Tiller Tiller Question

[Jackfr]

We have five acres of newly cleared field to prepare for seeding this spring. It has been stumped and the large rocks we've found so far removed, but still has forest root mat on it in places along with some of the broken roots of scrub pine, maple and oak trees. The area is mostly sandy soil with rocks ranging from golf ball size to house size. In the past we have plowed, harrowed and then picked the trash by hand from the fields when we have cleared them. This was very time consuming and labor intensive. I've never used a tiller before. My question is will an 7 or 8' tiller with a slip clutch be able to handle the forest root mat, root pieces up to 1" in diameter and the smaller rocks? Any recommendations for a tiller? I only need the top 2 to 3" fined up to plant grass for hay and pasture. I plan on harrowing with my 10' transport harrow first to help level up.

 

[oosik]

The harrow should help "break" the top soil and make the job for any tiller quite a bit easier. My experience with virgin tracts is that the initial breaking of the surface of the soil will be the most difficult part of tilling. There should not be too many areas that require a second pass. I've never used a tiller as big as you want so no help there. Perhaps see if you can rent one - pretty expensive piece of equipment for just one time use.

 

[fried1765]

We have five acres of newly cleared field to prepare for seeding this spring. It has been stumped and the large rocks we've found so far removed, but still has forest root mat on it in places along with some of the broken roots of scrub pine, maple and oak trees. The area is mostly sandy soil with rocks ranging from golf ball size to house size. In the past we have plowed, harrowed and then picked the trash by hand from the fields when we have cleared them. This was very time consuming and labor intensive. I've never used a tiller before. My question is will an 7 or 8' tiller with a slip clutch be able to handle the forest root mat, root pieces up to 1" in diameter and the smaller rocks? Any recommendations for a tiller? I only need the top 2 to 3" fined up to plant grass for hay and pasture. I plan on harrowing with my 10' transport harrow first to help level up.

The renting of a 7' or 8' tiller as suggested by "Oosik" is a good idea, but where?
I too am from SE Ma. and have absolutely no idea where to rent such a tiller.
I bought a new 60" King Kutter tiller, because there is nothing like it in our general area for me to rent.
A 7' or 8' tiller would be almost impossible to find for rent in our area.

 

[oosik]

I know, I know - there is absolutely nowhere I could rent something like that around here either. You guys back east always come up with all sorts of used equipment at auctions, farm sales, internet, etc. I was just hoping such might be available.

Thirty five years around this area and I can't even find a used hoe for sale. It is a total lost cause trying to find used utility tractor sized implements in this neck of the woods. I simply gave up long ago and now I save up and buy new stuff. Man, it goes against my grain - but what is a guy to do.

 

[majorwager]

oosik,
Thanks for advice.

Jackfr,
Woodmax make a nice 7 ft tiller, gear drive, reasonable price. Not sure if root cover would be an issue. need to consult factory. I have a BEFCO tiller. They offer a straight blade option. It also was shipped with std cupped blades as well. I use the straight blades for Aeration twice a year in horse pastures. Makes the machine much more versatile, Aeration very healthy for grass/hay fields, Believe it would work with root cover. The salient point here is that any machine shop can fabricate straight blades for any tiller. They just need a std blade from factory as a template. They should use AR 500 tempered steel. Bevel the edge. You can see an example on the BEFCO website. They use a sports field as an example. I do NOT use the close spacing as shown, not necessary, I skip to every other disc. Weight is the secret to a tiller efficiency. They are as self destructive as a helicopter, if you are familiar, so they must be heavy to eliminate the bounce. Must be used when soil is high moisture, if the sun hardens the ground, forget it. As for a power harrow, fabulous tool, extremely costly especially for single or occasional use.

 

[tcreeley]

I don't think a tiller will speed things along. You most likely will need multiple passes to get the ground where you want it. I am inclined to think that plowing and harrowing are still your best options - especially if you have the equipment already. Perhaps using a landscape rake to clean up at the end would help.
goodluck-

 

[Phillip w]

Here what I think. Scrap the tiller idea. If you got roots and rocks and what not, I think that would be really hard on a tiller. You take the chance of rapping a "green" root up in the tiller or possibly hitting a big rock and busting the gear drive or something. I think I'd find a good heavy disk that will really cut in to the soil and disc it. A disc would glide over a big rock and may cut up some of those roots. I got 2 discs. One is an old case disc and I can put it with either my 730 John Deere or ma allis Chalmers 185. The other disc is a Krause and it is really heavy and really cuts in. My 730 can't handle it and allis doesn't want any more. If at that disc just cut in at max, it stop that allis in its tracks. I think a disc like that with about 140 hp tractor and let it cut in at max would be the answer. There is a lot of ground back here that gets broke up with a big disc.

 

[majorwager]

tcreely,
Thought you would have presented that post more poetically but here is a thought. OP stated he does not wish to go very deep. Maybe a chisel plow? Mold board and big rocks don't mix well. And any plowing will simply produce significantly more rock. The OP may actually find himself between a rock, a hard place, and even more rocks. The power harrow, expensive alternative, will certainly churn up additional rocks. Is a disc harrow what you propose? Seems feasible and should be available used in reasonable condition. Needs adequate adjustment ability to control aggressiveness.

 

[corl]

I have 6+ foot rototiller for my produce garden. It is a great tool but would't be what you would need. If you didn't break it you would need half a dozen passes and you still have to pick up the rocks and roots as you go at each pass.

 

[Phillip w]

tcreely,
Thought you would have presented that post more poetically but here is a thought. OP stated he does not wish to go very deep. Maybe a chisel plow? Mold board and big rocks don't mix well. And any plowing will simply produce significantly more rock. The OP may actually find himself between a rock, a hard place, and even more rocks. The power harrow, expensive alternative, will certainly churn up additional rocks. Is a disc harrow what you propose? Seems feasible and should be available used in reasonable condition. Needs adequate adjustment ability to control aggressiveness.

With the discs I have they work on a hydraulic cylinder. You can raise the disc all the way up so only the tire touch the ground. This is for transport either down the road or to the field. It kind of works on a pivot controlled my the cylinder. When you get to the field, you lower the disc by gradually raising the the wheels. That is how you can control the depth. Ig you pull the wheels all the way up so the tires are not touching the ground, your gonna be cutting in at max depth. If you have a big heavy disc, that when your going to need that 140 hp tractor. Like wise if you paying the disc and it is pulling hard, you use the cylinder to lift the disc a little to take a little load off the tractor. And yes, I've seen guys pulling a harrow behind a disc. I've also seen discs dragging a piece of angle iron with chains and big loops (4-6 inches in diameter) in place of a harrow. The idea is when the disc is all the way up, the chains are not touching the ground. Works out pretty good.

 

[Jackfr]

Thanks for all the input.

We do have a set of 10' transport harrows that you can raise or lower hydraulically and are adjustable to make them more or less aggressive. We were hoping for an easier solution than plowing and harrowing as the woods root mat usually hangs up in the plows in large clumps then it's a real pain to clear and break it up. We've even tried removing the top 2 to 3" of root mat in the past with a dozer and stock piling it for a year or so until it rots down but we don't have that option this time (no place to store it). So that is why we're asking about different ideas and possibly using a tiller to help break up the woods root mat and hopefully not kick up to many rocks.

We've been looking for a used tiller locally and so far none. No one locally rents one that would be worth while (unless we wanted to do the 5 acres walking behind a 30" one)

Been looking at different Tillers new. Some folks say a heavier one is better others say lighter one. Some advise a multi speed one others say make sure you can reverse the the spin. Figured what ever we buy should have a slip clutch on it.

Has anyone have suggestions on a brand or size? We were thinking in the 7' to 8' range. We've been advised to make sure it matches the HP of the tractor we're planning on using (75HP) for warranty reasons. Our dealer has suggested a sundown VH-80 50-85 hp. The woodmaxx RT-80 is 30-55 HP. The Land pride 74" and 82" are 30-60 HP, the Befco 74" 30-60 HP, King Cutter 84" 50-65 HP

 

[majorwager]

Believe a heavier tiller is best advice if you elect that Route. Mine is heavy and it bounces, so difficult to imagine light being an improvment. The disc would cut the material in sections. Have you considered renting a wood chipper.? A lot of hand work but wood chips would compost or could be plowed into soil. Many home depot stores have rental tools including HD chipper. Could use pallet forks or even hay spear to free root material from soil, labor intensive but also inexpensive. Once material is piled, then rent the chipper, just thinking out loud.........

FRONTIER equipment, division of DEERE has larger tillers. Gearbox rating unknown, likely expensive, believe they go to 10 ft but then the HP requirements are substantial.

 

[fried1765]

Thanks for all the input.

We do have a set of 10' transport harrows that you can raise or lower hydraulically and are adjustable to make them more or less aggressive. We were hoping for an easier solution than plowing and harrowing as the woods root mat usually hangs up in the plows in large clumps then it's a real pain to clear and break it up. We've even tried removing the top 2 to 3" of root mat in the past with a dozer and stock piling it for a year or so until it rots down but we don't have that option this time (no place to store it). So that is why we're asking about different ideas and possibly using a tiller to help break up the woods root mat and hopefully not kick up to many rocks.

We've been looking for a used tiller locally and so far none. No one locally rents one that would be worth while (unless we wanted to do the 5 acres walking behind a 30" one)

Been looking at different Tillers new. Some folks say a heavier one is better others say lighter one. Some advise a multi speed one others say make sure you can reverse the the spin. Figured what ever we buy should have a slip clutch on it.

Has anyone have suggestions on a brand or size? We were thinking in the 7' to 8' range. We've been advised to make sure it matches the HP of the tractor we're planning on using (75HP) for warranty reasons. Our dealer has suggested a sundown VH-80 50-85 hp. The woodmaxx RT-80 is 30-55 HP. The Land pride 74" and 82" are 30-60 HP, the Befco 74" 30-60 HP, King Cutter 84" 50-65 HP

I have the King Kutter 60" tiller (on the Cape), and it is a very solidly built piece of equipment (690 lb. for the 60")
You could see it for comparison, except that it is in my locked barn, and I am in Florida until late April.
I am too old for winter in SE Ma. anymore!

If you do order a King Kutter, try Blain's Farm & Fleet in Janesville, WI.
They currently have the 84" KK tiller for $2349.99 with $145.47 shipping to ZIP 02362 (Plymouth) for a total delivered price of $2495.46.
Sometimes (Spring?) they have a sale also.
I very much doubt that you will beat their price ANYWHERE!
No sales tax either!

I bought my 60" KK tiller (on line) from Blain's, and they were great to deal with.
Have since bought (on line) an 84" KK rear blade, and a 60" KK box blade from Blain's.

 

[Phillip w]

I got a king kutted and unless you plow first, it will bounce and bang and what not. It ko my pto on my tractor. Rollers are nice, but I've found it is better if you plow first.

 

[Egon]

If you got roots and use a tiller most of your time will be spent cutting roots out of the tines.

If you have enough HP a heavy disk works well. Next would be the plow. As mentioned a chisel tooth or just plain ripper run over the area first would be of real benefit ripping up and breaking roots but easily cleaned by lifting and backing.

There is no easy way!

 

[fried1765]

It would seem like your best option for getting the roots might be a heavy duty spring type cultivator.

The two manufacturers of these are Dirt Dog, and Fred Cain.

The largest Dirt Dog model is only about 85" wide, but Fred Cain models go all the way up to 173" wide.
I own a similar cultivator, marketed by Darrel Harp Enterprises, in Alabama, but made in India.
I do NOT recommend a DHE (India) cultivator!

Everything Attachments sells the Fred Cain line,("free shipping" - to nearest freight terminal) and that might be your best option. They (Travis) can probably give you advice on what size you need.

You can pull roots easily with these cultivators, because they are quite robust pieces of equipment, and when you back up, the tool will self clean.

 

[Sonny580]

Disk and follow with landscape rake, (heavy duty one), make several passes!--- Lotta work but will do the job.
PS. --- I have a KK 72" tiller and will say this,---KEEP TILLERS AWAY FROM ROOTS ---- and rocks!!!! ---- It's very easy to damage your tractor pto system with the impact, even with a slip clutch!
If you go with tiller, it most likely will be junk IF it survives the job!---Factor that into the job cost!---May be worth checking into a custom operator with the equipment to contract the job. thanks; sonny

 

[fried1765]

Disk and follow with landscape rake, (heavy duty one), make several passes!--- Lotta work but will do the job.
PS. --- I have a KK 72" tiller and will say this,---KEEP TILLERS AWAY FROM ROOTS ---- and rocks!!!! ---- It's very easy to damage your tractor pto system with the impact, even with a slip clutch!
If you go with tiller, it most likely will be junk IF it survives the job!---Factor that into the job cost!---May be worth checking into a custom operator with the equipment to contract the job. thanks; sonny

From personal experience, it is VERY unlikely that there is a "custom operator" with any sort of suitable equipment, that the OP could hire, anywhere near Plymouth, Ma.

 

[powerscol]

As for renting have you checked with the big agg dealers. Sometimes they will demo things. I also would recommend plowing or ripping before tilling. I have a very heavy duty ansung YJR074. Its built heavy enough to handle the task. Several advertisers here sell them.

 

[fried1765]

As for renting have you checked with the big agg dealers. Sometimes they will demo things. I also would recommend plowing or ripping before tilling. I have a very heavy duty ansung YJR074. Its built heavy enough to handle the task. Several advertisers here sell them.

There are absolutely NO "big agg dealers" anywhere near Plymouth, Ma.
Cranberry growing is the only crop in the OP's area.