Energy Costs

[_RaT_]

Dave, does El Dorado county have any restrictions on having a fuel tank stored on your property? Do you need to have a containment area? I am interested in the links you showed for heating both water and air, thanks, Mark

 

[SLOBuds]

(Im in central California.)

Yes I am concerned about the odor, particularly knowing how diesel smell lingers for quite a while. It would not matter for me on those components that are outside, in the garage, or otherwise away from living quarters. It would definitely not be good within the living quarters.

I did not read the operating manuals for those heaters. So I couldn't tell whether they ever needed some type of maintenance that required opening the fuel lines. If so, I know that there would be fuel spills along with the smells that go along with that.

My guess is that over time they will need to be cracked open for cleaning, or maybe there are filters that need to be changed out, etc. And ther are most likely some ways to contain the spills onto drip pans or other containment devices that could be removed from the area (along with their smells).

Well. I took my original questions and confusions and dropped them onto the lap of my architect. It turns out that she uses specialized consultants for energy planning anyway. I told her that I was suffering from brain fade relative to all of the choices and tradeoffs, and that I would like to have a preliminary session with the engineer to help us get our arms around capabilities. I want to get a basic understanding of constraints before we acually start the first high-level design activities.

Thanks a lot for your feedback. It turned out to be pretty easy finding relative energy costs on the internet. (I probably should have turned to Google first as the right search terms brought back exactly what I needed.)

Thanks again,
Martin Petersen

 

[_RaT_]

Good Luck Martin. I'm in nearly the same situation as you. We are working on our plans currently. We need to build a garage/living quarters above first as our current home, a mobile home sits where the house would be. Mark

 

[v8dave]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Dave, does El Dorado county have any restrictions on having a fuel tank stored on your property? Do you need to have a containment area? I am interested in the links you showed for heating both water and air, thanks, Mark )</font>

I was concerned about that too. But, El Dorado county doesn't have any restrictions except for property line set back. They [El Dorado county] wanted a map of the tank placement showing its proximity to the structures and property lines. That was all, no permits. The installers handled all the paperwork.

SLOBud, there is a filter in the OM-22 heater. But the installer said the reason they used another filter outside the wall was so the heater would never have to be opened to clean that filter. The only other maintenance is soot clean out in the fire box. The installation crew was vague on how often that was necessary. They wouldn't say it wan't necessary, but it was hardly ever needed in their experience. The OM-22 goes through some kind of a self cleaning process periodically.

 

[SLOBuds]

They probably put a shutoff valve just before the heater. If you need to service the unit, you would shut off the supply and maybe follow some type of procedure to clear the fluid. Maybe it has a low-point drain, or it is able to run all of the fluid out of the line through normal combustion.

Actually, I'm positive that you could isolate the drips somehow during maintenance. And after that, if I recall my days as installer on diesel yachts, there are cleaning solutions that do neutralize the oder as well as clean the fluid.

Either way I don't think it will be a problem for you. And it looks like a swell unit!

Good luck.
Martin

 

[SLOBuds]

Thanks Mark.

I might start a post on CBN so folks can follow my travails and offer tidbits of knowledge and wisdom!

I'm fairly confused at the moment. Mainly because of the number of options combined with the limits of the parcel combined with some of the design characteristics we are married to (eg., radiant heat). So I dropped this on my architect and said 'I give.'

The architect is specialized in alternative construction methods, but she outsources the energy work to specialists. I told her yesterday that I would like an early session with the energy person to get an idea of capabilities.

Because of our mild climate here in California, there are many technologies that are not well represented. It's just easier to slap central air/heat into a structure that looks like 1000 other structures in your tract, and has the minimal amount of insulation needed to satisfy regulations. (Or at least this is the way it is in central/southern CA.) It's not as easy to find hvac professionals that are well versed in boilers, radiant heat, geothermal, etc. Solar, of course, is another story. Plenty of those folks around.

As long as I am paying to have someone educate me on all of this, it might be nice to share that with the group as well. And I know it would help for others to kick the tires too!

Regardless of the efficiences that are associated with various mechanicals, my take at this moment is that passive design techniques and conservation methods are the best ways to reduce costs. I could build a 24x7 fully-lit gambling casino, and power it fully with huge solar arrays. Or I could probably build something smaller, with plenty of natural light, that heats and cools within a reasonalbe range all year round, and ... etc.

Happy new year,
Martin

 

[rozett]

It is often a tradeoff between the (one-time) initial building costs and the (recurrring) operating costs. Most of the more efficient heating and AC technologies cost a lot more up front. So a builder, building on spec, will opt for the lower up front costs. Since you are building for yourself, and assuming that up front costs are not an issue for you, then you have many more options open to you and the use of an energy expert is a good call.