking of lift pump but doesn't make sense that after 20 minutes it would give out....or the IP. Why would it run then give out?

 

[LouNY]

It sounds to me like you have two different problems,
I have had good luck with starters from dixie electric, i have replaced the starter on an Oliver 1550 diesel with there gear reduction starter,
amazing the difference in cranking speed and starting.
As far as losing power and shutting itself down, is that a roosa master injection pump on that tractor,
it is a common problem with them, there is a rubber ring in the pump that will deteriorate and plug up the excess fuel return line,
when that happens it will shut itself down.
you can remove the pump return line when it's running and see if it helps.

 

[LouNY]

copied from a different forum,


Two things will stop a Roosa Master. The first is a lack of fuel. This is the side that everyone looks at. Make sure there is fuel through the filters and available to the pump. Pretty basic.

The second is the killer that catches a few. The Roosa Master "MUST" get rid of the return fuel or it will not run. If pressure builds on the return side, they die. You can shut off a Roosa Master by just clamping off the return line. What happens is the plastic (Elastacast) ring, which takes the surge out of the governor, disintegrates into little pieces of black plastic that looks like sand. A lot of this can build up in the return lines, pipes and also the returns off the nozzles. This plugs the return line and kills the engine.

Take the return fillting out of the top cover of the pump. Check for this sand looking black plastic. If it is there, you have a plugged return line. Then go back to the tank, remove the return line and blow it backwards towards the pump. I have seen them plugged rather tight. Don't blow it back into the pump. You can start the engine with the return line off to see if it will run. You will get a fair amount of fuel from the return but you can catch it in some way so you don't make a total mess.

When you get the return line open, it will now run. You may have to blow through the return line along the nozzles. Had a 4020 JD do this to me one time and it would not run until I did.

If it still don't run with a clean return line, you now have to put a gauge on the transfer pump pressure port to see if you have the right amount of transfer pump pressure to the main hydraulic head. This will take a guy with the right gauge and fittings.

Now, what to do with the pump with a bad elastacast ring? Run it until you have the time to get it fixed. I can do it for $200.00 in parts/labor but most diesel shops are not this cheap. There is really nothing that can be hurt with this ring missing. It may polish the inside of the aluminum case but this does not cause a problem. Don't run it forever, but a few hundred hours won't hurt a thing.

 

[thepumpguysc]

That last paragraph should be stricken, burned & never heard from again..!!!
ALOT can & will happen, not repairing a broken flex ring.. it becomes a metal to metal contact, where 2 pieces of metal are banging against each other at hi rpms.. Eventually the metal wears, throwing metal particals thru out the fuel system and back to the fuel tank for future contamination & the 2 pieces break & cause catastrophic results.. both to the injection pump & engine..
Running an engine without the checkball return connector is possible & done often, for diagnosis purposes & in a situation to move the equipment.. stuck in a field or on a trailer.. NOT as a FIX to the problem..
I guess the poster redeemed himself w/ the last sentence but it seems like its to little, to late.. its some really bad advice..
I have personally seen an engine run away 3 minutes after a checkball was knocked out.. & I've seen an engine run for months w/ one knocked out.. it all depends on how badly the flex ring has deteriorated..
I know this doesn't "help" w/ your problem but if I can "help" by not making matters worse.. then this post served a purpose.. TPG

 

[crazyhorsemd]

Back at it.....

Loosened retune line, didn't see "gunk" unfortunately didn't have enough room to remove / inspect check ball valve. After to usual slow starting (yes I am going to pull starter have it tested / replaced if necessary) the tractor ran for 45 minutes in idle and mid / full throttle until I shut it down. Next day, same result only I hooked up flail mower and cut for about 30 minutes. Did not loose power but boy it seems to run hot. Hotter than before...at least it feels so.
I have notices 2 new leaks from the IP..not pouring at but definitely dripping visibly. When I went to shut it off..gave one last "big burp" of white smoke like post detonation. Any thoughts or am I just looking too hard and missing the main issue in front of me. I really liked this tractor and can't afford another now. was )hard to start) but ran well once started

 

[07wingnut]

From your first entry, you state it may puke breather oil when starting. This may indicated blowback from a non sealing intake valve. A non sealing intake valve means that your compression sucks. When you do get it started, it would run but when it heats up, a tight valve would expand to make the sealing even worse and may stop the engine from running thru a worsening of compression. You need to check your valve clearances. Long shot, but its worth a look. A compression test would confirm it one way or the other.

 

[DieselBound]

If your IP is leaking you need to fix that. If fuel can leak then that means that air can enter: if you get air in your fuel lines when cold and trying to start it's going to make starting difficult.

And, yes, probably not a bad idea to check valves and your compression.

 

[TemporaryKubotaOwnerMark]

Yes, an injector pump is a real possibility. If there's a seal leaking, you could be sucking air. Might only happen when it warms.

You might also have a battery or starter problem. It's an old tractor, so things are bound to be tired. A multimeter won't really tell the story - you need to have the battery load tested. While you're fussing around with it, carefully check all of your terminals, cables, and grounds.