Frustrated with real estate and venting

[AlanB]

So we have been very actively looking for a new house / land for the past month plus, the DW had been looking for the last several years.

House pops up on MLS auto notify, fits what we want, where we want, looks right, go view it that night (Wed) like what we see, couple questions, write a full offer, 1/2 closing costs, we want to look at pool that disclosure says has a tear.

They counter, pretty close to what we offered, some hangs about repairing the pool, we have to take it "as is" give us till Sat noon to look at it and make up our mind.

We set a time with them too come look at it tommorrow (sat) and look at the pool, spent today running around getting paperwork together, loans approved, etc. got the paperwork all together they wanted etc.

Our agent calls and says they have pulled their offer and sold to someone else this evening..... go figure, that offer came from a neighbor and the selling agent is also going to be the buying agent.

Oh well, the deal is off, I had been told that the seller was a very standup guy (by mutual freind) So when the deal is off, after I have already cancelled my plans for the weekend to do this house deal, I call this guy direct, he plays the "it's all legal" card, and my realtor should talk to his realtor card.... Man, it just frosts me, yep it may be legal, but like I told the man, he signed a written contract to me and told me I had till tomorrow to make up my mind,,, May be legal, still does not make it right too me.

I hope I don't do people this way, I don't think it phases him a bit.

Live and learn I guess but it sure does burn me up.

 

[bmac]

That Stinks! Was the Sat. deadline specified in the offer? Are they not contractually bound by signing an acceptance of your offer. I know as a buyer, if you back out you lose your earnest money (at least that's my interpretation of the function of earnest money). Seems to me that they have a duty to honor the offer or they should have some financial liability. Obviously, I'm not a real estate agent and know very little about this. But, I'd be angry and venting, too, we I in your position.

 

[AlanB]

Yes, the Sat deadline was theirs, they wrote it in, when I spoke with the guy he said they "could not just wait around on us to make up our mind"

The seller does not put up earnest money, but yeah, I had to put up $1000 that I would have lost had I pulled back......

I think what they did was legal, just not very ethical. My agent is pretty pissed as well, I will let her work it with the board of realtors.

 

[Nat]

sounds like a lawsuit for specific performance to me. Here in NC if you sign a contract to buy a certian piece of property and the seller backs out they are sued for "specific performance". A piece of property is unique, there is no other like it in the world on that spot on the world, and if you have a contract to buy it and the seller agreed in writing, they are open for a suit, and the court will agree with you. Look into it. Later, Nat

 

[rox]

TBN is a nice plce to vent. very sympathetic members here. Just and idea, the neighbor who is buying "your" dream house, wonde what his house is like? it will be going on the market soon.

 

[ultrarunner]

It really all comes down to what is legal in Clarksville TN.

From personal experience in California on the buying side, there is no deal until the offer is accepted. Every counter offer is essentially a "New Deal"

Years ago, my brother told me if I was really interested in a specific property that I should first get it under contract before spending a lot of time on it.

Your protection as a buyer would be to have a written inspection period in the contract to do your due diligence and make your offer subject to approval of a pest report, survey, etc.

Doubt you could do much to the seller, but you could always file an ethics complaint against the agent that is "Double Ending" the deal.

I would hang in there for a while if you still want it. In my area it is not uncommon for a first, second, or even third back-up offer to end up as the buyer.

 

[CurlyDave]

I know as a buyer, if you back out you lose your earnest money (at least that's my interpretation of the function of earnest money).

In the modern world it usually doesn't happen that way. DW and I sold a house ~18 months ago where the buyer had put $18k of ernest money down.

They backed out at the last minute and when I tred to get their ernest money, they said they would prevent the sale of the house to anyone else for three or four months while it got hashed out in court if we didn't give them their money back.

It ended up with them paying for a termite fumigation and we gave them the rest of the money back.

There was an great example of how having a back-up offer in would benefit someone.

 

[ScottAR]

Been there, got the Tshirt and the gray hairs...

Your agent should know what recourse you have, or you can contact an attorney that specializes in real estate. Since money has changed hands that would cement the contract in my eyes... Only the court's eyes would matter if took that far.

My family has been through a situation similar to what Nat talks about. Ours was fairly straight forward. A one time court visit and some attorney fees.
Our would be seller accepted the earnest money and then backed out. We filed suit for specific performance and long story short we bought the property as per the original agreement.
I dunno how it works in TN.

 

[MossRoad]

If they took $1000.00 earnest money and said they'd wait until a certain time period, I'd think is would be illegal for them to go back on the deal until that time expired, even if they gave you back the money(besides them being moral weasels).

With that said... unless you stand to gain financially from fighting them, it is simply not worth it for the aggravation, frustration and consumption of Roll Aids that will ensue. File a complaint with the proper folks and move on. We were on the losing end of a rotten zoning appeal and a lawyer told us some good advice... the sale was not meant to be. Take it as a sign from above that there was something wrong with the place and you will find a better, nicer place in good time.

It sounds like the sellers were trying to hid something if they would not give you time to inspect everything and get your ducks in a row. You are better off not having to deal with them.

 

[Superduper]

So we have been very actively looking for a new house / land for the past month plus, the DW had been looking for the last several years.

House pops up on MLS auto notify, fits what we want, where we want, looks right, go view it that night (Wed) like what we see, couple questions, write a full offer, 1/2 closing costs, we want to look at pool that disclosure says has a tear.

They counter, pretty close to what we offered, some hangs about repairing the pool, we have to take it "as is" give us till Sat noon to look at it and make up our mind.

Sorry to hear about your frustrations. Don't know how they do business in TN but presuming it is similar to CA, it all boils down to whether you accepted the counter offer with the condition that you have til saturday to accept pool in as-is condition. If you accepted those terms, then the sellers will be contractually bound to give you the agreed time for due diligence. If, however, you were presented with a counter offer which you declined to sign until you were satisfied with it's condition, and the saturday deadline was a verbal one rather than a written one, then it would be hard to prove and you may not have a case. Whether you have a case for specific performance depends entirely on the situation. Without possessing intimate knowledge of many specifics of the transaction, you probably shouldn't expect to receive meaningful advice. Another thing you may want to consider is the relationship with the realtor. In California, real estate agents have a fiduciary duty to look after the interests of their clients. If the agent was representing the buyer and seller, then the real estate agent has an obligation to protect equally, the buyer as well as the sellers. You should check your documents to see if there is any agency disclosure indicating whether the agent was representing you. If this is the case, then you might want to speak with an attorney (or real estate licensing authority) regarding taking action against the realtor for legal or ethical misconduct or investigate whether the agent was working in your best interest.

Perhaps this is an opportunity for you to vent at a frustrating situation. But I can suggest that the next time around, always lock up a transaction and request sufficient time to do your due diligence. This means accepting a contract with the understanding that you be provided a certain amount of time (17 days is common in CA) which can be any negotiated amount.

 

[Superduper]

........With that said... unless you stand to gain financially from fighting them, it is simply not worth it for the aggravation, frustration and consumption of Roll Aids that will ensue. File a complaint with the proper folks and move on......

Not always 100% true. Every home is unique and preferrably is a good or great deal, but even if it was just at market value, if it was a perfect fit, you may not find another one that is perfect for your situation. A case for specific performance puts the current deal on hold and a lis pendens will be recorded on the sale. In short, the property will have a cloud on title and for all practical purposes is unsalable until the issue is resolved. This can take much time and the current buyers may not have the stomach to fight for it, and the sellers may not have the stomach to fight against it if the current buyer drops out. This will be the hardball way of dealing with the situation. Whether you pursue it will depend upon how difficult you believe it will be to find another one that is right for you.

 

[CurlyDave]

...This will be the hardball way of dealing with the situation. Whether you pursue it will depend upon how difficult you believe it will be to find another one that is right for you.

IMHO this would be the worst mistake of your life.

The current buyers already live next door.

If you beat them legally you will have an enemy for a neighbor going in.

It is bad enough when a feud develops between neighbors, but starting out with a known cause for one is enough to make that property undesirable right from the start. Similarly, even if the current buyer drops out for other reasons, do you really want to live next to them?

 

[Superduper]

...This will be the hardball way of dealing with the situation. Whether you pursue it will depend upon how difficult you believe it will be to find another one that is right for you.

IMHO this would be the worst mistake of your life.

The current buyers already live next door.

If you beat them legally you will have an enemy for a neighbor going in.

It is bad enough when a feud develops between neighbors, but starting out with a known cause for one is enough to make that property undesirable right from the start. Similarly, even if the current buyer drops out for other reasons, do you really want to live next to them?

All great and valid points. Please note that my post was not a specific suggestion to the original poster, but rather was a response to another post wherein I offered that it's not always the perfect solution to abandon a buying effort simply because there was no financial benefit. It all depends upon how perfect a house is for that individual buyer and how much they want it. I sincerely believe that paying a small premium or expending extra effort is worth the cost to acquire the perfect house rather than to take the easy path and buy something that is less than perfect for that individual. Again, this was not a specific suggestion to the original poster to pursue litigation in his case and I apologize if it was interpreted that way.

 

[AlanB]

Ultra runner pretty much hit the nail on the head.

I should have probably countered right away with accepting their terms, but an inspection period after, but that would have been another counteroffer as well.

It seems it can really get endless.

I think what he did was legal, just not very moral, or what I would consider "good business".

I thought about suing to prove a point, but in reality, nothing will change for them, and I would be out some money and aggravated as all get out, the best thing I can probably do is look for something else and move on.

(Of course I asked my freind who is a close aquaintance with the guy that backed out for the name of his real estate attorney, because the other guy backed out on the deal, said I would probably have to sue to get results.....)

Somehow I suspect he has heard about that by now...

 

[Highbeam]

Failure to perform is what they call it here in WA, you could sue on those grounds. It is easy to unbuy a house through some financing or inspection addendum but not easy to unsell a house. I tried to unsell my house when the home I was buying fell through, the buyers of my home wouldn't accept me unselling my house and forced me out. Failure to perform, he agreed to the offer until Saturday.

 

[scott_vt]

Afternoon Alan,
Sorry to hear about all the aggravation you just endured ! I have to agree that what this seller did was not morally right, but the bottom line is he did it and I think you would be best to move on. As Dave mentioned, to pursue this legally is probablly a frivolous waste of money and time ! Im for getting your agent back out there looking on your behalf, to find what you want. Heck, maybe the next deal wont have a torn pool liner

 

[Podunkadunk]

...This will be the hardball way of dealing with the situation. Whether you pursue it will depend upon how difficult you believe it will be to find another one that is right for you.

IMHO this would be the worst mistake of your life.

The current buyers already live next door.

If you beat them legally you will have an enemy for a neighbor going in.

It is bad enough when a feud develops between neighbors, but starting out with a known cause for one is enough to make that property undesirable right from the start. Similarly, even if the current buyer drops out for other reasons, do you really want to live next to them?

There's some wisdom here. CurlyDave is right. I don't think it was meant to be and you definitely don't want to live next to the people you ousted from their "friends" home. Talk about friction!

 

[MossRoad]

...you definitely don't want to live next to the people you ousted from their "friends" home. Talk about friction!

But it's O.K. to live next to the people that outbid you on that house.

 

[AlanB]

Funny you should mention that Moss as there is another house, just came up on the market, just down the street, and low and behold,,,, Same agent..

My only hope is that they have the first house on a contingency of selling the second,,, it would just tear me up inside if the whole stinking mess fell through on them... (well, maybe not )

Then one more little positive thought The sellers agent changed the MLS listing making herself a dual agent after they had countered our first offer....

Apparently the MLS folks and the realtor board (or some such stuff) frown on that type of action. I guess that is what allows the sellers agent to negotiate commision. I am not sure I really follow it all, but anyway, the Seller now has to pay the selling agent and broker full commision on both halves of the sale instead of the discount that they apparently (the sellers agent said they did) negotiated.

While I realize that they can balance the money out some other ways, I kind of hope it leaves a bad taste in the seller's mouth when they are done.

Our house and land hunt continues... Darn I hate it.