Hi flow

[radman1]

Can the high flow on a toolcat be activated whenever needed (by me) or does it require the 7 pin attachment hook up on the attachment to activate it. Just planning for the future with possible toolcat purchase. Can other vendors hi flow attachments be used with a toolcat hi flow?

 

[UFM82]

Hi-Flo is controlled on the machine. The attachment has nothing to do with it. Some hi-flo pieces require a 7 pin to control them, such as an angle feature, side shift or the like. Bobcat attachments that require a 7 pin have a small control box on them and it talks to the power unit. While some 2nd party hi-flow pieces will work on Bobcats, not all will without some modifications. Erskine snowblowers used to be one of our non-Bobcat items and it ran hi-flo, chute rotation and deflector adjustment. It used secondary hydraulics to achieve that. Some attachments will have a valve body on the piece to control multiple functions and you will have to wire in a new harness or fab one.

 

[y3ll0w]

Hi-Flo is controlled on the machine. The attachment has nothing to do with it. Some hi-flo pieces require a 7 pin to control them, such as an angle feature, side shift or the like. Bobcat attachments that require a 7 pin have a small control box on them and it talks to the power unit. While some 2nd party hi-flow pieces will work on Bobcats, not all will without some modifications. Erskine snowblowers used to be one of our non-Bobcat items and it ran hi-flo, chute rotation and deflector adjustment. It used secondary hydraulics to achieve that. Some attachments will have a valve body on the piece to control multiple functions and you will have to wire in a new harness or fab one.

What is the difference between a 7 and 14 pin control system?

 

[radman1]

UFM82
Your response brings up another question. Why doesn't Bobcat and other venders utilize multiple hydraulic auxilary outputs (ie 2-3 outlets) controlled by an electric selenoid for each output. Then I could run attachments with multiple sets of hydraulics rather than having a special valve or 7 pin connector? For example, a dozer blade needs to angle,tilt etc. Same with a V snow plow and angle broom.
I realize that not all cylinders could not be run at once.

 

[UFM82]

It's mostly a matter of cost and also a matter of complexity. Cost is the biggest factor. Why add multiple tube lines, hoses, unions and fititngs on the machine itself when it's so much easier to simply plumb the attachment with them? Instead of 40' of lines in the machine, you have 5' of line on the attachment. Add the solenoid on the attachment instead of on the machine and you keep the cost of the base unit down. Instead of having multiple outlets on the machine, one line is run to the attachment and then the multiple circuits are utilized. Much cleaner, simpler, cheaper and easier to access.

Bobcats in the past did utilize multiple auxiliary circuits. They ran secondary auxiliaries for attachments that angled or side-shifted and they also had rear auxiliary hydraulics for outriggers. It added a lot of lines under the cab and provided more places for leaks to occur. It also made servicing any problems tougher as it restricted access. I'm very glad they do it the way they do it now- much simpler.

The 7 pin and the 14 pin can be utilized on most attachments with a T-harness that adapts each to another. Why does Bobcat do it that way? Lord I wish I knew. That has been a major source of confusion over the years as to which machine can run what attachment and what harness you need and blah, blah, blah. It gets aggravating when you try to order the correct stuff and it's wrong, despite factory help. My guess is that they find a way to streamline things without taking the past into account. It certainly makes my job a little tougher. What's the difference? 7 pins of course.

 

[radman1]

I probably didn't present my question well. Instead of mulitple lines and outlets, they could have made it with a single set of hydraulic lines to a bank of electric selenoids with 2-4 outlets. Each outlet controlled individually by an electric diverter switch in the cab and possibly with a code or pin attachment to recognize that attachment to run the various functions. For example, punch in code A-1 and it would recognize that as a 6 way dozer blade. A-2 is code for V plow. Then the hand controls or whatever function in the cab could control the proper hydraulic outlet. It could be an option on skid steers to keep the cost down. Probably wouldn't be that difficult to add outlets later if needed. The way it is now, each attachment with more than one function requires its own electric selenoid on the attachment for each funtion. To me it drives up the cost of each attachment especially if I have 3 different attachments each with there own selenoid rather than just one on the skid steer. I stated this to a product specialist at a company once, and he said with a smile "Then you could use anyone's attachment." I said maybe more people would want your skid steer because it is more versitile with other equipment. Also, more people may now buy your attachments to use on another skid steer instead of a proprietory pin attachment requirement. More unique attachments with 2-4 functions could be devised for special uses without each having a costly selenoid. Maybe I could now use my tilt-tatch with a grapple bucket, snow blade, angle broom, pallet forks etc. To me, the industry has it backwards.

I can see how your method would have less hoses running to the attachment. However, each selenoid on the attachment costs much more than the extra hydraulic hoses.

 

[y3ll0w]

What if you enter the wrong code accidently and you have too much flow on a particular circuit? Any savings that may be gained by your design would be lost in damages to the attachment or machine don't ya think?

 

[radman1]

What if you enter the wrong code accidently and you have too much flow on a particular circuit? Any savings that may be gained by your design would be lost in damages to the attachment or machine don't ya think?

I would see the code/key as a means to determine which controls/switches in the cab would operate a particular set of hydraulics or function. I would imagine flow restrictors in the hoses to limit flow to cylinders requiring slow flow rates. My construction grapple, tilt-tatch and snow blade have these in place already when I bought them. 21 gal/min is way to fast for a small cylinder connected to my Bobcat 873. My 873 has hand contols with various switches and knobs to run different funtions but I do not have the 7 or 14 pin connectors so most of them are not utilized. Flow restrictors only cost a few bucks. Smaller diameter hoses could also restrict flow.

 

[UFM82]

You are describing what Bobcat puts into practice. By using our ACD (attachment control device, or attachment control kit), you are in effect doing exactly what you are saying. However, instead of putting all the solenoids and lines on the machine, they are on the attachment. If the attachment has multiple functions and requires an input from the machine to function, the machine already does that for you automatically. If you plug in a soil conditioner that angles, the appropriate switch on the stick works. If you plug in a stump grinder, which has 3 functions, (main for the disc, swing and telescope) the computer knows that and the appropriate switches work. For a concrete planer it's the same thing- multiple functions and multiple switches. By having the computer recognize the attachment, it eliminates that mistaken attachment issue brought up by y3llow. Again, it's all about cost. The formula is to design a unit that does what people want it to do and to do it the best price. Bobcat will tell you up front that they can do things on machines that could dramatically ease SOME people's lives but the cost of the product would have to go up, causing other people to pay more.

 

[y3ll0w]

Flow restrictors only cost a few bucks. Smaller diameter hoses could also restrict flow.

Where can you buy flow restrictors?