FEL Functionality

[MrFixit]

I have a KAMA 354C with Koyker 160 FEL. I have a 3 spool valve to control Lift, tilt and grapple attachment. Everything seems to work but I'm curious about the Downward TILT.

The bucket will tilt up properly under hydraulic control but it seems the Down Tilt is activated by Gravity, not hydraulic power. This doesn't seem to cause me any problems but I don't think it's the way it is supposed to be. If it's presently gravity controlled and not supposed to be that way then I suspect I'm drawing air into the system and that's needs correcting.

If anybody knows the correct functionality of the bucket downward tilt please let me know. If you feel it's broke please offer any suggestions.

Thanks in advance!

Tim

 

[Wayne_Freeman]

This function should be hydraulic. I use it when back grading to feather the pressure. You definately have something to troubleshoot. If you leave the loader elevated overnight does anything leak down? Start by tightening ALL fittings, make sure no leaks and top off fluid. There are others on this board much more qualified with the hydraulics to help you further.

 

[RonMar]

Yes, the bucket should be powered up and down. I would first cycle the bucket several times with the arms raised and the arms lowered to make sure all the air is out of the system. Even if there was air in the system, the bucket would still move like it was powered, it might just appear jerky as the air in the system compresses under load.

I would then suspect something amiss in the spool valve. You could try swapping the two lines that run to the dump cylinders with the two lines on the 3rd spool that are used for the grapple and see how the dump works using the grappel spool. That would tell you if there is a problem with the dump spool valve or if the problem lies in the hoses or dump cylinders. Just make sure the FEL is all the way down and there is no pressure on the system before you go wrenching on fittings.

As far as the hoses and cylinders go, the only thing that comes to mind is an obstruction at one of the fittings that is acting like a check valve. It flows fine when the bucket is rolled back and restricts the flow when the bucket is dumped.

 

[3RRL]

MrFixit,
You are talking about the bucket and not the float in the downward FEL movement. As far as the bucket curl downward, it is hydraulic, just like the upward curl. However, there have been several posts about how slow it curls down. Once it reaches the point where the lip or bucket teeth are pointing straight down, it needs several seconds to continue to the maximum backwards curl position. It works much faster at rated rpm, so I would try it at that speed first.

If it NEVER curls downward, then you have a problem. Check for leaks at all connections and hoses themselves. Use a piece of cardboard to inspect so any small stream does not hit your skin. It is under high pressure and can cause injury. If no leaks, it migh be your valves. Like said above, switch the connections to see which cylinder reacts to the valve. If not the valve, it could be a bad cylinder, which will reveal itself when switching lines. If the good function works after switching lines, and the down curl still doesn't work, then you can pinpoint it to a bad cylinder function? ... However, if the upwards curl works, that is the same cylinder so I don't know what it would be.

Try curling down at high rpm and hold it there for a while.

 

[bluechip]

If you have a Koyker loader, there is a 2 speed valve, pushing the joystick further to the right, will increase dumping action of the bucket. You should be able to lift the front end of your tractor by the curl alone if all is working as it should.

 

[MrFixit]

Thanks everybody! I have almost 50 hours on the KAMA and the downward tilt of bucket has always been gravity powered but never seemed to cause any problems. I don't have any visible fluid leaks. When I operate the down tilt I have good control of speed. It will drop fast as a boulder or snail slow. But it won't lift the tractor or even make any suggestion it is trying but the FEL alrms can easilly lift it up.

Now that everybody agrees it should be hydraulic powered, swapping hoses with the Grapple as suggested will steer me in the right direction. I don't have the Koyker Joystick, I have 3 seperate levers which should make troubleshooting easy.

Thanks!

Tim

 

[bluechip]

oops, missed that 3 spool detail...that could also mean you don't have the two speed dump function. Are you sure all 3 valves are two way? swapping will tell more.

 

[MrFixit]

Hi Chip,

I don't know if there ane any One way valves on this spool that' why I questioned this setup. The valve assembly has 3 seperate bodies. The one on the left side is a bit longer and appears to have the Float function as when the lever is pressed all the way forward the grapple jaws slowly drop under gravity. The dealer installed this valve to the Grapple! That's another story, who would want to float their grapple jaws?

The center valve operates the tilt and the right valve operates the arms. They appear to be the same from the outside.

I already planned on swapping the "Floating" grapple lines with the Arm lines as this appeared wrong from the start. In the process I thought I'd ask the experts here what they thought of the gravity controled tilt as I thought that was wrong also.

Tim

 

[RonMar]

Yep that sounds backwards. The longer spool with float should be for the lift arms I am about to replace my 2 spool with a 3 to add a grapple. My current 2 spool dosn't have float and I really miss it as it makes grading with the bucket much easier

If they got that backwards, I would go through all the plumbing to make sure things are connected properly.

Hoses should run from one working port on a spool to one end of a cylinder, or thru a "T" to the same end of two cylinders that operate in parallel such as those that lift the loader arms. The opposite end of those cylinders should connect to hoses(and a "T") that go back to the remaining working port on the same spool valve. The connection to the work ports determines which way the cylinders move when the lever is moved.