Fighting 'Solar Farm' Installation

[walhondingMF]

I like saving money.

I like alternate routes, too, in case there is a problem one way, another way would be viable.

I like alternative energy options...

 

[KilroyJC]

It was not domestic oil. It is Canadian oil from tar sands pits. IIRC it was already sold to China. The only American involvement was to transport and refine the oil. Meanwhile, forcing a pipeline through the lands of people that didn't want it.

Well, any comments I want to make about what in Canada has been sold to China would get me put in TBN Timeout, as would comments about how many did/didn’t want it and why.

 

[walhondingMF]

Either way, the oil and the XL pipeline were not going to make American more energy dependent or bring gas prices down. It was simply going to make the pipeline company and the refinery more money.
It was going to run through private property that did not want it.

 

[wawajake]

Either way, the oil and the XL pipeline were not going to make American more energy dependent or bring gas prices down. It was simply going to make the pipeline company and the refinery more money.
It was going to run through private property that did not want it.

It would of decreased USA need to import oil from South American countries where irresponsible means are used.......whereas Canada is a much cleaner responsible provider and is a neighbor and friend that billions of dollars of trade are consistently counted on between both our countries.

 

[KilroyJC]

Either way, the oil and the XL pipeline were not going to make American more energy dependent or bring gas prices down. It was simply going to make the pipeline company and the refinery more money.
It was going to run through private property that did not want it.

*independent*

America is definitely more energy dependent than it was two+ years ago, and the cancellation of the pipeline is only one small piece of a large pie of anti-domestic energy policies that also have not brought energy prices down.

 

[MossRoad]

It would of decreased USA need to import oil from South American countries where irresponsible means are used.......whereas Canada is a much cleaner responsible provider and is a neighbor and friend that billions of dollars of trade are consistently counted on between both our countries.

Nope. It was going from Canadian oil sands to refineries on the gulf coast and exported on the open market.

 

[KilroyJC]

Nope. It was going from Canadian oil sands to refineries on the gulf coast and exported on the open market.

Increasing the amount of product on a Market reduces prices.

 

[bvanek]

Either way, the oil and the XL pipeline were not going to make American more energy dependent or bring gas prices down. It was simply going to make the pipeline company and the refinery more money.

Logistic costs get passed on to the consumer.....More regional supply = lower costs......everything we do here to promote domestic logistics reduces costs.

Here's what we know as outsiders; The deal that was made with oil companies (the America first administration) by modifying some ridiculous environmental regulations and also eliminating the anchors of the bureaucratic process all designed to keep domestic pricing down. Profitability was up front with plenty of domestic oil and gas. Filling up our reserve at lower prices then selling the excess oil at OPEC prices. LNG to Europe......Just exactly what an American business should do when they partner with it's people, invest in their own natural resources and let the trickle down economics float everyone's boat, big and small. Everyone wins....except China OPEC and the green new deal.

add; TC looked at the pipeline as an investment so possibly the future may have included a sale (of the US portion of the existing structure and imminent domain property) hopefully to US oil and gas companies or refineries? Canada was already headlong into green,...so a plan "B" was likely on the table. They have already stated this, so I didn't make this up. The new trade agreement for North America gave the US a more even playing field......and there were oil and gas fields already producing in the north central US................ 2 1/2 years ago The future looked bright for cheap US energy and a thriving economy.....what do you suppose happened?

 

[Hay Dude]

And you anti-Keystone guys think that pipeline meant nothing to American jobs building it? I don’t care if sand was going through it, great paying American jobs to build and maintain it were lost forever. How dose anyone KNOW we wouldn’t use any of the oil that flowed through there??? How do we know the building of it wouldn’t create new use of the oils that flow through it? Maybe the pipeline would have attracted a new oil refining business?

Stop with the BS that America would derive ”no benefit”. We would have gotten numerous benefits and possibly more.

 

[wawajake]

Nope. It was going from Canadian oil sands to refineries on the gulf coast and exported on the open market.

Depends .....Under the right President the USA would of figured out the need to be as much energy independent as possible, ( countries like Germany found out the hard way) having pipelines from always friendly countries like Canada gives the USA reliable efficient safer energy.

 

[edgarrian]

They did the research themselves.
Here: Exxon scientists predicted global warming with ‘shocking skill and accuracy,’ Harvard researchers say

Here: Exxon Knew about Climate Change almost 40 years ago

Even here: ExxonMobil climate change denial - Wikipedia

Then there is all the IPCC work...much which I have read btw. Reports — IPCC

The post was about using land for a solar project and I was just pointing out it doesn't have a negative impact on property values in the long term. Better yet the ground could still be used for farming if done correctly.

You are wrong about negative property values. 15000 acres of solar fields and a house in the middle of them. Will in fact sell less. What you don't know is that when a field is turned into a solar field. The company that installs the panels is punching through all the field tile thats used for collecting water to route away from roads and other property owners. What happens is the company thats installing is punching holes into the tile. Thus making tile useless. Water then sheds onto roads and other property causing areas to flood. There are several lawsuits ongoing for this very reason. When you have this much water not draining away it infact will negatively affect property values.

What do you suppose researchers have found that work for wind turbine companies? Do you think they are hiding anything about effecting the jet stream? OR the killing of whales. Guaranteed they know about things as well thats negative but they won't release it. As for myself and this crazy green energy and CO2 elimination. The US has had over a decade of falling CO2 levels. Yet we still see hurriancans, flooding, and so on. You know every time there is a volcanic eruption. That should send us over the edge since we are so close. Problematically it does not. This has been a fun boondoggle to watch

 

[KilroyJC]

I like alternative energy options...

I have solar panels, a wood stove, a charcoal grill, a diesel tractor, and a gas car.

 

[MossRoad]

Increasing the amount of product on a Market reduces prices.

None of it would have done anything for the average person in the US.

 

[Hay Dude]

None of it would have done anything for the average person in the US.

Wrong. It would help the workers who would have built and maintained the pipeline
jobs HELPS the US.

 

[bnold]

The answer to that depends on what energy sources are replacing it. If it’s wind or solar, those types require a lot of precious metals mining, batteries, etc. Much of which is foreign made.

Look it, we have reduced our carbon emmissions a great deal in the last 40 years. We can’t be overly fanatical and eliminate it all and cause more casualties than we save.

I’ve never claimed eliminate was an option.
Reductions in local pollution would be a great benefit for folks like me living in coal/lignite/NG burning country. Wish we had more nuk plants here.

Pretty amazing, way out in the country and the air quality here isn’t great due to the ‘clean fossil fuel’ plants we have here in Tx.

Selfishly, I would choose a ratted out mining diesel machine in some foreign mine over air pollution here in the sticks. Never claimed to have a desire to save the world from itself. I don’t have an opinion on the climate change debate. I do have an opinion on localized pollution.

 

[Hay Dude]

I’ve never claimed eliminate was an option.
Reductions in local pollution would be a great benefit for folks like me living in coal/lignite/NG burning country. Wish we had more nuk plants here.

Pretty amazing, way out in the country and the air quality here isn’t great due to the ‘clean fossil fuel’ plants we have here in Tx.

Selfishly, I would choose a ratted out mining diesel machine in some foreign mine over air pollution here in the sticks. Never claimed to have a desire to save the world from itself. I don’t have an opinion on the climate change debate. I do have an opinion on localized pollution.

what statistics or publications are showing you to have bad air quality?

 

[bnold]

Wrong. It would help the workers who would have built and maintained the pipeline
jobs HELPS the US.

How many more import workers do I need to send north to work on your oil straw?

Gates are open!

 

[bnold]

I like alternative energy options...

Same here.

Solar, Utility and Diesel Backup for the house/shop

Utility is served from solar, wind, hydro, battery storage, NG, Coal and Lignite, and Nuclear here.

Luckily our Coal and Lignite usage is reducing fast.

At peak today ERCOT was 49% solar/wind, 33% NG, 11% Coal and Lignite and 7% Nuclear.

At min load today 48% wind, 29% NG, 12% Coal and Lignite and 11% Nuclear.

 

[Hay Dude]

How many more import workers do I need to send north to work on your oil straw?

Gates are open!

Huh?
I have no such workers and have never hired an illegal worker

 

[Grumpycat]

I think this is why we want to reduce emissions. As I have said, if we threw garbage on our front lawns all our lives, eventually the yard gets full.

This is not just Beijing, we saw the same kind of thing in Cairo, Bangkok, Mumbai. and even back in the 80's in LA.
I remember we worked in the center of two mountain ranges east of LA back in the late 80's, my friend had been out there 3 years.
One day the Santa Ana winds came through and it was the first time he said he could see both mountain ranges.
One was 5 miles away, the other 7. Really drove the issue home for me.
View attachment 798327

I drive a Tesla which many think I would automatically agree with the above. The problem is existing ICE automobiles are 100 to 1000 times cleaner than those of the 1960s. The problem cited above no longer exists.

The problem that exists today is that No Government Program Has Ever Been Terminated.

I have long advocated for The Almighty Dollar to be the unit of metric for resource consumption. We have government bureaucrats making up fantasy accounting to prove anything they want. Can not do that with The Dollar because in each stage of production to market every man insists on being paid fair compensation for labor and resources. Government decides CO2 is the boogeyman, declares ethanol will reduce CO2 because the CO2 emitted by burning ethanol as a motor fuel was extracted from the atmosphere by corn. In the process they ignore the emissions from creating fertilizer from natural gas, from diesel in tractors and trucks used to harvest corn, diesel in trucks and trains to transport ethanol to market. Not to mention the consumption of resources to produce ethanol.