Confused About Pole Building Girts And Frost Heave

CabinGuy · Dec 6, 2003

People go to great deal of time, trouble, and expense to get footers set below frost line on conventional concrete foundations so the hole building doesn't frost heave. I can't figure out why frost heave forces against the bottom girt on pole buildings doesn't pull the girt off the poles or lift the poles out of the ground. Anyone have any ideas?

I'm planning a small (16 X 22) tractor barn and was considering setting short poles below frost line, cutting them off at grade, setting beams on top of them, and building a conventially framed stud wall on top of the beams. I'd be interested in knowing if anywone has used this method or has any thoughts about pros/cons.

yooperdave · Dec 6, 2003

Any frost heave would most likely take place on the footing or the pole. The girt would only move because it is connected to the pole.

You could also insulate shallow foundations to protect them from the frost.

Yooper Dave

ges · Dec 6, 2003

Around here they are called pole foundations, and the County Building Dept. has the specs and approves them to there design. I have seen 2 of them built and no problems yet.

George

CabinGuy · Dec 6, 2003

Re: Confused About Pole Building Girts And Frost H

Why would the frost heave act on the pole and not the girt? The girt has a long flat surface for the ground to push against, similar to a concrete slab on grade. It seems like there would be much less for the ground to "grab" hold of and/or push against on the pole.

yooperdave · Dec 7, 2003

Re: Confused About Pole Building Girts And Frost H

From my experience, it is common to see a nominal gap between the bottom of the lowest girt and the top of grade.

Heaving takes place with the formation of ice lenses. The ice lense needs to grab onto something in order to accomodate the vertical displacement. The bottom girt is smooth and thin and should not provide much surface area for ice lenses to heave.

I have seen the interior slab heave, but the bottom girt did not appear to show any noticeable displacement. The slab heaved right along side of the girt.

Good luck

Yooper Dave