Independant PTO
- Thread starter sw99
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davesl708
Elite Member
It is nice. I think it is becoming standard if it is not already.
RoyJackson
Rest in Peace
- Joined
- Nov 17, 2001
- Messages
- 23,144
- Location
- Bethel, Vermont
- Tractor
- John Deere 4052R Cab,, Deere 855D UTV, Z920A Zero Turn Mower and assorted implements
Independent PTO is on most newer tractors...some older designs (like the Deere 3005) still use live PTO
Texasmark
Elite Member
- Joined
- Apr 24, 2012
- Messages
- 3,703
- Location
- N. Texas
- Tractor
- Ford: '88 3910 Series II, '80 3600, '65 3000; '07 6530C Branson with FEL, 2020 LS MT225S. Case-IH 395 and 895 with cab. All Diesels
Here's what I found with Branson:
6530 has 2 published PTOs:
1. "Independent" which is electrically controlled and totally "Independent" of main tractor moving drive train. It is very nice but there are times when another type works better for me. The Branson also has an "Automatic PTO" function whereby if the PTO is ON, when you lift the implement, it stops the PTO and reengages it when you drop the implement. Main thing here is for an implement, like a rotary mower that has power removed as long as it is in the transport position....I never use this function because when I engage my PTO, I set my throttle to idle to minimize the shock load on the PTO engagement discs.
2. "Live" and I don't know the origin of that name of 50 years ago, but it functions with the clutch and the "Independent"switch. In this switch position, if you push in the clutch you can disengage the Independent PTO, releasing returns it. You are using the same set of discs, just sensitive to clutch position and this is sensitive to the automatic function also .
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The original Live PTO like is on my Ford 3000 uses 2 clutch discs operating against the flywheel and operates: When the clutch pedal is all the way out, both PTO and tractor ground movement....if in gear..... are engaged if the PTO activation lever is engaged. As you push down on the clutch pedal (approximately half pedal), the clutch disc that provides for ground movement disengages the transmission from the flywheel and you stop rolling but the PTO remains active.
When you continue on down with the pedal, near the bottom of it's range, the PTO drive clutch disconnects also and everything but the engine stops. One of the main problems with this double clutch operation is getting the clutches lined up properly when installing so that the clutch pedal travel works as designed. On these older tractors you only have one type of PTO. However, if you are digging post holes and are in a line and needing to wallow out a crooked hole, this clutch is perfect for that.
Today's version is a lot simpler clutch and just uses the parts involved in the Independent.
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2400 Has Transmission PTO with internal overrun clutch: Transmission PTO is a mechanically operated PTO that drives off the tractor transmission output shaft. If the PTO manual lever is engaged, when the output shaft of the transmission moves, like in any gear other than N, the PTO shaft rotates.
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This type was first used by Ferguson and then Ford (to name a couple......may have been part of Fergie's 3 point patent) but had a serious drawback for if you were operating an implement which stored kinetic energy......like a rotating cutter, with the drive line locked together, the rotating blade would keep the tractor locked in whatever gear it was in and it would drive the tractor into a fence, into a barn, over a cliff or what have you.
So, an overrun clutch was added as an aftermarket alternative whereby if the load rpms were higher than the transmission output shaft rpms, the clutch would disengage the load (audible clicking noise as it bounced over the internal saw tooth) and allow the tractor to stop and/or be shifted, or whatever the operated had to do as the blade slowly came to the rpms of the drive shaft.
The problem with this clutch was wearout, people forgetting to grease them, and slop in the drive line adding to the vibrations, especially in turns.
-------------------
The Branson Tranny PTO on the manually shifted 2400 contains an internal overrun clutch, cooled and lubricated by the trans/hyd/diff fluid and is a dream...no vibration and so quiet you can hardly hear it.
I don't have a hydrostatic 2400H. Since I didn't buy mine for close work requiring a hydro shifting transmission, I don't have one, so I don't know.
6530 has 2 published PTOs:
1. "Independent" which is electrically controlled and totally "Independent" of main tractor moving drive train. It is very nice but there are times when another type works better for me. The Branson also has an "Automatic PTO" function whereby if the PTO is ON, when you lift the implement, it stops the PTO and reengages it when you drop the implement. Main thing here is for an implement, like a rotary mower that has power removed as long as it is in the transport position....I never use this function because when I engage my PTO, I set my throttle to idle to minimize the shock load on the PTO engagement discs.
2. "Live" and I don't know the origin of that name of 50 years ago, but it functions with the clutch and the "Independent"switch. In this switch position, if you push in the clutch you can disengage the Independent PTO, releasing returns it. You are using the same set of discs, just sensitive to clutch position and this is sensitive to the automatic function also .
---------------------------
The original Live PTO like is on my Ford 3000 uses 2 clutch discs operating against the flywheel and operates: When the clutch pedal is all the way out, both PTO and tractor ground movement....if in gear..... are engaged if the PTO activation lever is engaged. As you push down on the clutch pedal (approximately half pedal), the clutch disc that provides for ground movement disengages the transmission from the flywheel and you stop rolling but the PTO remains active.
When you continue on down with the pedal, near the bottom of it's range, the PTO drive clutch disconnects also and everything but the engine stops. One of the main problems with this double clutch operation is getting the clutches lined up properly when installing so that the clutch pedal travel works as designed. On these older tractors you only have one type of PTO. However, if you are digging post holes and are in a line and needing to wallow out a crooked hole, this clutch is perfect for that.
Today's version is a lot simpler clutch and just uses the parts involved in the Independent.
---------------------------------
2400 Has Transmission PTO with internal overrun clutch: Transmission PTO is a mechanically operated PTO that drives off the tractor transmission output shaft. If the PTO manual lever is engaged, when the output shaft of the transmission moves, like in any gear other than N, the PTO shaft rotates.
----------------------------------------------------
This type was first used by Ferguson and then Ford (to name a couple......may have been part of Fergie's 3 point patent) but had a serious drawback for if you were operating an implement which stored kinetic energy......like a rotating cutter, with the drive line locked together, the rotating blade would keep the tractor locked in whatever gear it was in and it would drive the tractor into a fence, into a barn, over a cliff or what have you.
So, an overrun clutch was added as an aftermarket alternative whereby if the load rpms were higher than the transmission output shaft rpms, the clutch would disengage the load (audible clicking noise as it bounced over the internal saw tooth) and allow the tractor to stop and/or be shifted, or whatever the operated had to do as the blade slowly came to the rpms of the drive shaft.
The problem with this clutch was wearout, people forgetting to grease them, and slop in the drive line adding to the vibrations, especially in turns.
-------------------
The Branson Tranny PTO on the manually shifted 2400 contains an internal overrun clutch, cooled and lubricated by the trans/hyd/diff fluid and is a dream...no vibration and so quiet you can hardly hear it.
I don't have a hydrostatic 2400H. Since I didn't buy mine for close work requiring a hydro shifting transmission, I don't have one, so I don't know.
