alpha
Bronze Member
so if you got larger cylinders for your F.EL. would you affect the tractor in a bad way?
front end power up
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JimR
Elite Member
You would be able to lift more with the bucket. This would in turn be over the rating the loader was made for. It could cause you to lift the backend up off the ground depending on if you had rear weights or not. Of course it would put more strain on your front end also. I broke a front spindle once on my old 8N I had. I lifted a rock that was way over what the tractor was made for. Live and learn and do not do it again I say. I also flipped that same tractor once. I had the loader full of muck. I was going around the hill in back of my house. The backhoe swung around and over we went. It took me hours to get it back up.
DocHeb
Veteran Member
I suspect the pressure relief valve for the cylinders "pops" before the capacity of your current cylinders is reached (i.e., it isn't the cylinders limiting your lifting, it is the pressure relief.)
If you increase the size of the cylinders you will increase the force you can generate, but you will have a proportional decrease in the responsiveness of the cylinders (they will move slower.)
If you increase the size of the cylinders you will increase the force you can generate, but you will have a proportional decrease in the responsiveness of the cylinders (they will move slower.)
WVBill
Veteran Member
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( ... but you will have a proportional decrease in the responsiveness of the cylinders (they will move slower.) )</font>
You may also have a problem with the capacity of the hydraulic reservoir. i.e. there may not be enough fluid to fully extend the cylinders - or - it they were fully extended there may not be enough room in the reservoir to hold all the fluid when they are retracted.
You may also have a problem with the capacity of the hydraulic reservoir. i.e. there may not be enough fluid to fully extend the cylinders - or - it they were fully extended there may not be enough room in the reservoir to hold all the fluid when they are retracted.
MossRoad
Super Moderator
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2001
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- 57,547
- Location
- South Bend, Indiana (near)
- Tractor
- Power Trac PT425 2001 Model Year
I think it would be very easy to damage a tractor by increasing the size of the lift cylinders.
On my larger tractor, I have lift cylinders that are larger than stock. I bought it used and that's how it came. The rear tires are loaded and I had 55 gallons of concrete on the 3pt. The tractor weighs about 8000 pounds. I have broken the bucket a few times and bent some brackets that the loader attaches to. Just keep pulling on that joystick hoping to lift the load or pop out a stump and watch the bucket just buckle and crack across the back.
Something's gotta give. One of five things I can think of will probably happen:
1. The load comes up off the ground /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif.
-or-
2. The rear end comes off the ground /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif.
-or-
3. Your reliefs kick in and it just sits there /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif.
-or-
4. Your tractor stalls /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif.
-or-
5. Something breaks /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif.
I'd get a loader designed for the machine. If it is not big enough to do the job, get a bigger machine.
Just my opinions, of course. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
On my larger tractor, I have lift cylinders that are larger than stock. I bought it used and that's how it came. The rear tires are loaded and I had 55 gallons of concrete on the 3pt. The tractor weighs about 8000 pounds. I have broken the bucket a few times and bent some brackets that the loader attaches to. Just keep pulling on that joystick hoping to lift the load or pop out a stump and watch the bucket just buckle and crack across the back.
Something's gotta give. One of five things I can think of will probably happen:
1. The load comes up off the ground /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif.
-or-
2. The rear end comes off the ground /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif.
-or-
3. Your reliefs kick in and it just sits there /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif.
-or-
4. Your tractor stalls /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif.
-or-
5. Something breaks /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif.
I'd get a loader designed for the machine. If it is not big enough to do the job, get a bigger machine.
Just my opinions, of course. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
The larger cylinders will operate at the same pressure as the smaller ones since that is set by the relief valve and/or the pump. There will be no additional strain on the hydraulics other than pumping more fluid which will take longer.
The issue of the resevoir size might be a concern if you are talking a 6-inch cylinder or something, but going from say 2 inches to 2.5 or 3, the resevoir is probably large enough.
If the remainder of the machine is not beefed up as well, it "may" fail in some other way:
1. Tip over if the ballast is not sufficient.
2. Overloaded tires can fail in disasterous ways - imagine if one were to come off the rim on a side slope or something.
3. Bend or break something on the bucket, arms, mount, frame, or front axle. The bucket is probably the cheapest to replace or pound back into shape.
4. There may be clearance issues that are not obvious until you cycle through the entire range of motion.
5. The failure may not be immediate. You may end up stressing portions of the machine beyond its yield point, but not to its ultimate tensile point (bends back and forth, but does not break immediately). Repeating this cycle will eventually lead to stress factures.
6. The slowness may be more annoying and less productive than the lower capacity was.
7. The added wight of the larger cylinders may partially offset the additional capacity. Especially if you also up-size the bucket cylinders.
8. The true destructive power of the larger hydraulics may not be apparant right away. You may think everything is working great until you come up against an "immovable" object.
The issue of the resevoir size might be a concern if you are talking a 6-inch cylinder or something, but going from say 2 inches to 2.5 or 3, the resevoir is probably large enough.
If the remainder of the machine is not beefed up as well, it "may" fail in some other way:
1. Tip over if the ballast is not sufficient.
2. Overloaded tires can fail in disasterous ways - imagine if one were to come off the rim on a side slope or something.
3. Bend or break something on the bucket, arms, mount, frame, or front axle. The bucket is probably the cheapest to replace or pound back into shape.
4. There may be clearance issues that are not obvious until you cycle through the entire range of motion.
5. The failure may not be immediate. You may end up stressing portions of the machine beyond its yield point, but not to its ultimate tensile point (bends back and forth, but does not break immediately). Repeating this cycle will eventually lead to stress factures.
6. The slowness may be more annoying and less productive than the lower capacity was.
7. The added wight of the larger cylinders may partially offset the additional capacity. Especially if you also up-size the bucket cylinders.
8. The true destructive power of the larger hydraulics may not be apparant right away. You may think everything is working great until you come up against an "immovable" object.
I'd just like to say that the MFG of your tractor would have loved to sell you a loader with bigger cylinders if the tractor's front end and other parts would have taken the larger loads you'd be able to lift. They didn't for a reason. John
