Barn Support Beams
- Thread starter barticus73
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I would not fiddle fart around with jacking anything up. Just marry another post to the one that is there. Last another hundred years. When you are done just hang a sign from it that says "Just Married"!
That barn is a beauty!
Steve
That barn is a beauty!
Steve
daTeacha
Veteran Member
The suggestions so far have been good ones, so let me add one more to your choices. I used to straighten old and sagging barns, repair bulging stone walls under barn banks, move barns, etc. I have a little bit of experience in what you're pondering and the barns around here in Amish country are the same style. For that matter, when I looked at your first pic I thought it was my wife's old barn.
What we did is use bottle jacks setting on a pyramid of shorter timbers placed crosswise to each other, one pair running N-S, the one above that E-W, until the pyramid was close to the beam we wanted to support. The top course of blocking was solid and double. The bottle jack sat on that, then a reverse pyramid was made of progressively longer pieces of wood until we had support under about 2 feet of the beam. The bottle jacks were slowy raised, taking the strain a little at at time.
In the situation you have, it looks like someone was a little eager about cleaning the barn and removed the dirt from around the rocks that the posts rest on. They may or may not have bumped a post with a piece of machinery. The rocks are probably not going to move much, it will take a pretty serious piece of equipment to move those things. I would consider digging out around the rock, forming up an area of suitable size, and pouring it level with the top of the rock with 6 bag mix concrete.
Then, if you anticipate keeping critters in there and are worried about the bottom of the posts rotting or being damaged during cleaning, cut the post off about a foot above the rock. Get a 5 or 6 gallon bucket and fit it around the post. You could cut the bottom out of it if you want, and maybe set some re-bar into holes drilled in the rock or your new concrete but sticking up into where the bucket will be. Put the bucket down on the rock/concrete and pour it full of concrete, making sure to shake, tap, hit, tamp, etc. to get all the air bubbles out. When it all sets up, you can leave the plastic or remove it at your pleasure, but either way, your posts will be connected to the base and each post will have a nice protective concrete base about 18 inches thick under it.
As has been said, those rocks aren't likely to move. You really won't have much of a frost problem unless you get water in the soil on the barn floor or have a spring in there or something. It'll freeze, but not as deeply as a bare field, plus any animals -- especially manure and bedding, will tend to keep it relatively warm.
Get to know your Amish neighbors if you have any and let them know what you want to do. They will appreciate the chance to help you out so you can return the favor if they need a phone, a ride into town, or whatever.
What we did is use bottle jacks setting on a pyramid of shorter timbers placed crosswise to each other, one pair running N-S, the one above that E-W, until the pyramid was close to the beam we wanted to support. The top course of blocking was solid and double. The bottle jack sat on that, then a reverse pyramid was made of progressively longer pieces of wood until we had support under about 2 feet of the beam. The bottle jacks were slowy raised, taking the strain a little at at time.
In the situation you have, it looks like someone was a little eager about cleaning the barn and removed the dirt from around the rocks that the posts rest on. They may or may not have bumped a post with a piece of machinery. The rocks are probably not going to move much, it will take a pretty serious piece of equipment to move those things. I would consider digging out around the rock, forming up an area of suitable size, and pouring it level with the top of the rock with 6 bag mix concrete.
Then, if you anticipate keeping critters in there and are worried about the bottom of the posts rotting or being damaged during cleaning, cut the post off about a foot above the rock. Get a 5 or 6 gallon bucket and fit it around the post. You could cut the bottom out of it if you want, and maybe set some re-bar into holes drilled in the rock or your new concrete but sticking up into where the bucket will be. Put the bucket down on the rock/concrete and pour it full of concrete, making sure to shake, tap, hit, tamp, etc. to get all the air bubbles out. When it all sets up, you can leave the plastic or remove it at your pleasure, but either way, your posts will be connected to the base and each post will have a nice protective concrete base about 18 inches thick under it.
As has been said, those rocks aren't likely to move. You really won't have much of a frost problem unless you get water in the soil on the barn floor or have a spring in there or something. It'll freeze, but not as deeply as a bare field, plus any animals -- especially manure and bedding, will tend to keep it relatively warm.
Get to know your Amish neighbors if you have any and let them know what you want to do. They will appreciate the chance to help you out so you can return the favor if they need a phone, a ride into town, or whatever.
bugstruck
Platinum Member
Plenty of good suggestions. My first thought was essentially what Egon said but adding some strapping as others mentioned. Then I went back to photo 3 again. Do you know if that rock is just sitting there or is that an outcrop of the rock below? If it's just sittting there it may be right over some other rock or rock shelf immediately below as the frost heave others have mentioned sure hasn't occured at that location. Inside that barn I would think the freeze depth may not be that substantial and if you have enough bearing weight on a small enough footprint frost has a much tougher time imparting movement to the object. Not that it absolutely won't though. The main beam looks very straight in that area. If you can move that rock with a machine you could jack up the beam (slowly two places min. and only enough to just free the post) and move the rock back under the post (nearer center). Cut a little off if you must and use some non-shrink grout to close any gaps per Egon's comment. If you wanted to secure the rock in the new location better (assuming there is rock ledge below), you could clean between the ledge and rock and grout the perimeter with a good portland sand mix or concrete mix with small aggregate. Then you could mount a few L brackets to the post and rock with fairly small anchors and bolts. Wouldn't go past 3/8" diameter (1/4" would work OK). No need to explode the rock. The only reason I throw these options out is that they're fast, easy, and you may not get a frost footer in the ground very easily if what I think I'm seeing is there.
If that rock is a true outcropping (don't think it is) just drill some 1/4" drive anchors (look like bent nails and Rawl makes them) on the side of the rock with no support, tie in some rebar if you're an overdoer, form it up, and pour down to a sensible depth with decent ledge or soil. Forget the local frost depth as it will never occur there. Half that depth maybe. Let it cure and if your real brave you could slowly drill and chip away the excess on the other side. Again, doubt that outcropping scenerio is the case.
None of the options I give are with my engineering mindset at work. Just my "fix it good enough for the next generation or so" ballcap. Won't stop a bobcat from moving it but will stop an animal.
Of course you could eliminate the loose photo rock from my suggestion and form/pour concrete on rock ledge if it's there as I suspect. Probably how I'd do it but I'll let the first idea stand.
Good luck. 20 ways to do it.
If that rock is a true outcropping (don't think it is) just drill some 1/4" drive anchors (look like bent nails and Rawl makes them) on the side of the rock with no support, tie in some rebar if you're an overdoer, form it up, and pour down to a sensible depth with decent ledge or soil. Forget the local frost depth as it will never occur there. Half that depth maybe. Let it cure and if your real brave you could slowly drill and chip away the excess on the other side. Again, doubt that outcropping scenerio is the case.
None of the options I give are with my engineering mindset at work. Just my "fix it good enough for the next generation or so" ballcap. Won't stop a bobcat from moving it but will stop an animal.
Of course you could eliminate the loose photo rock from my suggestion and form/pour concrete on rock ledge if it's there as I suspect. Probably how I'd do it but I'll let the first idea stand.
Good luck. 20 ways to do it.
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Defective
Platinum Member
Haven't seen anybody mention it, so maybe nobody else noticed...
In pix 2 & 3, there seems to be wood horizontally under the poles. In pic 2, it looks an awful lot like a wedge.
I think somebody has made adjustments over the years.
I'd be inclined to go with moving the rock in pic 3 into position (follow your choice of directions from previous posts...) & make a hardwood wedge to adjust the pole. This should work and still keep the existing character of the barns construction.
In pix 2 & 3, there seems to be wood horizontally under the poles. In pic 2, it looks an awful lot like a wedge.
I think somebody has made adjustments over the years.
I'd be inclined to go with moving the rock in pic 3 into position (follow your choice of directions from previous posts...) & make a hardwood wedge to adjust the pole. This should work and still keep the existing character of the barns construction.