(Another) Firewood processor - hydraulic questions

[CJONE]

This is all great info, thanks guys. I'm watching a ton of vids on YouTube and my design is changing (once again). I REALLY like this one and now think I'll base my design on it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmSS0SEoxXs

This design eliminates the conveyor all together and allows me to fill up my firewood bags easily. I also have a set of pallet forks (I bought them brand new) that my BIL kindly used on a skid steer rated over 5000 lbs and pulled the forks right off the frame. The frame will be a nice SSQA base and the forks are obviously perfect as loading forks.

So I have 3 options I'm thinking of.

1) Making one almost identical to what's in the video and using a PTO pump. I'm concerned the hydraulic over electric components will be cost prohibitive. I'm also thinking the hydraulic chainsaw will be a lot of work to build and get right.
2) Stick to using my saw and using the 15 hp engine to power the 2 stage pump for the splitter and my remotes for the rest.
3) Run the splitter and other hydraulics off my remotes and use my chain saw. This probably only offers around 8-10 GPM @ 2250 PSI.

I have several cylinders to use for this project so I'm thinking of eliminating the feeder system and simply making it a tilt system. After loading a log and clamping it (I would have a double clamping system) the deck would tilt, the log would roll on rollers until it hit a stop, the log would be clamped again and the saw would cut it off, repeat.

CJONE: The engine I'm thinking about is a cheap Chinese knock off gas engine. I have one on a water pump I've been using for years (only 5 hp) and one on my roto-tiller and they've both been flawless. For the limited hours I would use this per year, I think it would be fine and I could buy 4 of them for the cost of a Honda. If I use this motor and 28/7 GPM 2 stage pump, I will use a 5" cylinder. If I use a 21 GPM @ 2250 PSI PTO pump or run off the tractors hydraulics, I will use a 4" cylinder.

muddstopper: I will check the auto cycle valve and go down the the 22 GPM 2 stage pump if I go that way, thanks.

oldnslo: real life sucks, doesn't it! Ya, there's a fair amount of cheapness in my planning. I only burn about 12 face cord per year and a log truck delivers about 24 face cord per load which means I'm only cutting wood every 2 years. 24 face cord is still enough to be a PITA and make me look for easier ways to do things, but it doesn't make sense to spend $10K doing it.

Ken the reason I asked is these engines are rated all over the board. Honda is conservative and most others are optimistic. At 15HP stick to a 22 gpm 2 stage pump. As far as your conveyors they require very little HP. I just did one for a local oilfield service company with a 6 to 1 reduction on a 8 hp engine and 5 to one pully reduction. If I remember right it had around a 8" drive pully for the belt. The belt was 32" wide by 20 feet long and you could load it with dirt and it would pull it no problem. CJ

 

[kiotiken]

Well, I think I've now seen every processor design ever conceived of and have mashed them all together to design my own. I'm going to start "simple" and run it off my tractors remotes for now, I'll leave it open to upgrade later if I choose to. I bought a 4" logsplitter cylinder over a 4.5" (both were on sale) because I don't have a huge amount of flow from the remotes (10 GPM I believe). I'm hoping it will be enough for the 6 way wedge I'm planning. The processor's going to attach to my SSQA and I'll use the curl function of my FEL to rotate the entire processor to load logs. By building this as an attachment for my FEL I avoid having to worry about a deck for logs and a conveyor for the logs. I also have a set of pallet forks that have a damaged frame as a starting point. Here's my design so far, I know there are some tweaks to make and I didn't draw it 100%. There will be a guard for the saw so logs can't roll into it and possibly an operators plate form since I'll be holding the processor 4.5 feet off the ground. Anybody see any glaring issues?

 

[J_J]

Drawing looks good.

Will you be doing multiple actions at the same time.

Single man operation?

Lifting, rolling. splitting, running the chain saw, stacking etc, or will you use two or more people?

Your tractor is 9.9 GPM and don't know the pressure.

You have 39 HP at the PTO, so you could run a PTO pump.

PTO pump Max. output: 21 GPM @ 2,000 PSI & 32.1 Hp input

9.9 CU IN PRINCE HC-PTO-1AC PTO PUMP CI 540 RPM

 

[kiotiken]

Drawing looks good.

Will you be doing multiple actions at the same time.

Single man operation?

Lifting, rolling. splitting, running the chain saw, stacking etc, or will you use two or more people?

Your tractor is 9.9 GPM and don't know the pressure.

You have 39 HP at the PTO, so you could run a PTO pump.

PTO pump Max. output: 21 GPM @ 2,000 PSI & 32.1 Hp input

9.9 CU IN PRINCE HC-PTO-1AC PTO PUMP CI 540 RPM

Thanks J.J
Yes, this will be a one man show. I forgot to draw a clamping system, but it will have two clamps, one beside the saw and the other on the far side of the FEL arm. For mid size logs, I'll pick one up, clamp it and then pick a second one up and leave it on the forks until I'm ready to roll it into place. There will be multiple operations at the same time. I'm thinking of using some type of priority diverter valve to give a steady 8 GPM to the splitter and share the rest between the other functions. There will only ever be two functions operating at one time, the splitter and one of; motor for moving the log forward, the clamps or the cylinder for height of the splitter head. Non of those should require much and are intermittent. I'm going auto cycle valve (both extend and retract) for the hands free splitting.
A PTO pump is something I considered and still may do as an upgrade. Unless I decide to try and upgrade to a hydraulic chainsaw (which seems to be the biggest cost), I may simply add a cheap 15 hp with two stage pump so I don't have to run the tractor at 2500 RPM the whole time. It will all depend on how fast the splitter cycle time is and if I can run two functions at the same time. I'm not in the firewood business, so if it takes the whole weekend to do my 8 full cords instead of one day, I can live with that.

 

[Leejohn]

You said " I'm hoping it will be enough for the 6 way wedge I'm planning. " what kind of wood is going thru a 6 way wedge with a 4" cyl. I think I'm missing something.

 

[kiotiken]

You said " I'm hoping it will be enough for the 6 way wedge I'm planning. " what kind of wood is going thru a 6 way wedge with a 4" cyl. I think I'm missing something.

This year was almost 100% sugar maple but it can be any hardwood like Oak, Maple, Ash, Elm etc. I know I won't push super gnarly stuff with knots and crotch's through, but straight stuff I'm hoping will work, although any Elm might be an issue. I'm designing this with the ability to handle a 22" diameter log, but in practice, I doubt I would ever try one bigger than about 16"-18" max. The logs came 16' long this year and that's a lot of weight for my FEL, especially if you add in 1000 lbs of processor. I'm hoping my design will handle logs 7' - 16' in length.

Just to be clear and to make sure I'm not missing something, it's a 4" bore, it has a 24" stroke. I did see a number of machines with 4" rams on YouTube with 6 way wedges.

 

[J_J]

I don't see a problem with a 4 in cyl and 6 way wedge or 4 way wedge.

Push force at 2500 psi would be 31,416 lbs.
---------------3000 psi------------37,699 lbs