Buying Advice First time on 5 acres - tractor selection?

[mtconnol]

Hi all,

My fiance and I are first-time property owners on 5 acres outside of Bellingham, WA. The property was neglected for a couple seasons, so there is a fair amount of remedial landscaping to do. Here's what we're up against:

• We have a large section of blackberries to cut back / work on eradicating - probably 200' by 100'.
• The 5 acres is mostly rough field / pasture which needs to be bush hogged, except for a smallish front lawn (about 1/6) acre which needs mowing.
• There are several incomplete french drain projects around outbuildings - these were left open, with pipe in place but no gravel. They need completed digging, then backfill with gravel.
• The digging done on the french drain left large piles of earth between buildings, where we'd like it to be flat and perhaps graveled for easy car access.
• We have about 300 feet of gravel driveway in fairly rough repair that should be regraded.
• The area is known to get significant snow at times, and I am wondering in general how to best handle clearing the driveway and walkways between outbuildings (and potentially the barn)
• In the next year we are hoping to add a herd of around 8 sheep, so will be wanting to bring them hay, and move their fences around periodically.
• The property is fairly flat, but contains a lot of lumps and rises.
• There are occasional stumps to pull (at least one dead tree we need to deal with sooner rather than later) and we would like to plant additional trees.

To me, when I look at this list, it seems like we need a tractor. I guess the first question is whether other folks agree on that. We could hire the work out, but when I look at the earthwork especially, it feels like I'd rather put the money into a tractor. So far we have a Stihl Kombi-system for brush cutting, but it feels like no match for the mass quantities of blackberries present.

So I've been looking at Kubota BX and B series machines with loaders and backhoe. Am I barking up the right tree here? How useful would the backhoe be on an ongoing basis? (I've heard that they are small enough to be not so useful.) I hate to get a new machine when so many used ones are floating around, but the financing actually makes it much more approachable for us. I'm mechanically minded (background as an engineer, service my own vehicles, etc) but tractor ownership (as well as property ownership at this scale) is new to both of us.

Questions:

- For the tasks listed, does a tractor cover all my bases? Is it overkill? I get the sense that it's a good 'generalist' tool but not really the best at any of these things (especially clearing snow, perhaps.)

- What sizes and brands should I be looking at? We have good Kubota and John Deere dealers near by, nothing else is super close. I am super turned off by some of the Deere 'held hostage by the software' reports that I've read, but am unclear how relevant they are at this SCUT / CUT scale.

- As complete newbies, what else do we 'not know that we don't know?'

- If we bought a new machine today, what kind of service life could we expect from it if we maintain it properly and house it under cover?

Thanks in advance for helping spend our money! Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[BRMyers]

You came to the right place, there are a lot of people on here with good information.

One question I have, are you looking for a cab or no cab? It sounds like the winters could be rough, so was curious what your thoughts are on a cab.

Tractor size, my guess is that a compact would be a better fit than a sub. It looks like you have short term needs for FEL and box blade type work, with a long term need for FEL to maintain livestock. The brush hog (rotary mower) of 5 to 6ft range will meet your needs and will be horse power dependent.

From everything I have read on here, spending money on a back hoe is usually better spent on renting a machine and using the extra money to by a little nicer tractor.

As far as brand, that is the Ford Chevy debate. I like Kubota, next person may like John Deere. Once you figure out what you need and what you want, then visit the local dealers, see which tractor you like best and which dealer seems most responsive to you.

 

[Diggin It]

The BH will come in extremely handy for some of the tasks at hand, but what else will you have down the road? I use mine a lot more than I figured I would.

For moving piles of dirt, a tractor is NOT a dozer. You can do serious damage to the loader arms of a small machine by trying to dig solid piles. I've had luck by breaking piles loose with the BH or a tiller, then using the loader to move the loosened dirt.

Can't speak to snow removal since I don't have that task.

Driveway maintenance can be done with a few different rear blade type attachments.

Don't be stuck on Orange paint. Red and Blue are more than capable and will cost less.

 

[mtconnol]

You came to the right place, there are a lot of people on here with good information.

One question I have, are you looking for a cab or no cab? It sounds like the winters could be rough, so was curious what your thoughts are on a cab.
.

Thanks for the warm welcome! I hadn't been considering a cab, mostly because of the extreme cost versus actually being able to 'do more things'. It might depend on the extend of the wintertime duties, which would probably be limited to any snow management and animal chores. So it feels like they wouldn't extend for hours at a time.

 

[TripleR]

You are going to get some more detailed answers than mine and they will be as valid if not more so than mine, as there are so many ways to go. We have SCUTS, CUTs and up to an M8540HDC. You can get by with something like a Kubota B2601 as the smallest, B2650 even better, but no need long term to go bigger, in my opinion at least. You will need to buy or rent a backhoe or excavator; we rent, but in your case I'd buy one.

Now if you have an unlimited budget...

 

[jeff9366]

The most efficient way to shop for tractors is to identify potential tractor applications first, then determine bare tractor weight necessary to safely accomplish your applications.

The fundamental importance of TRACTOR WEIGHT eludes many tractor shoppers. Heavier tractor weight is more important for most tractor applications than increased tractor horsepower. Bare tractor weight is a tractor specification easily found in sales brochures and web sites, readily comparable across tractor brands and tractor models, new and used.

Within subcompact and compact tractor categories, a significant tractor capability increase requires a bare tractor weight increase of 50%. It takes a 100% increase in bare tractor weight to elicit MY-OH-MY!

Shop your weight range within tractor brands. Budget will eliminate some choices. Collect a dealer brochure for each tractor model in your weight range. I spreadsheet tractor and implement specs, often a revealing exercise. I have a column for cost per pound.

Most tractors under 3,000 pounds bare weight operate in residential or hobby farm applications on one to ten flat acres.

Selling a used tractor is easy. Selling multiple light implements in order to buy heavier, wider implements for a new, heavier tractor requires a lot of time. Depreciation on implements is generally greater than depreciation on a tractor.


I recommend a tractor of 2,500 pounds to 3,000 pounds bare tractor weight with 25-horsepower and a three-range (3) HST transmission.
Tractors with less than 25.5 horsepower are not required to have expensive Tier IV emission controls.
Every tractor manufacturer has a model in this category. Kubota's entry is the L2501.

Most of your tractor applications are ground engagement tasks. The BX is too light for your applications. A 'B' might suffice but a heavier 'L' will be safer for a beginning operator and more robust.

 

[BRMyers]

Thanks for the warm welcome! I hadn't been considering a cab, mostly because of the extreme cost versus actually being able to 'do more things'. It might depend on the extend of the wintertime duties, which would probably be limited to any snow management and animal chores. So it feels like they wouldn't extend for hours at a time.

Here are a few pictures of what I have been able to accomplish with my tractor. Understand I'm a new tractor owner also, purchased mine in May of this year.

 

[jeff9366]

My fiance and I are first-time property owners on 5 acres outside of Bellingham, WA. The property was neglected for a couple seasons, so there is a fair amount of remedial landscaping to do. Here's what we're up against:

• 
  The 5 acres is mostly rough field / pasture which needs to be bush hogged, except for a smallish front lawn (about 1/6) acre which needs mowing.
  [*] We have a large section of blackberries to cut back / work on eradicating - probably 200' by 100'.
  Ratchet Rake bucket attachment for tear down, then 60" Bush Hog to cut residual Himalayan Blackberries to ground level and mulch detritus. Bush Hog when weather will remain dry and sunny for 96 hours, so blackberry mulch drys completely and dies.
  DIRECT SALES: Ratchet Rake, LLC - All Terrain Rake, Snow Edge, Bucket attachment, Loader, Landscape rake, Brush remover, York Rake, Harley Rake, Rock Rake, Tractor rake attachment, Fire prevention,
  
  Crossbow, Rural King Crossroad or Gordon's Brush Killer, all with root killing triclopyr, to be applied to sprouts.
  
  Or fence the sheep so 1/3 of mown blackberries are within the fence. Move fence periodically so sheep browse all Blackberry sprouts over a year.
  
  
  
• There are several incomplete french drain projects around outbuildings - these were left open, with pipe in place but no gravel. They need completed digging, then backfill with gravel.
  How many feet? Dig with a spade. Fill with tractor Front End Loader. (FEL)
  You can easily lift out pipes with chain between the pipe and FEL.
  
  [*] The digging done on the french drain left large piles of earth between buildings, where we'd like it to be flat and perhaps graveled for easy car access.
  [*] We have about 300 feet of gravel driveway in fairly rough repair that should be regraded.
  [*] The property is fairly flat, but contains a lot of lumps and rises.
  Ratchet Rake bucket attachment and backdrag with FEL bucket.
  
  
• The area is known to get significant snow at times, and I am wondering in general how to best handle clearing the driveway and walkways between outbuildings (and potentially the barn)
  Tractor plow or tractor push/snow box on Loader.
  VIDEOS (2): tractor snow push box - YouTube
  tractor snow plow - YouTube
  
  
• In the next year we are hoping to add a herd of around 8 sheep, so will be wanting to bring them hay, and move their fences around periodically.
  Tractor FEL bucket.
  
  
• There are occasional stumps to pull (at least one dead tree we need to deal with sooner rather than later) and we would like to plant additional trees.

Removing stumps larger than 2" to 2-1/2" is not compact tractor work. Stumps <2-1/2" that have been killed with herbicide can be pulled out of the ground using chains to a cross-drawbar with 'hanging tree' on the Three Point Hitch.
MORE: https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums...actor-three-point-hitch-cross.html?highlight=

Bellingham soil is pretty soft in my limited experience. (I have a brother in Bellingham.)
If you are prudent a Bucket Spade bucket attachment is excellent for tree planting.
MORE: https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/328798-bucket-spade-today-fel-bucket.html?highlight=

To me, when I look at this list, it seems like we need a tractor. YES

So I've been looking at Kubota BX and B series machines with loaders and backhoe. Am I barking up the right tree here? How useful would the backhoe be on an ongoing basis? (I've heard that they are small enough to be not so useful.)
Forget the $7,000 Backhoe. Put $7,000 toward greater tractor weight.

Questions:

I get the sense a tractor is a good 'generalist' tool but not really the best at any of these things, especially clearing snow.
Clearing snow is a common tractor application in the north.

- What sizes and brands should I be looking at? We have good Kubota and John Deere dealers near by, nothing else is super close.
I recommend a tractor of 2,500 pounds to 3,000 pounds bare tractor weight with 25-horsepower and a three-range (3) HST transmission.

Kubota has 50% market share in compact tractors in USA.
Deere has 20% market share in compact tractors in USA.

I am super turned off by some of the Deere 'held hostage by the software' reports that I've read, but am unclear how relevant they are at this SCUT / CUT scale. Not relevant to Deere compact tractors.

- If we bought a new machine today, what kind of service life could we expect from it if we maintain it properly and house it under cover?
Garage your new tractor. Run a small de-humidifier in the garage set to operate at 55% humidity.
Rodents are a hazard to tractor wiring.

According to industry surveys, compact tractors are used an average of sixty engine hours per year in residential applications. A well maintained compact tractor drivetrain should be reliable through 8,000 engine hours. As a new operator you will bend various tractor parts, with FEL most vulnerable, but the drivetrain should be faultless. You will be less likely to bend a heavier tractor made from thicker steel.

MORE: tractor for five acres site:tractorbynet.com - Google Search

 

[fried1765]

My fiance and I are first-time property owners on 5 acres outside of Bellingham, WA. The property was neglected for a couple seasons, so there is a fair amount of remedial landscaping to do. Here's what we're up against:

• 
  [*] The 5 acres is mostly rough field / pasture which needs to be bush hogged, except for a smallish front lawn (about 1/6) acre which needs mowing.
  [*] We have a large section of blackberries to cut back / work on eradicating - probably 200' by 100'.
  Five foot Bush Hog plus Ratchet Rake bucket attachment to cut to ground level.
  Crossbow, Rural King Crossroad or Gordon's Brush Killer, all with root killing triclopyr, to be applied to sprouts.
  
  
• There are several incomplete french drain projects around outbuildings - these were left open, with pipe in place but no gravel. They need completed digging, then backfill with gravel.
  How many feet? Dig with a shovel. Fill with tractor Front End Loader. (FEL) You can easily lift out pipes with chain between the pipe and FEL.
  
  [*] The digging done on the french drain left large piles of earth between buildings, where we'd like it to be flat and perhaps graveled for easy car access.
  [*] We have about 300 feet of gravel driveway in fairly rough repair that should be regraded.
  [*] The property is fairly flat, but contains a lot of lumps and rises.
  Ratchet Rake bucket attachment and backdrag with FEL bucket.
  
  
• The area is known to get significant snow at times, and I am wondering in general how to best handle clearing the driveway and walkways between outbuildings (and potentially the barn)
  Tractor plow or tractor push/snow box on Loader.
  
  
• In the next year we are hoping to add a herd of around 8 sheep, so will be wanting to bring them hay, and move their fences around periodically.
  Tractor FEL bucket.
  
  
• There are occasional stumps to pull (at least one dead tree we need to deal with sooner rather than later) and we would like to plant additional trees.

Removing stumps larger than 2" to 2-1/2" is not compact tractor work. Stumps <2-1/2" that have been killed with herbicide can be pulled out of the ground using chains to a cross-drawbar with 'hanging tree' on the Three Point Hitch. Bellingham soil is pretty soft in my limited experience.
If you are prudent a Bucket Spade bucket attachment is excellent for tree planting.

To me, when I look at this list, it seems like we need a tractor. YES

So I've been looking at Kubota BX and B series machines with loaders and backhoe. Am I barking up the right tree here? How useful would the backhoe be on an ongoing basis? (I've heard that they are small enough to be not so useful.)
Forget the $7,000 Backhoe. Put $7,000 toward greater tractor weight.

Questions:

- For the tasks listed, does a tractor cover all my bases? Is it overkill? I get the sense that it's a good 'generalist' tool but not really the best at any of these things (especially clearing snow, perhaps.)

- What sizes and brands should I be looking at? We have good Kubota and John Deere dealers near by, nothing else is super close. I am super turned off by some of the Deere 'held hostage by the software' reports that I've read, but am unclear how relevant they are at this SCUT / CUT scale. Not relevant to Deere compact tractors.

- If we bought a new machine today, what kind of service life could we expect from it if we maintain it properly and house it under cover?

According to industry surveys, compact tractors are used an average of eighty engine hours per year in residential applications. A well maintained compact tractor drivetrain should be reliable through at least 8,000 engine hours. As a new operator you will bend various parts but the drivetrain should be faultless.

[/QUOTE]

I ALMOST agree with ..... "forget the $7000 backhoe".
ALMOST!
I have owned a 10' intermediate size TLB (Ford) for the past 33 years.
Just sold it, to (upgrade) buy a very lightly used 13 year old, intermediate size TLB (Kubota 48HP-- 11' hoe reach).
I am nearly 79 years old! I NEVER intend to be without a REAL TLB!
The 6',7',8' little hoes, would likely not be adequate for your anticipated use.

I don't use it much.......but whenever I want mine, it is here.
Rental has never been an option for me, as there are no TLB rentals within 75 miles.

 

[MossRoad]

Skip a backhoe. Identify your backhoe-type projects, get enough to justify a weekend rental of a small, tracked excavator once or twice a year. They can be rented around here for about $300 per weekend. For most homeowners, especially budget conscious individuals, owning a backhoe is a waste of money. Thousands of dollars for very little use. A small tracked excavator will do a lot more work in a lot less time than an even smaller backhoe. Use the savings to purchase other useful attachments for a tractor.