International 574 wont start?

Rio_Grande · Dec 26, 2012

I have a 574 that will crank for a few seconds then the starter will stop cranking and whistle. In the past it has done this but charging the battery would solve it. This time when I tried to start it the battery would barely crank it. I tried to charge the battery but no dice. So I replaced it with a big industrial battery. Got home installed the battery and got the same thing with it cranking for a few seconds then whine. The heater was plugged in so the starter shouldn't have a lot of resistance. Block is slightly warm to the touch. I put the charger on the battery I will clean the connections and give it another shot in the morning. Anything I am missing? The starter was rebuilt two years ago but has not been used much since.

Rio_Grande · Dec 26, 2012

Well, noticed the head was cold as the outside temp. Checked the coolant and it was a gallon low, That is really unusual so I toped it back off and will watch for leaks. This thing is starting to worry me.

hbhhay101 · Dec 26, 2012

Rio_Grande said:
I have a 574 that will crank for a few seconds then the starter will stop cranking and whistle. In the past it has done this but charging the battery would solve it. This time when I tried to start it the battery would barely crank it. I tried to charge the battery but no dice. So I replaced it with a big industrial battery. Got home installed the battery and got the same thing with it cranking for a few seconds then whine. The heater was plugged in so the starter shouldn't have a lot of resistance. Block is slightly warm to the touch. I put the charger on the battery I will clean the connections and give it another shot in the morning. Anything I am missing? The starter was rebuilt two years ago but has not been used much since.

Have you checked your battery connections? Do you need to shim your starter?If your cables are in bad shape,this could happen.

Rio_Grande · Dec 26, 2012

Replaced the cables when the starter was rebuilt, I cleaned the connections a bit ago and no better. I think tomorrow I have another new hot lead I will swap onto it and clean everything good. This battery is new and shouldn't be an issue. I put it on a charger just in case.

Rio_Grande · Dec 26, 2012

Spent a little more time on it in the 20 deg weather, starting to lean towards a starter problem. Shame, I paid 80.00 last time to get this thing working. Maybee I should have bought a new one.

Jerry/MT · Dec 26, 2012

Rio_Grande said:
I have a 574 that will crank for a few seconds then the starter will stop cranking and whistle. In the past it has done this but charging the battery would solve it. This time when I tried to start it the battery would barely crank it. I tried to charge the battery but no dice. So I replaced it with a big industrial battery. Got home installed the battery and got the same thing with it cranking for a few seconds then whine. The heater was plugged in so the starter shouldn't have a lot of resistance. Block is slightly warm to the touch. I put the charger on the battery I will clean the connections and give it another shot in the morning. Anything I am missing? The starter was rebuilt two years ago but has not been used much since.

If you starter is cranking and then stops cranking and is making a whiring noise and the engine is not cranking over, the starter drive is most likely the problem. Try using jumpers from the battery to the starter and see if that makes any difference. If it does, the cables are the problem.

If it doesn't you'll have to remove the starter and check out the drive. Extend the drive gear and place a block of wood in to trap the drive gear. Then, using jumpers from the battery to the starter engage the starter. If the starter doesn't move and you hear a huming sound, the drive is good. Do this several times because you say that it turns the engine and then stops. If the drive is bad, you'll hear a whirring noise as the drive slips. if that's the case, replace the drive.

Some times the solenoid contacts get crudded up an burned and have a high reistance. Disassemble the solenoid and see if you can clean the contacts.

Rio_Grande · Dec 27, 2012

I have had to replacethe solenoid 2 times before. I had forgotten about it. I will give it a shot. I will try your suggestions tomorrow. see where I end up. The whining noise is hard to describe. it is not the same sound as when a bendix gets weak and the started dosent enguage. this is more of a bomb is going to xplode whine. Like you hear in rhw movies. The starter is definately still enguaged when it stops turning. to me it is like a weak starter. it has the pwer to enguage and turn a bit but not to keep turning it. I just gotta figure out why.

sox3 · Dec 27, 2012

I would look to see where the cooling fluid is leaking. If its getting into a cylinder that would cause a liquid lock and stop the engine from cranking
and the whistle would be the pressure bleeding off. just my .02

Jerry/MT · Dec 27, 2012

Rio_Grande said:
I have had to replacethe solenoid 2 times before. I had forgotten about it. I will give it a shot. I will try your suggestions tomorrow. see where I end up. The whining noise is hard to describe. it is not the same sound as when a bendix gets weak and the started dosent enguage. this is more of a bomb is going to xplode whine. Like you hear in rhw movies. The starter is definately still enguaged when it stops turning. to me it is like a weak starter. it has the pwer to enguage and turn a bit but not to keep turning it. I just gotta figure out why.

Check the brushes in the starter and clean up the commutator, too.

Rio_Grande · Dec 27, 2012

Went out this morning and it fired right up. But later this evening no dice but it seems to. Be cranking pretty good but it craps out quickly. Still can't find the water leak. I lost about a quart overnight. But attribute some of that to air. My exhaust is dry. But that coolant has to be going somewhere.

sox3 · Dec 27, 2012

Is it leaking into the oil?

Rio_Grande · Dec 27, 2012

Nothing in the oil as of yesterday. I will check it again.

Rio_Grande · Dec 27, 2012

After warming up with the block heater since 5pm fired right up tonight at 1015pm everything operated fine. Checked the oil after and it looked normal. Still low on antifreeze. I am going to put it in the shop tomorrow night and see if it is dripping or get the hood off.

Rio_Grande · Dec 31, 2012

Hasn't started since last post back to the same problem.

Replaced the power wire because I already had a new one. No change. Cleaned all connections no change. Pretty much down to the starter. The only weird thing is I have 12.6v at the battery. When I crank it drops but then when I stop it goes back to 12.6 never checked that before, not sure what it means.

Jerry/MT · Dec 31, 2012

Rio_Grande said:
Hasn't started since last post back to the same problem.

Replaced the power wire because I already had a new one. No change. Cleaned all connections no change. Pretty much down to the starter. The only weird thing is I have 12.6v at the battery. When I crank it drops but then when I stop it goes back to 12.6 never checked that before, not sure what it means.

When you crank the starter, the voltage should not drop below ~9V . It should drop, but not below ~9V. have you checked the chasis ground and made sure it's tight and not corroded?

sox3 · Dec 31, 2012

If it drops to the 9v or below quickly you may have a bad cell in the battery. You didn't post what it falls to.

Rio_Grande · Dec 31, 2012

Yes I cleaned it. The battery is brand new last week industrial battery. Not saying it isint bad.

Rio_Grande · Dec 31, 2012

What makes no sense is when it starts it takes right off otherwise it draggs. I was concerned there might be a short in the starter.

sox3 · Dec 31, 2012

Need to put an amp meter on it to see how much its drawing. Starter could be bad, engine could be binding.

Rio_Grande · Jan 27, 2015

2 years later and I still have basically the same issue. I am replacing the key switch as I messed mine up yesterday. Since the last post I have taken the starter apart and cleaned it but no obvious issues observed. I put it on to charge to get a full charge, plugged in the block heater. 3 hours later it cranked right up. I wasn't ready to use it at the time, I had to go get my pallet forks from another farm. Did that today and after about two hours on the battery charger to top it off during which time the block heater was unplugged, however it had been charging all night, the engine cranked for a short burst then starter stalled again. No whine this time. I am betting this tractor hasn't ran 10 times since the last post all in warm weather.

If it were warm this thing would fire right up. I picked up a block heater for it, but it's never convienient to install when it's 20 deg.