DK-40: to cut or not to cut, FEL torsion bar

[Coyote machine]

Hey all, Kioti used bolts that did not go deep enough to use the entire threaded portion of the loader mount support post on the right side of my loader. Even though I tightened them as required as part of routine maintenance, the right side plate with 5 bolts, got loose enough to elongate the holes on all the bolts. When I inspected the holes against the factory bolts there was IIRC, about an inch of threads in all the holes which was not being used. The bolts were the right thread etc., but way too short to hold tight.
I decided after close inspection to buy longer bolts and to blue locktite them in the holes. I was fortunate that the new longer bolts worked well, and have mostly stayed in place, and after more frequent torque checks have done what the factory bolts were intended to do.

My dilemma is the right side of the loader arm is lower by at least and inch than the left side arm, and that poses various problems for QA alignment and various implements hitting grade unevenly.
I've read where the only good way to remedy the issue is to cut the loader torsion bar and re-weld it once the loader arms match, i.e. are level as they are supposed to be. What say you? Have any of you encountered this issue? If so, how did you fix it, or what did you do, if anything?

TIA,
CM

 

[DK35vince]

The only cutting of the torque tube I have ever read about was to straighten a twist QA. It works fine for that.
Not to level loader arms.
Removing the mount support and repairing the elongated holes would be a much better repair IMO.

 

[Coyote machine]

The only cutting of the torque tube I have ever read about was to straighten a twist QA. It works fine for that.
Not to level loader arms.
Removing the mount support and repairing the elongated holes would be a much better repair IMO.

I would agree, except the elongated hole issue was, I believe, solved for the most part when longer full depth bolts were fit to the original holes. The OEM bolts would not have allowed me to tighten them to specified torque due to the elongated holes having damaged the threads closest to the start of each hole.

What is wierd is the plate of the support for the right side loader arm is, from what I can see, positioned where it is supposed to be, on the frame of the tractor. There is no visible deviation from where the plate mounted from the factory. The is no paint line or other indication of movement since when I changed out the bolts to the longer ones?!

Maybe some other part of the loader assembly is bent, but to date I cannot discern what/where the problem lies....
Anyone have further thoughts where to look to determine what might be misaligned/bent?

Thanks,

CM

 

[xcgreene]

would it be possible to shim where the loader cradles? Meaning, layer up with weld the cradle whose side is too low? Not sure if this is possible with your particular machine.

You could also shorten the cradle that is higher by cutting a bit out of it and welding it back together, now shorter. certainly hard to say what else may be changing position though, when all this happens. What does the loader look like when it is not mounted to the tractor? does it sit level then?

The obligatory, this is only a recommendation for someone who is truly a serviceable welder, not for those who just think they are. This could really hurt someone many years down the road if it fails.

 

[Coyote machine]

would it be possible to shim where the loader cradles? Meaning, layer up with weld the cradle whose side is too low? Not sure if this is possible with your particular machine.

You could also shorten the cradle that is higher by cutting a bit out of it and welding it back together, now shorter. certainly hard to say what else may be changing position though, when all this happens. What does the loader look like when it is not mounted to the tractor? does it sit level then?

The obligatory, this is only a recommendation for someone who is truly a serviceable welder, not for those who just think they are. This could really hurt someone many years down the road if it fails.

My machine is exactly what you have two of! Maybe you could trade one for mine?! Only difference is 5 more HP on yours.
I think after having read what you guys think, I'm going to take a closer look at the entire loader setup to see if I can find the actual source cause of the problem of the right loader arm being +/- 1" lower than the left arm. Don't know exactly what I will find, but this will help me find the answer to why, then I can work toward a solution.
I've only had the entire loader off the DK one time. I could take it off now, but first I think I will determine if the posts/frame that cradles the loader arms is even/level. Until you mentioned removing the loader assy. that idea had not occurred to me. It may lead me to the answer(s) I need...
Thanks,

CM

 

[ritcheyvs]

Maybe you have already done this but...
If it were me I'd park on a level spot and use a good, long level to determine exactly what's causing your problem. I would not consider cutting the tube unless you know there is a twist between the two arms.
As far as the elongated holes are concerned, if you can find a pipe with an ID that fits the bolts, you can drill out the elongated holes and use sleeves from the pipe. You can epoxy or tack weld the sleeves in the drilled-out holes. I would only advise this if your current fix isn't working.
I suspect the selling dealer assembled the loader mount with the wrong screws. The loader owners manual (which is also a parts manual) should specify the correct screws.

 

[Coyote machine]

Maybe you have already done this but...
If it were me I'd park on a level spot and use a good, long level to determine exactly what's causing your problem. I would not consider cutting the tube unless you know there is a twist between the two arms.
As far as the elongated holes are concerned, if you can find a pipe with an ID that fits the bolts, you can drill out the elongated holes and use sleeves from the pipe. You can epoxy or tack weld the sleeves in the drilled-out holes. I would only advise this if your current fix isn't working.
I suspect the selling dealer assembled the loader mount with the wrong screws. The loader owners manual (which is also a parts manual) should specify the correct screws.

I'm going to try to determine the cause/effect before I do any mods. I know when I was at my selling dealer discussing the short factory bolts and why they were used, they told me they had seen other Kiotis where the loader bolt support holes were so worn that they had to remove the entire loader assembly to drill through and use bolts with lock washers and nuts. At the time we did not discuss whether the damaged holes were racking the loader arms too, or other damage. I can stop by tomorrow and see what they can tell me about likely causes for my situation....

It's weird, to me, that the support 'posts' don't show any evidence of having moved- there is no uncovered paint from where the brackets were originally mounted to the frame. I figure when I replaced the 'factory' bolts with the longer bolts, I was lucky and caught the damage before it became too serious. So now I have to determine what is causing the off level condition between the two loader arms...

Thanks,

CM

 

[WoodDuck]

Something else to check is your rear tire pressure. As these are solid frame machines, and the front axle pivots from a center point, uneven inflation of the rear tires can dramatically affect the "angle of attack" of the SSQA at the opposite end of the machine. I noticed this problem the day they delivered mine; the right edge of my bucket would touch about 1/2 inch before the left with the machine parked on concrete. Convinced they had put something together wrong, I spent an hour going over everything on that loader looking for a problem, and everything looked fine. Started pouring through the internet, and someone pointed this out as a potential cause. I walked out there at 2am in my underwear with a flashlight after reading that,(that's normal behavior for a new tractor owner right?) Sure enough, I could slide my hand in up to the 3rd knuckle between the left rear tire cleat and the concrete. On the right rear tire, barely wedge my hand in to the 1st knuckle. The left tire being "taller" than the right, was effectively pushing the opposite corner of the machine(the front right) down. The next day, I dumped air from the left rear, and even added a little to the right rear, to level the leading edge of my bucket. Might not be your problem at all, but definitely something else to check before taking a torch to anything though. Might even be able to make the rear tires intentionally uneven to correct your issue at the front bucket.

If that doesn't help, you could always weld a small piece of angle steel on top of the "low ear" of your SSQA to bring that side of your attachment up to level. ("shim" the low side up this way) Just put a couple of tacks on to try it first before welding it solid, if it doesn't do what you wanted, just grind the tack welds off to remove the angle steel, and you'll be back to original without doing any permanent damage to anything. Hope this helps!

 

[SSdoxie]

Entirely possible that dealer did not level the loader when installed.
To adjust level:
1.Park on flat hard surface.
2. Roll bucket so is flat with ground then lower arms until lowest point of cutting edge touches. shut engine Off
3. Make sure rear tire inflation is equal on both sides
4. Loosen all loader frame mount bolts (both sides) at least one full turn.
5. Move joystick lever to float. If bucket levels out, tighten the mounting bolts.
6. If still not level, start engine and apply some down pressure. Then tighten all bolts.
This should bring it back in place if the is no weld jigging defect in loader or the bucket.

 

[Coyote machine]

Something else to check is your rear tire pressure. As these are solid frame machines, and the front axle pivots from a center point, uneven inflation of the rear tires can dramatically affect the "angle of attack" of the SSQA at the opposite end of the machine. I noticed this problem the day they delivered mine; the right edge of my bucket would touch about 1/2 inch before the left with the machine parked on concrete. Convinced they had put something together wrong, I spent an hour going over everything on that loader looking for a problem, and everything looked fine. Started pouring through the internet, and someone pointed this out as a potential cause. I walked out there at 2am in my underwear with a flashlight after reading that,(that's normal behavior for a new tractor owner right?) Sure enough, I could slide my hand in up to the 3rd knuckle between the left rear tire cleat and the concrete. On the right rear tire, barely wedge my hand in to the 1st knuckle. The left tire being "taller" than the right, was effectively pushing the opposite corner of the machine(the front right) down. The next day, I dumped air from the left rear, and even added a little to the right rear, to level the leading edge of my bucket. Might not be your problem at all, but definitely something else to check before taking a torch to anything though. Might even be able to make the rear tires intentionally uneven to correct your issue at the front bucket.

If that doesn't help, you could always weld a small piece of angle steel on top of the "low ear" of your SSQA to bring that side of your attachment up to level. ("shim" the low side up this way) Just put a couple of tacks on to try it first before welding it solid, if it doesn't do what you wanted, just grind the tack welds off to remove the angle steel, and you'll be back to original without doing any permanent damage to anything. Hope this helps!

New owner's don't wait until the next day to fix the problem! 2AM is the perfect time to turn on all the lights and wake the neighbors working on your new toy!
I'll keep what you said in mind, thanks
CM
_____________________________________________________________________________________

Entirely possible that dealer did not level the loader when installed.
To adjust level:
1.Park on flat hard surface.
2. Roll bucket so is flat with ground then lower arms until lowest point of cutting edge touches. shut engine Off
3. Make sure rear tire inflation is equal on both sides
4. Loosen all loader frame mount bolts (both sides) at least one full turn.
5. Move joystick lever to float. If bucket levels out, tighten the mounting bolts.
6. If still not level, start engine and apply some down pressure. Then tighten all bolts.
This should bring it back in place if the is no weld jigging defect in loader or the bucket.

Are you saying roll the leading bucket edge to perpendicular with the ground, then try to adjust things from there once the bucket edge is completely in contact with the flat ground/floor?

Here is another idea I would like feedback on. Dealer suggested using a chain to pull against the left loader arm's end near the SSQA to make it line up with the right arm's early touchdown?! I don't know if he meant for me to disconnect the left loader arm's cylinder so it would not raise the loader arm while the right one does the lifting...I'm confused by that idea and how to implement it....I though of using a 'chain binder' but don't know what size/strength to get...Any thought's on the suggested idea?

My other problem is that I also have the SSQA somehow also out of level seems the right side plate goes further up into the slot than does the left plate so my forks are off level and so is my bucket. I don't know how to fix that, and/or which issue to fix first. Should I remove the whole SSQA mechanism to get the loader arms even, first or leave them on and deal with them after straightening the loader arm touchdown issue?
Thanks,

CM