Power Trac Real World Loader Lift Capacity

[tommott77]

Hi all,

I've been bouncing around the idea of a Power Trac purchase for a bit and have posted here a couple times with some questions. I had somewhat given up on them due to 1430 being unavailable amid a switchover to gas power. I just looked and contacted them and the 2430s are still available with diesel power though, so I'm planning a 2nd visit up to Tazewell to check them out.

After initially giving up on the 1430 I started doing research on the Giants, Avants, Casts, etc which are obviously fairly similar platforms (especially compared to 2430). What I did notice was the lift capacity on those similar platforms was rated by tipping load as opposed to a nominal weight lifted off the ground. Watching videos on some of them it's obvious that the loader hydraulics can far outwork the weight of the machine.

I've never worked or pushed a Power Trac hard so I'm curious if the weight rating listed on these machines is more along the lines of the tipping load or how much weight the hydraulics can get off the ground? There's obviously more to it but as far as the 2430 is concerned it appears to be running actually stronger hydraulics some of those brands in the same size range.

 

[m5040]

IMO it is the tipping load with the machine articulated which shortens the effective length of the machine and brings the counterweight (engine) closer to the load. The big advantage of the 14XX series is they can work on side slopes, the other machines need relatively flat ground.

 

[tommott77]

That makes sense and follows what I've seen speced out on the other loaders. I guess my next question based off that, is if the hydraulics aren't the limiting factoring in lift capacity what comes next after tipping load? Front wheels/cylinders, center union joint, or will you be running out hydraulics before you can damage either one?

Curious as to what if anything makes the 1430 superior versus the 2430 when it comes to working from the slope aside from the higher center of gravity with the different seating position and the increase lift height of the 2430? Am I correct in assuming the 2430 would still be superior to CUT or SCUT when it comes to working on slopes?

 

[MossRoad]

I'm guessing it's tipping load. The hydraulics are stronger than the unit weighs, if that makes sense?

 

[Goose1776]

After just looking at them yesterday. Lol
By looking at the 2430 vs a traditional compact tractor, I do believe it would handle SOME slope situations better.
It still sits lower to the ground, and will have a lower center of gravity, than a tractor with a loader on it. And is much more maneuverable
BUT, as I recently learned here, and confirmed by Terry at PT, the mowers are not recommended for use with the 2430, due to oil cooling capacity. So that ruled them out, for my use.
Honestly, after looking at them in person. I can see why the 425 outsells all the other models combined. I was certain I wanted a 1430, but after operating the 425.
Now I am not sure.
It’s definitely more difficult of a decision than just choosing between deere, Kubota, massey.. etc.
I am sure that is clear as mud for you. lol

 

[Interloper]

I am in a similar situation as tommott. I had been looking at PTs for many years and I finally decided to get a 1430. Then when I go to pull the trigger I found out it's not available. PT sales indicates they hope to have the new gasser version available before summer's end. Concerning the topic of this thread, do we have anything to worry about the gas engine relative to the hydraulic/lift performance? I assume that since the pumps don't change, as long as the horsepower is there the pumps should perform the same?

 

[MossRoad]

50hp is 50hp. Doesn't matter if it's gas or diesel. HP is HP.

With that said, when mowing, for example, which is one of the highest demanding jobs, if you run into some really thick grass and stay in it, will the diesel be able to hold it in the torque curve longer? Probably.

 

[ponytug]

My $0.02...

Yes diesels are more fuel efficient on a HP/gal basis, and they also gain from being able to do many functions at lower throttle due to higher torque.

Many (most?) air cooled gasoline engines are designed for use at WOT for optimal cooling. You don't always do the engine a favor by throttle down.

• Would I take a 1430 diesel over a 1430 gasoline version? Yes.
• Would I choose a gasoline 1430 over a 425? Sure, if I needed the HP/lift/height.
• Would I choose a 1445 diesel over a gasoline 1430? Sure, if I could use the added capacities.
• Would I choose a Deutz engine over a gasoline engine? Every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
• Would I choose a Deutz over almost every other diesel? Probably, due to my personal long experience with the reliability and endurance of Deutz engines. Don't get me wrong, I think there are plenty of other reliable diesels out there: Yanmar, Kubota, etc., I just don't happen to have a ton of experience with them.

Personally, I think very few of us are going to wear out an engine (as opposed to having it fail at an early age), and I think that HP/fuel issue can be over stated, especially when diesel costs more than gasoline.

One area where I do have a strong opinion:

If you plan on using the tractor in highly flammable conditions, I would strongly, strongly favor the Deutz engine where no part of the engine gets particularly warm, but that is about the only area where I think the practical differences are large. (Free advice, and definitely my $0.02)​

​

So...bottom line: I think that you would get an amazing tractor from Power-Trac no matter whether it was diesel versus gasoline.

All the best,

Peter

 

[marrt]

Anyone know what gas engine they are putting in the 1430? I currently own Kohler, Subaru and Generac engines. I vastly prefer the Kohler engine...at least the older Kohler horizontal engines used in the 425. I have one of these engines on an Exmark mower. Those engines can go up to 4000 hours with proper maintenance and a large Donaldson air filter. The air filter makes a BIG difference and there’s room for it in the 1430. When I owned the old Moss Road style 425, I added an EngineAire precleaner (made for the Kohler) and it made a huge difference in keeping the air filter clean. The mower and tires throw up a lot of dust that the engine fan and hydraulic fan sucks into the engine compartment.

A gas 30 HP high RPM engine will not have near the torque of the Deutz. And in a hydraulic machine, torque makes a big difference in performance. Maybe PT will oversize the engine to get the same performance. A 40 HP fuel injected gas engine in a 1430 footprint would be awesome.

Some newer members may not realize the 1430, 1845 (and maybe 1850) all share the same “front end.” The rear is longer depending on the engine/model. I have an 1845 and there’s a lot more room in the operators station compared to the 425. In addition, you can add a proper suspension seat on this platform. Just something to think about.

 

[tommott77]

I agree with most all the sentiments made in the gas vs diesel debate but the main thing for me that hasn’t been brought up is short term reliability. Sometimes I’ll spend two full days driving to/from my property for one day of work with my tractor. If I have to spend any time on bad gas, gummed up carb, etc that could literally ruin an entire week for me.

Back to the lift capacity question. If the lift capacity is based off of tipping load and the hydraulics can outwork size of the tractor itself how much do you have to pay any special attention to not overworking the front wheels/motors, center pivot joint, etc? Are they going to be a limiting factor in loader lift capacity?

Also is there anything aside from the sitting position and lift height that would make a 2430 less proficient on slopes compared to the 1430? Everything else looks to fairly similar between the two tractors. I did notice that somehow the website had the weight of 2430 over 1000lbs heavier than the 1430. I’m assuming perhaps that’s with the backhoe attached? If not I would assume that the 2430 would be just as capable on slopes as the 1430 if all that extra weight is low enough. If the 2430 is that much heavier and the lifting capacity is limited by tipping load I would assume it would significantly outlift a 1430 as well, even given the that the 1430 may have the better loader geometry for max lifting given its lower lift height.