We recently bought some land with a barn and a pull handle type outdoor faucet. With the recent cold weather I was wondering how cold it got before some of you put a pipe heater on? Does anyone have experience with the cable type heater or is there another type? Thanks.
Freezing pipes
- Thread starter GrantMO
- Start date
- Views: 4574
TWINKLE_TOES
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Sep 3, 2000
- Messages
- 1,366
Grant,
The answer is 32 deg if it stays that way long enough, but you knew that. Overnight temps that drop into the upper twenties followed by day time temperatures above freezing won't break galvanized steel pipes. Poly Pipe and PVC pipes are much less forgiving. Cold nights followed by daytime temps that do not get above 32 require you do something. Short term solutions like letting the facet drip work but not something you want to do all winter. Foam insulation works if cold spells don't last to long. Heat tape works but often the power dosen't. I live in the Northwest on the ocean side of the mountains where a dip down to 20 deg will set a record that will last for 5 years. I have five exposed outlets which I keep heat tape and foam insulation. If you use foam over the heat tape make sure the thermostat is also inside the foam. I have frost free hose bibs on the outlets on the house and they seem to work pretty good. In the bad ole days my folks used to cover the barn hose bib with fresh cow manure and straw, nothing ever burned down.
If you haven't guessed by now not much of what I have said helps. But I bet you will get a lot of help from the folks on this board that have to deal with real cold weather and not the whimpy stuff I have been talking about./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
The answer is 32 deg if it stays that way long enough, but you knew that. Overnight temps that drop into the upper twenties followed by day time temperatures above freezing won't break galvanized steel pipes. Poly Pipe and PVC pipes are much less forgiving. Cold nights followed by daytime temps that do not get above 32 require you do something. Short term solutions like letting the facet drip work but not something you want to do all winter. Foam insulation works if cold spells don't last to long. Heat tape works but often the power dosen't. I live in the Northwest on the ocean side of the mountains where a dip down to 20 deg will set a record that will last for 5 years. I have five exposed outlets which I keep heat tape and foam insulation. If you use foam over the heat tape make sure the thermostat is also inside the foam. I have frost free hose bibs on the outlets on the house and they seem to work pretty good. In the bad ole days my folks used to cover the barn hose bib with fresh cow manure and straw, nothing ever burned down.
If you haven't guessed by now not much of what I have said helps. But I bet you will get a lot of help from the folks on this board that have to deal with real cold weather and not the whimpy stuff I have been talking about./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
jiminpa
Bronze Member
you said a pull type handle?does the faucet come up out of the ground or does it come from the side of the building?if it comes out of the ground it proble is a freeze proof hydrant and will not need anything done to it(except don't leave a hose hooked up to it!)these drain out thru the bottom when they are turned off,the water supply is below the frost line.hope this helps!
ronjhall
Super Star Member
Grant, if you are talking about a frost proof faucet then it should not ever freeze. Just remember to never leave a hose attached to it. Always push the handle all the way down. This allows all the water to drain out of the standpipe. The vertical pipe should be 4 to 5 feet into the ground. I have not had to put heat tape on mine in 28 years.
ronh/w3tcompact/icons/cool.gif
ronh/w3tcompact/icons/cool.gif
Thanks for the replies. Yes I think this is a freeze proof faucet. It comes out of the ground and not from the side of a building. We started taking the hose off the threads back in October just to be safe. The reason I asked about a heating device is that I saw my Uncle's faucet freeze and the pipe split about 6 inches below where the faucet screws on the pipe. He lives in WY and it gets a lot colder there than here. I think what happened was his faucet was defective and wasn't draining like it should. Now he has to replace it and it's connected 6 feet below ground. Thanks again.
Grant
Grant
Wingnut
Veteran Member
I've gone through 2 of those "freezeproof" faucets so far in the past 2 years. The first one was 8 foot long (buried 5 feet) and it crapped out the first winter. They work by opening a drain hole when you close them ... and draining out the water. And since the drain is (supposed to be) below the frost line ... they are (ha ha ha) freezeproof. NOT. Guess what? They're made out of metal ... metal stays real cold and the water doesn't drain back fast enough to prevent a skin of water from freezing ... and it gets progressively worse ... which I figured out AFTER I used too much brute force to open the darned thing and break off the bottom fitting.
Now I have a heat tape on it and that gets turned on the first time it gets to freezing. Since most good heat tapes have thermostats ... it doesn't use that much electricity ... and that seems to work 'cause this is the second winter for the replacement hydrant and it's still going strong. (And mine is in the barn so it it's even more protected ... which is why the first one one really "frosts" me!
Put a heat tape on it ... you won't regret it.
too bad that common sense ain't
Now I have a heat tape on it and that gets turned on the first time it gets to freezing. Since most good heat tapes have thermostats ... it doesn't use that much electricity ... and that seems to work 'cause this is the second winter for the replacement hydrant and it's still going strong. (And mine is in the barn so it it's even more protected ... which is why the first one one really "frosts" me!
Put a heat tape on it ... you won't regret it.
too bad that common sense ain't
bpence
Platinum Member
- Joined
- Jun 16, 2000
- Messages
- 532
- Tractor
- Kubota B7100 HST - 1995
I have two of the freeze free faucets. I heat wrap both of them just as a precaution. Never had a freeze up. I know you're supposed to be able to just leave these faucets, but for a few bucks for the heat tapes and a couple of dollars a year in electricity, I view it as good insurance. And since I occasionally keep brood mares for a neighbor, I hate to have to carry water through the deep white stuff.
Bob Pence
Bob Pence
heehaw
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2000
- Messages
- 2,076
- Location
- russellville, arkansas
- Tractor
- Kubota M4900, B7510 and RTV
i had a plumber tell me 25 years ago; if you'll come out of the ground with galv. pipe, and put a standard water faucet on the end, @2 ft out of the ground, more if you want, as long as you don't try to protect it from freezing, it will not burst; it will freeze, but when it thaws out, it works fine. i have installed several outside faucets like this, and so far, none have bursted; he said the secret is to leave it alone in the winter, if you try to protect it, it will freeze in the wrong place and then burst. it "appears" it starts freezing from the top, and just pushes the water back down the line instead of expanding/bursting the pipe.
heehaw
heehaw
Wingnut
Veteran Member
HeeHaw ... as someone noted in another thread today (about living in Alaska) .. a frozen pipe is no big deal .... until it thaws. Freezing doesn't burst a pipe, but the pressure created by thawing ice (water) with no place to go bursts the pipe. I've had several of those no-freeze longish thru-the-wall faucets break after a long cold winter ... and the first time I find out is when I turn on the faucet in the spring and soak my basement.
Now I always install them with a drain and valve inside and empty the faucet and leave it open when winter comes ...., viola no more bursting (but also no winter use of the faucet)
pete
too bad that common sense ain't
Now I always install them with a drain and valve inside and empty the faucet and leave it open when winter comes ...., viola no more bursting (but also no winter use of the faucet)
pete
too bad that common sense ain't
heehaw
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2000
- Messages
- 2,076
- Location
- russellville, arkansas
- Tractor
- Kubota M4900, B7510 and RTV
i guess i missed that one; thawing ice breaks the pipes??at least thats when they start leaking, for sure..
the "freeze proof" faucets that go thru a wall, have to be installed with a downward tilt toward the output; and it must be long enough to get the shut-off part of it inside the warm/heated area of a building; this allows the water inside the faucet to drain out when the pipe is shut off; if you forget and leave a hose or something on the faucet, so it can't drain, it can freeze and break. now, the free standing faucets, that you can put out away from the buildings, is suppose to have gravel installed around the pipe to allow the water to drain when the faucet is shut off; the depth of the pipe naturally depends on how deep the ground will freeze, around here, 6-8 inches is usually enough. i have 4 of this type on my place; i have had to replace 2, because when i went to turn them on, the threads on the rod that goes down to the bottom of the pipe and does the actual on/off function, rusted and pulled out, so i couldn't turn the one on, and the other turned on, but then i couldn't turn it back off..i replaced both with a different brand, and they work a lot easier than the originals; i have used them when the temp was @ 10f; with no problems..i have never had any problems with the faucets i installed without using "freezeproof" faucets, except i can't use them in the winter, they freeze..
heehaw
the "freeze proof" faucets that go thru a wall, have to be installed with a downward tilt toward the output; and it must be long enough to get the shut-off part of it inside the warm/heated area of a building; this allows the water inside the faucet to drain out when the pipe is shut off; if you forget and leave a hose or something on the faucet, so it can't drain, it can freeze and break. now, the free standing faucets, that you can put out away from the buildings, is suppose to have gravel installed around the pipe to allow the water to drain when the faucet is shut off; the depth of the pipe naturally depends on how deep the ground will freeze, around here, 6-8 inches is usually enough. i have 4 of this type on my place; i have had to replace 2, because when i went to turn them on, the threads on the rod that goes down to the bottom of the pipe and does the actual on/off function, rusted and pulled out, so i couldn't turn the one on, and the other turned on, but then i couldn't turn it back off..i replaced both with a different brand, and they work a lot easier than the originals; i have used them when the temp was @ 10f; with no problems..i have never had any problems with the faucets i installed without using "freezeproof" faucets, except i can't use them in the winter, they freeze..
heehaw