Jump starting Positive Ground

[heron]

I'm about to acquire my grandfathers 1955 Allis Chalmers HD5 delivered next week. The dozer had a 6 volt system but my father has replaced it with a 12V battery and removes the battery when not in use. Problem is when it gets here the battery may not be charged enough to start the dozer on the flatbed.
Anyone know how to properly jump this 12V from my truck? I'm thinking I would have to go pos terminal to pos terminal and negative to negative regardless of configuration but then I worry about blowing up my battery or my computer in my truck...Any ideas?

 

[Diamondpilot]

We jump positive ground Ford Tractors and Case Dozer all the time. The best thing to do is get the battery charged if possible but if you must simply hook up the cables as normal to your truck and then put the red positive one on the equipments chassis (ground) and the black negative on the equipments battery to the correct terminal on the battery.

Chris

 

[amigauser]

Reverse the polarity of the charger/jump vehicle's cables at the positive ground tractor. (Black on Positive-Red on Negative terminals. Do not let any metal touch between either vehicle

 

[Stonehaller]

Your thinking is correct. Connect positive from your truck battery to positive of the dozer battery and negative to negative of each battery. Whether the dozer is positive or negative ground, you are safe if you make your connections directly to the battery terminals, + to + and - to -. As amigauser says, do not let any part of your truck touch the trailer or dozer just in case the dozer is positive ground.

 

[heron]

Reverse the polarity of the charger/jump vehicle's cables at the positive ground tractor. (Black on Positive-Red on Negative terminals. Do not let any metal touch between either vehicle

This dozer is coming from South Windsor.
Can you be more specific? I've heard horror stories of tops of batteries being blown off and I do remember doing it with my dad about 30 years ago but I've forgotten since then... I remember hooking to the starter directly but I want to be very careful.
I probably will end up using one of those mobile jump packs so do I hook the positive side of the jump pack up to the negative terminal of the battery in the dozer and the negative lead from the jump pack to the positive side of the battery in the dozer?

 

[heron]

Your thinking is correct. Connect positive from your truck battery to positive of the dozer battery and negative to negative of each battery. Whether the dozer is positive or negative ground, you are safe if you make your connections directly to the battery terminals, + to + and - to -. As amigauser says, do not let any part of your truck touch the trailer or dozer just in case the dozer is positive ground.

The dozer is a positive ground for sure. It is an old 6V system. Not sure how my dad did it but he simply put in a 12V battery. I don't think the generator can charge it but he never uses the dozer on a daily basis so he just takes out the battery and recharges it each time he uses the dozer.

 

[jinman]

You may find that using jumper cables on a jumper battery pack or even from your truck is unsatisfactory. I suspect your father actually installed a 12v battery and hooked up the battery cables directly to its posts. Starting any diesel takes a lot of current, especially if you have glowplugs to cycle. The jumper cable alligator clips may become very hot or arc and lose contact. It would be best to remove your battery from your vehicle and install it in the dozer long enough to get it going, then remove the battery and put it back into your truck. From your description, that's what your father did.

 

[GPintheMitten]

I probably will end up using one of those mobile jump packs so do I hook the positive side of the jump pack up to the negative terminal of the battery in the dozer and the negative lead from the jump pack to the positive side of the battery in the dozer?

NO.

You hook positive to positive and negative to negative, regardless of the grounding on the dozer.

 

[heron]

NO.

You hook positive to positive and negative to negative, regardless of the grounding on the dozer.

Okay, is this the best way to do it? I think I remember my dad running the positive jumper from his truck and clipping it on the track and then running the negative jumper right to the starter. Then we'd fire it up from the seat.
Seems like if I ran the positive jumper to the track of the dozer it would blow my battery to smitherines...This stuff gets sooo confusing. I just remember my dad complaining that one time he blew the top of one of the batteries off... I don't need this to happen when the dozer is 3' up on a flatbed and the driver is waiting for me to unload it...

 

[TheKid]

Okay, is this the best way to do it? I think I remember my dad running the positive jumper from his truck and clipping it on the track and then running the negative jumper right to the starter. Then we'd fire it up from the seat.
Seems like if I ran the positive jumper to the track of the dozer it would blow my battery to smitherines...This stuff gets sooo confusing. I just remember my dad complaining that one time he blew the top of one of the batteries off... I don't need this to happen when the dozer is 3' up on a flatbed and the driver is waiting for me to unload it...

I have a 1960 MGA that is positive ground and have jumped it several times. You have 2 optiions. Direct connect from one battery to the other. Pos to pos (red) and neg to neg (black). Just like you would connect it to jump start any other vehicle. The other is pos (red) on the truck battery to the frame or track of the dozer (red) which is positive on the dozer because of the reverse grounding, and then neg (black) from truck battery to neg (black) on dozer battery.

 

[J_J]

Connecting cable ends to both batteries is a safety hazard. Yea, I know some of you do it all the time. I have done the bumper to bumper thing also, when the cables were not long enough The reason that you only connect one jumper to the battery being charged, is to prevent a spark lighting off the hyd gas with high amp charging. The other cable end goes to chassis ground.

 

[heron]

I have a 1960 MGA that is positive ground and have jumped it several times. You have 2 optiions. Direct connect from one battery to the other. Pos to pos (red) and neg to neg (black). Just like you would connect it to jump start any other vehicle. The other is pos (red) on the truck battery to the frame or track of the dozer (red) which is positive on the dozer because of the reverse grounding, and then neg (black) from truck battery to neg (black) on dozer battery.

Is there an order to how to hook them up...ie pos jumper from truck battery to positive on dozer battery then negative on dozer to negative on truck...?

 

[heron]

Connecting cable ends to both batteries is a safety hazard. Yea, I know some of you do it all the time. I have done the bumper to bumper thing also, when the cables were not long enough The reason that you only connect one jumper to the battery being charged, is to prevent a spark lighting off the hyd gas with high amp charging. The other cable end goes to chassis ground.

Can you be more specific?

ie.. put the positive jumper cable hooked to the pos. side of the battery in my truck on the chasis of the dozer. Then hook the negative jumper from the negative pole of the truck battery to the negative pole of the dozer battery...?

If this is correct which order do you do it in?

 

[kenstrac]

Can you be more specific?

ie.. put the positive jumper cable hooked to the pos. side of the battery in my truck on the chasis of the dozer. Then hook the negative jumper from the negative pole of the truck battery to the negative pole of the dozer battery...?

If this is correct which order do you do it in?

FIRST hook up neg from truck bat. to neg on dozer bat.
SECOND hook pos. from truck bat. to dozer frame
Start dozer disconect in reverse order.
ENJOY

 

[J_J]

Right you are.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Reverse the polarity of the charger/jump vehicle's cables at the positive ground tractor. (Black on Positive-Red on Negative terminals. Do not let any metal touch between either vehicle

No. NO. You'll melt jumper cables and make all kinds of nasty things happen. Black still goes to negative and red still goes to positive. The only difference is that positive can be the ground in the dozer.

In every charging scenario, you connect positive to positive and negative to negative. (Not doing this will cause problems, no matter what.)
In every jump start scenario, you connect to the battery first and ground last (Not doing this has some potential to maybe cause exploding batteries).

Here's my proposed sequence... Dozer side Black to the dozer's battery negative. Truck side red to the truck's battery positive. Truck side black to truck ground, Dozer side Red to dozer ground. Rev your truck engine for a minute to get some juice in the dozer battery and then fire up the dozer.

If you use a jumper pack, then still go black to negative and red to positive. Black goes to the battery negative terminal and positive goes to ground (because this is a positive ground system).

 

[heron]

No. NO. You'll melt jumper cables and make all kinds of nasty things happen. Black still goes to negative and red still goes to positive. The only difference is that positive can be the ground in the dozer.

In every charging scenario, you connect positive to positive and negative to negative. (Not doing this will cause problems, no matter what.)
In every jump start scenario, you connect to the battery first and ground last (Not doing this has some potential to maybe cause exploding batteries).

Here's my proposed sequence... Dozer side Black to the dozer's battery negative. Truck side red to the truck's battery positive. Truck side black to truck ground, Dozer side Red to dozer ground. Rev your truck engine for a minute to get some juice in the dozer battery and then fire up the dozer.

If you use a jumper pack, then still go black to negative and red to positive. Black goes to the battery negative terminal and positive goes to ground (because this is a positive ground system).

Okay, so I'll probably be using a jumper pack so simply put the black cable of the jumper pack to the ground(black) on the 12V battery in the dozer, then put the red of the jumper pack to the frame of the dozer....? Sound right? It is really amazing how many different scenarios I've heard with this procedure...

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Okay, so I'll probably be using a jumper pack so simply put the black cable of the jumper pack to the ground(black) on the 12V battery in the dozer, then put the red of the jumper pack to the frame of the dozer....? Sound right? It is really amazing how many different scenarios I've heard with this procedure...

Nearly all of the scenarios get you the same result, they're just said in different words.

Black goes to the negative battery terminal (which is not the ground in this case), and red goes to Positive (which is ground in this case). The most important this is that negative goes to negative and positive goes to positive. The negative terminal of the battery may or may not be black. Be sure and actually read the battery to know which is negative and which is positive.

 

[Soundguy]

Okay, is this the best way to do it? I think I remember my dad running the positive jumper from his truck and clipping it on the track and then running the negative jumper right to the starter. Then we'd fire it up from the seat.
Seems like if I ran the positive jumper to the track of the dozer it would blow my battery to smitherines...This stuff gets sooo confusing. I just remember my dad complaining that one time he blew the top of one of the batteries off... I don't need this to happen when the dozer is 3' up on a flatbed and the driver is waiting for me to unload it...

You are making this too hard.. and amigauser is trying to blow up your battery.

When jumping like voltages.. IE.. jumping 6v with 6v, and jumping 12v with 12v, JUST MATCH THE POLARITIES.. no magic.. no incantations or hand gestures needed.. .. positive to positive, negative to negative.


You can jump a 6v setup from 12v IF a couple things are done. 1, the 6v unit must have a magneto, or have enough juice in it's 6v battery to run the ignition, and 2, you jumper straight from the 12v bat to the 6v starter.. this entails starting the tractor while not on it.. so precautions must be made to prevent it starting in gear.. etc.

again.. + to + and - to - ALWAYS!!!

soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

Okay, so I'll probably be using a jumper pack so simply put the black cable of the jumper pack to the ground(black) on the 12V battery in the dozer, then put the red of the jumper pack to the frame of the dozer....? Sound right? It is really amazing how many different scenarios I've heard with this procedure...

good luck on the jumper pack! not alot of CCA there.

When I go to a tractor show.. I take a spare 12v HD battery with me on a hand cart.. I have a set of jumper cables made up with jump cable son one end, and battery clamps onthe other.. good heavy 1/0 cables... shorter the better.. as you can set the battery up on a hood or somewhere close to the other battery or starter.

some of these machines have huge batteries.. and if they are low, your jumper battery may be pulled way down with the load of the starter AND the low main battery. in that case.. hookup the low battery to your vehicle with jump cables and let her charge 20 minutes while you get a cup of coffee.. it will only be a flash charge.. but should help along with the booster pack. I also like to shut my truck off during a jump boost.

IE.. jumpe rit.. let charge a few minutes, then shut truck off to protect alternator and other electronics while the other vehicle starts.

soundguy