Question for the guys that have used BH's over a long period of time on compact tractors, I have a 3320 and the question is frame mounts vs 3 pt. I have been told that a 3 pt doesn't put any strain on the tractor when using it if you put the pads down as us as designed but have also been told that they can damage a tractor over long term use and the only way to go is with a frame mount. Given the price difference I wonder. I have some fairly light work to do, small ditches and some small stumps to dig out nothing really heavy or comercial grade. All input welcome, Love the 3320 HST so far and really pleased at what it can do. The wife stuck it up to the frame front and back and I managed to get it out without any assistance from anything except a shovel,log and the FEL so I really do not want to tear it up!!!!
Backhoe Backhoe types
- Thread starter kenwyatt
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driver444
Silver Member
I would reccomend that you stay away from 3pt backhoes. There are tons of horror stories on this site regarding this issue. Believe me, I went through this same thing in my head. Wanted to save the money. I was talked out of it when a friend of mine that works for a New Holland dealership took me out back and showed me a big old 2120 (43 horsepower) with a cracked gear case, and broken bell housing bolts. Only 2 bolts were holding this thing together. It was attributed to the 3pt backhoe.
Remember, when you connect the hoe to the 3pth, the only thing holding the hoe down when you drop the pads, rather than floating the 3pt arms up is the rigid mounted top-link. That puts an awful lot of stress on the upper part of your gear case. Basically you're lifting the whole weight of the tractor by that top-link mount. Also, your check chains, or bars (whatever you have) will be stressed whenever you swing the hoe left or right.
If this wasn't enough to talk you out of this type of hoe, there are 2 more reasons why you should go subframe.
1. There is alot of slop in a 3pt set up. That alone makes them more "jerky" than subframe types.
2. Subframe mounts are much easier to put on and take off. MUCH EASIER. Take a close look at a subframe mount on any type of tractor, and see how it connects. They are far superior, and take ALOT of abuse off the tractor.
Hope that helps
Remember, when you connect the hoe to the 3pth, the only thing holding the hoe down when you drop the pads, rather than floating the 3pt arms up is the rigid mounted top-link. That puts an awful lot of stress on the upper part of your gear case. Basically you're lifting the whole weight of the tractor by that top-link mount. Also, your check chains, or bars (whatever you have) will be stressed whenever you swing the hoe left or right.
If this wasn't enough to talk you out of this type of hoe, there are 2 more reasons why you should go subframe.
1. There is alot of slop in a 3pt set up. That alone makes them more "jerky" than subframe types.
2. Subframe mounts are much easier to put on and take off. MUCH EASIER. Take a close look at a subframe mount on any type of tractor, and see how it connects. They are far superior, and take ALOT of abuse off the tractor.
Hope that helps
jdbower
Platinum Member
I was told the same thing. Preference seems to be for a full subframe mount like the JD hoes have, then a bolt-on "4-point" subframe, and only a 3-point without subframe in an emergency. Except for an issue between my backhoe and mower's independent lift (not an issue with the 3000-series) it's a cinch to install. If you only want occasional light-duty use, I'd probably look at protecting the tractor entirely by getting something like this:
NorthStar Trencherman Backhoe — 9 HP | Backhoes | Northern Tool + Equipment
NorthStar Trencherman Backhoe — 9 HP | Backhoes | Northern Tool + Equipment
Sounds like you juys are covering some of the concerns I had floating around in my head. Harbor Freight has a small towable unit like the one Northern Freight has as well but I never have been able to hook up with anyone that has any real experence with them. I know it gives specs as to ripping force but not having any BH experence to relay on the numbers arn't meaning much to me. My main fear is having one and when you try to dig in hard ground the unit doesn't have enough weight to really dig and just scratches the service and picks itself up
Any more imput would be greatly appreacated ! May talk myself in keeping it all green Have to hid the DR string trimmer now when the tractor is out front
Any more imput would be greatly appreacated ! May talk myself in keeping it all green Have to hid the DR string trimmer now when the tractor is out frontTedLaRue
Gold Member
Yes, you should be concerned about lack of weight. A towable backhoe with "4400 lbs. of ripping force" will only have that force if the rest of the backhoe stays put. If the machine is too light and the stabilizers don't bite into the ground enough, the hoe will simply drag the machine rather than ripping the dirt. The same thing is true when you're on a slope and trying to swing a load of dirt up hill. You can wind up shifing your machine sideways, which can be a real nuisance if you're trying to dig a straight ditch.
Another thing to consider on the smaller hoes is that it's easy for a manufacturer to achieve a huge ripping force by using a large hydraulic cylinder. But if the hydraulic pump doesn't pump enough gallons per minute, the digging will be painfully slow.
The heavy frame on a frame mount hoe will lower your center of gravity. It may also lower your ground clearance somewhat. But it does give you a lot of stability.
Finally, remember that although you think you will be using the hoe only for light duty work, you may start finding bigger jobs for it to do once you get it and get used to it. "Small ditches" can run into big rocks, and small stumps can be surprisingly tough (try digging out a nut tree with a big tap root, or an elm stump with a zillion roots spreading out).
Search these discussions and you'll find that most who have purchased a backhoe have found it to be more useful than they expected. (I've used mine to pull engines and to bend rebar, for example.)
(For the record, I have a green frame mount backhoe.)
Another thing to consider on the smaller hoes is that it's easy for a manufacturer to achieve a huge ripping force by using a large hydraulic cylinder. But if the hydraulic pump doesn't pump enough gallons per minute, the digging will be painfully slow.
The heavy frame on a frame mount hoe will lower your center of gravity. It may also lower your ground clearance somewhat. But it does give you a lot of stability.
Finally, remember that although you think you will be using the hoe only for light duty work, you may start finding bigger jobs for it to do once you get it and get used to it. "Small ditches" can run into big rocks, and small stumps can be surprisingly tough (try digging out a nut tree with a big tap root, or an elm stump with a zillion roots spreading out).
Search these discussions and you'll find that most who have purchased a backhoe have found it to be more useful than they expected. (I've used mine to pull engines and to bend rebar, for example.)
(For the record, I have a green frame mount backhoe.)
tommu56
Elite Member
The weight of the tractor "helps" keep it stationary. Technique keeps it there till you get some seat time you will be pulling tractor all over the place (don't ask me how I know) The sub frame is the way to go try explaining to the wife how the back broke on your mower (as she sees it)
orange tlb
tom
orange tlb
tom
GreatWhitehunter
Veteran Member
Go with the JD hoes 447 or 448. No other manufacture's hoe fit the machine as well as the JD hoes. With the rock shaft mounts it couldn't be simpler to attach/detach. Some will tell you to get the 447 and how it's better suited to the 3000 series machines. Thats BS. the 448 is the perfect blend of reach and power for the 3000 series. And one thing to consider is there's no such thing as Light backhoe work. It takes tremendous force to rip into the earth and don't even get me started on stumps. Look at the JD hoes I'm sure you'll see my point in a matter of minutes.
Matt T.
Matt T.
irwin
Veteran Member
GreatWhitehunter said:. And one thing to consider is there's no such thing as Light backhoe work. It takes tremendous force to rip into the earth and don't even get me started on stumps.
Matt T.
I agree heartily with above quote, especially in connecticut! I'm unable to get a full bucket of dirt without hitting at least several fist sized rocks, If I'm lucky! Mostly the rocks are much bigger. Every "easy & quick" backhoe chore I've done generated many 30 to 80lb+ boulders. Here in new england rocks are part of dirt work.
I bought a 3pt backhoe, but before I did any digging I welded up a full subframe (frame weighs over 200lbs) Many other TBNers have done the same.
Do a search on your post's title and read what's been written--many thread's on this subject.