3 Point Lift problem...still

Soundguy · May 23, 2006

( I am a complete novice tractor mechanic trying to figure this thing out. Am probably going to try a hydraulic pump next. May not help, but working on the tail end has not yielded much results.
)

Good idea..(not) .. hey.. you don't work for IBM do you? Standard diagnostic procedure.. start at one end of the machine and begin replacing all components of the machine till it runs.

As others have indicated.. if you have good hyds elsewhere ont he tractor.. shotgun parts replacement won't get you anywhere.. ( but sure does help the parts dealers here! ).

Lets do a bit more diagnostic work and get the correct part pinned down for you, then you can replace only the parts you need to...

Soundguy

Soundguy · May 23, 2006

( I am a complete novice tractor mechanic trying to figure this thing out. Am probably going to try a hydraulic pump next. May not help, but working on the tail end has not yielded much results.
)

Good idea..(not) .. hey.. you don't work for IBM do you? Standard diagnostic procedure.. start at one end of the machine and begin replacing all components of the machine till it runs.

As others have indicated.. if you have good hyds elsewhere ont he tractor.. shotgun parts replacement won't get you anywhere.. ( but sure does help the parts dealers here! ).

Lets do a bit more diagnostic work and get the correct part pinned down for you, then you can replace only the parts you need to...

Soundguy

John47 · May 23, 2006

If logic fails, look for something "stupid". Many years back a Joy Manufacturing mechanic was telling me he got called to a machine with an intermittant hydraulic problem that mystified the clients mechanics and mechanical engineer. He eventually "cracked" the problem, turned out to be a glass milk bottle that rolled around inside the main hydraulic oil tank. It got caught up against the suction lines! How the bottle got in there, was anybodies guess, but must have been placed in during manufacture.

Have you tried opening the Implement Drop Speed Valve and reclosing it??? Thats that round knob just below the seat and between your legs when in the seat. It adjusts the implement drop and rise speed.
Just a thought!

John47 · May 23, 2006

If logic fails, look for something "stupid". Many years back a Joy Manufacturing mechanic was telling me he got called to a machine with an intermittant hydraulic problem that mystified the clients mechanics and mechanical engineer. He eventually "cracked" the problem, turned out to be a glass milk bottle that rolled around inside the main hydraulic oil tank. It got caught up against the suction lines! How the bottle got in there, was anybodies guess, but must have been placed in during manufacture.

Have you tried opening the Implement Drop Speed Valve and reclosing it??? Thats that round knob just below the seat and between your legs when in the seat. It adjusts the implement drop and rise speed.
Just a thought!

HGM · May 23, 2006

( Have you tried opening the Implement Drop Speed Valve and reclosing it??? Thats that round knob just below the seat and between your legs when in the seat. It adjusts the implement drop and rise speed.
Just a thought! )

Good idea, I'm new to this too, but the round knob is the implement lock(keeps the 3pt up.. If you turn it in, it will actually block the lift from going down(on my 2000 anyhow).. The little lever on the L/H side of the 3pt(if I remember correctly) that looks like a rod with a roll pin sticking out is the speed lever.. This could very well cause the problem, I agree with checking how it effects the lift performance.. That could have easily been moved and change only the 3pt operation..

HGM · May 23, 2006

( Have you tried opening the Implement Drop Speed Valve and reclosing it??? Thats that round knob just below the seat and between your legs when in the seat. It adjusts the implement drop and rise speed.
Just a thought! )

Good idea, I'm new to this too, but the round knob is the implement lock(keeps the 3pt up.. If you turn it in, it will actually block the lift from going down(on my 2000 anyhow).. The little lever on the L/H side of the 3pt(if I remember correctly) that looks like a rod with a roll pin sticking out is the speed lever.. This could very well cause the problem, I agree with checking how it effects the lift performance.. That could have easily been moved and change only the 3pt operation..

normde2001 · May 23, 2006

( Could a bad valve on the FEL cause this? The high pressure line runs to it before going to the 3 point. How would I check? Is there some way to bypass the FEL? )

That's a possibility, you can always bypass the FEL with a little plumbing work.

normde2001 · May 23, 2006

( Could a bad valve on the FEL cause this? The high pressure line runs to it before going to the 3 point. How would I check? Is there some way to bypass the FEL? )

That's a possibility, you can always bypass the FEL with a little plumbing work.

John47 · May 23, 2006

( ( Have you tried opening the Implement Drop Speed Valve and reclosing it??? Thats that round knob just below the seat and between your legs when in the seat. It adjusts the implement drop and rise speed.
Just a thought! )

Good idea, I'm new to this too, but the round knob is the implement lock(keeps the 3pt up.. If you turn it in, it will actually block the lift from going down(on my 2000 anyhow).. The little lever on the L/H side of the 3pt(if I remember correctly) that looks like a rod with a roll pin sticking out is the speed lever.. This could very well cause the problem, I agree with checking how it effects the lift performance.. That could have easily been moved and change only the 3pt operation.. )

It also affects the speed at which the impliments raises and lowers!!

Open it as wide as it will go, ie total anti-clockwise, then close it, with the engine running, might be something within the valve causing the problem. Set it to lower the impliment at a steady rate afterwards though!

Nothing to lose!

John47 · May 23, 2006

( ( Have you tried opening the Implement Drop Speed Valve and reclosing it??? Thats that round knob just below the seat and between your legs when in the seat. It adjusts the implement drop and rise speed.
Just a thought! )

Good idea, I'm new to this too, but the round knob is the implement lock(keeps the 3pt up.. If you turn it in, it will actually block the lift from going down(on my 2000 anyhow).. The little lever on the L/H side of the 3pt(if I remember correctly) that looks like a rod with a roll pin sticking out is the speed lever.. This could very well cause the problem, I agree with checking how it effects the lift performance.. That could have easily been moved and change only the 3pt operation.. )

It also affects the speed at which the impliments raises and lowers!!

Open it as wide as it will go, ie total anti-clockwise, then close it, with the engine running, might be something within the valve causing the problem. Set it to lower the impliment at a steady rate afterwards though!

Nothing to lose!

grafpatrick · May 23, 2006

Thanks for the suggestions, but I have fooled with those little knobs a lot, in, out, halfway, various combos, given 'em a few raps to loosen up any stuck whatevers... no luck.
John

grafpatrick · May 23, 2006

Thanks for the suggestions, but I have fooled with those little knobs a lot, in, out, halfway, various combos, given 'em a few raps to loosen up any stuck whatevers... no luck.
John

gatractorman · May 23, 2006

It's been my experience when anything works with cold oil and performance drops with warm oil, I highly suspect the pump.
However I would do a pressure test on the system if possible, or if not possible get yourself a bucket of dirt (or whatever) in the FEL , zero a stopwatch then with the tractor at idle, start the clock at the instant you fully pull the lever to raise the bucket, stop when the bucket is fully raised compare times with cold and warm oil and see if there's quite a difference.
Relief valves generally work or they dont, I've never saw one that was affected by the temperature of the oil, but they can get a piece of trash or something in the works that wont allow them to function properly or they could lose the o-rings on them, but both these scenarios cause low psi across the board.

gatractorman · May 23, 2006

It's been my experience when anything works with cold oil and performance drops with warm oil, I highly suspect the pump.
However I would do a pressure test on the system if possible, or if not possible get yourself a bucket of dirt (or whatever) in the FEL , zero a stopwatch then with the tractor at idle, start the clock at the instant you fully pull the lever to raise the bucket, stop when the bucket is fully raised compare times with cold and warm oil and see if there's quite a difference.
Relief valves generally work or they dont, I've never saw one that was affected by the temperature of the oil, but they can get a piece of trash or something in the works that wont allow them to function properly or they could lose the o-rings on them, but both these scenarios cause low psi across the board.

grafpatrick · May 23, 2006

How do I do a pressure test? Anyone know what the accepted standards are on this unit?

grafpatrick · May 23, 2006

How do I do a pressure test? Anyone know what the accepted standards are on this unit?

normde2001 · May 23, 2006

"
It also affects the speed at which the impliments raises and lowers!!"

That may be true, but you stand a good chance of shearing the drive key in the hydraulic pump using it that way. It should be either fully open to operate, or fully closed to lock the 3ph in the up pos. for servicing.

normde2001 · May 23, 2006

"
It also affects the speed at which the impliments raises and lowers!!"

That may be true, but you stand a good chance of shearing the drive key in the hydraulic pump using it that way. It should be either fully open to operate, or fully closed to lock the 3ph in the up pos. for servicing.

gatractorman · May 24, 2006

There probably is a pressure test port on the tractor somewhere but I'm not familiar enough with a Yanmar to tell you where it is.
Basically your going to be installing a gauge in the pressure line from the pump, or a port where pump pressure is.
The things I work on (heavy equipment) pump psi runs from 2200-2500 not knowing for sure I'd be afraid to say about a Yannie, but I'd bet it would be in that neighborhood.

gatractorman · May 24, 2006

There probably is a pressure test port on the tractor somewhere but I'm not familiar enough with a Yanmar to tell you where it is.
Basically your going to be installing a gauge in the pressure line from the pump, or a port where pump pressure is.
The things I work on (heavy equipment) pump psi runs from 2200-2500 not knowing for sure I'd be afraid to say about a Yannie, but I'd bet it would be in that neighborhood.

3 Point Lift problem...still

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