Hello, recently my hydraulic lift was slow to respond, I finally got it to lift and encountered a loud knocking and rattling in the pump area. I pulled the pump and found play on the gear and wobble shaft. Replaced the gear, bolted the pump back on and encountered the same knocking noise under load. Removed the pump and ran the tractor, no noise, but I noticed metallic oil coming out of the camshaft gear area, I dropped the pan and found metal all in the oil. Ended up splitting the tractor and pulling the engine. Removed the cam and found no issues anywhere. Reassembled the tractor and replaced the pump with a spare, im encountering the exact same issue as before and it looks as if there is more metal, I haven't drained the new oil to confirm though. I'm at a loss.
1955 Ford 640 hydraulic issue knocking
TractorTech
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I’ve read your description several times. When you swapped with a spare pump, you unbolted the whole assembly at the engine and replace with another, pump and drive?
And, you encountered play on the gear and wobble shaft on the original pump. Did you find a problem with the bearings? Why was there play?
And, you encountered play on the gear and wobble shaft on the original pump. Did you find a problem with the bearings? Why was there play?
MTGreen
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Also what about the gear/bearings/idler that the pump gear interfaces with?
John0829
Veteran Member
I know you said you pulled the cam out of the engine and it all looked OK. My thoughts are that the cam is still the problem, did you check the thrust plate to be sure the cam is not moving back and forth? Did you see any wear marks in the area of the cam gear that drives the pump? This would account for there being metal in the engine oil, in fact it is the only thing that can account for it in that area that I can think of.
Play in pump gear/shaft was due to old gear wearing out, replaced with a new gear.
What's the thrust plate? There was movement back and forth on the cam. once I re installed and tightend down the play was gone. The cam gear teeth seemed sharp on the edges. I recently read in a shop manual that the pump gear and cam gear backlash is set by the gasket and to double stack gaskets if needed or cut a metal shim. But I haven't tried that yet. Also dont see that being the issue since it randomly started doing this one day. But im at a complete loss
John0829
Veteran Member
Page from shop manual about thrust plate...
If it is the gear area making the noise you should see some indication of where it is rubbing the block. Since the metal is in the engine oil and the gear on the cam is the only drive connection between the hydraulic pump and engine I feel that is the place to find the problem. Also adding to my idea/thoughts is the fact you used a different pump and yet the noise was still happening.
Also I am focusing mainly on the metal in the engine oil but aside from that is it possible that you have a bad o-ring that is allowing the pump to suck air? Or worst case, ( I had this problem on my 850 ) a leaking line in the bottom of the transmission case. Moisture in the transmission oil (apparently the previous owner thought milky oil was OK) had rusted through the steel lines in the bottom of the case. Either of these could account for a slow lift and air in the system can cause noise.
If it is the gear area making the noise you should see some indication of where it is rubbing the block. Since the metal is in the engine oil and the gear on the cam is the only drive connection between the hydraulic pump and engine I feel that is the place to find the problem. Also adding to my idea/thoughts is the fact you used a different pump and yet the noise was still happening.
Also I am focusing mainly on the metal in the engine oil but aside from that is it possible that you have a bad o-ring that is allowing the pump to suck air? Or worst case, ( I had this problem on my 850 ) a leaking line in the bottom of the transmission case. Moisture in the transmission oil (apparently the previous owner thought milky oil was OK) had rusted through the steel lines in the bottom of the case. Either of these could account for a slow lift and air in the system can cause noise.
I was thinking I would find indication of wear on the block from the cam gear aswell, I did not see any sign of rubbing, only that the teeth seems to be sharp.
John0829
Veteran Member
You have me stumped, when you find out what it is I want to know what you found.
Well, I finally got around to playing with it again, I stacked 2 gaskets for the block/pump mount and it's ALOT better. Slight knocking noise but nowhere near what it was. So I'm assuming it is a backlash issue. My only problem now is I have to bleed the pump everytime I start the tractor and want to use the 3pt.
